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Old 01.10.2018, 19:59
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Drowning in Plastic

Tonight, BBC1, 8.30, eg, 9.30 Swiss time.
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Old 01.10.2018, 21:31
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

Starting now - really, please, watch it.
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Old 01.10.2018, 22:28
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

Once youíve topped up your white guilt you can feel smug that you live in Switzerland where virtually all plastic is either recycled or incinerated
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Old 02.10.2018, 02:07
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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Once youíve topped up your white guilt you can feel smug that you live in Switzerland where virtually all plastic is either recycled or incinerated
Sometimes one wishes the Swiss were more like British expats and move to the other countries and tell them to get.that.sorted!
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Old 02.10.2018, 09:03
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

I am genuinely happy for people worried about plastic, global warming and all that crap. It means they are so high on Maslow's pyramide that Maslow himself didn't even envision such a level. I guess next level of concern is the levels of hydrogen on Jupiter
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Old 02.10.2018, 09:24
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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Once youíve topped up your white guilt you can feel smug that you live in Switzerland where virtually all plastic is either recycled or incinerated
Except the billions of bits of micro plastic you can't see every time synthetic clothes are washed.

Or drive your car.

Dutifully chucking your PET bottles in the supermarket recycling bin is just a token gesture.
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Old 02.10.2018, 09:28
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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Except the billions of bits of micro plastic you can't see every time synthetic clothes are washed.

Or drive your car.

Dutifully chucking your PET bottles in the supermarket recycling bin is just a token gesture.
And AFAIK quite a lot of plastics can't actually be recycled. But, whatevs...
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Old 02.10.2018, 09:33
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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And AFAIK quite a lot of plastics can't actually be recycled. But, whatevs...
It's so difficult to avoid plastic. It's everywhere you look.
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Old 02.10.2018, 09:36
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

Swiss retailers should be required to take back every bit of their packaging. Plastic, paper, glass, cardboard, everything. And require to reuse or recycle.

Yes it will cost me at the till, but it is already costing me in the harm to the environment.

The only way the producers will reduce their waste is if their Big Customers demand it. That isnít you and me itís Migros, Coop, Aldi, Liddle etc.
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Old 02.10.2018, 09:41
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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Swiss retailers should be required to take back every bit of their packaging. Plastic, paper, glass, cardboard, everything. And require to reuse or recycle.

Yes it will cost me at the till, but it is already costing me in the harm to the environment.

The only way the producers will reduce their waste is if their Big Customers demand it. That isn’t you and me it’s Migros, Coop, Aldi, Liddle etc.
They are, and have been for at least as long as I've been here

Usually there are small counters with bins underneath, just beyond the cash desks where you see customers busily stripping the outer packaging off their shopping and shoving it in the containers. The containers are normally behind small cabinet doors with the picture of a rubbish bag on them.

I've not seen them take glass back, though, but that's not an epic task to dispose of anyway.
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Old 02.10.2018, 09:43
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

1970's - New ice age
1980's - Ozone Layer
Early 1990's - Acid Rain
Late 1990's - Global Warming
2000's - "Climate Change"
2018 - Ocean Plastics

I'm starting to see a pattern here.
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Old 02.10.2018, 09:44
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

Never forget George Carlin:
Weíre so self-important. Everybodyís going to save something now. ďSave the trees, save the bees, save the whales, save those snails.Ē And the greatest arrogance of all: save the planet. Save the planet, we donít even know how to take care of ourselves yet. Iím tired of this shit. Iím tired of f-ing Earth Day. Iím tired of these self-righteous environmentalists, these white, bourgeois liberals who think the only thing wrong with this country is that there arenít enough bicycle paths. People trying to make the world safe for Volvos. Besides, environmentalists donít give a shit about the planet. Not in the abstract they donít. You know what theyíre interested in? A clean place to live. Their own habitat. Theyíre worried that some day in the future they might be personally inconvenienced. Narrow, unenlightened self-interest doesnít impress me.
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Old 02.10.2018, 09:45
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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Except the billions of bits of micro plastic you can't see every time synthetic clothes are washed.
I don't wear synthetic clothes.
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Old 02.10.2018, 09:46
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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1970's - New ice age
1980's - Ozone Layer
Early 1990's - Acid Rain
Late 1990's - Global Warming
2000's - "Climate Change"
2018 - Ocean Plastics

I'm starting to see a pattern here.
Watermelons, anyone?
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Old 02.10.2018, 09:48
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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You know what theyíre interested in? A clean place to live. Their own habitat. Theyíre worried that some day in the future they might be personally inconvenienced. Narrow, unenlightened self-interest doesnít impress me.
That sounds perfectly reasonable to me. I much prefer the clean air of the Alps to the coal-smoke heavy air of 1970s Cannock. Wouldn't anybody want the same?
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Old 02.10.2018, 09:50
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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That sounds perfectly reasonable to me. I much prefer the clean air of the Alps to the coal-smoke heavy air of 1970s Cannock. Wouldn't anybody want the same?
yes exactly, so why should I be bothered that a Chinese guy is throwing 4x more plastic than me in the Chinese sea? I care about things I can influence, I let all the preposterous hipsters worry about global warming and stuff. It will really help you know.
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Old 02.10.2018, 09:54
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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Narrow, unenlightened self-interest doesn’t impress me.

Imagine if everyone had that. We'd live in the Earth equivalent of my Nan's front parlour.

Take your shoes off and don't drop crumbs on the carpet but on a global scale.
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Old 02.10.2018, 10:02
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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Imagine if everyone had that. We'd live in the Earth equivalent of my Nan's front parlour.

Take your shoes off and don't drop crumbs on the carpet but on a global scale.
I honestly have no idea what you just said. English please?
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Old 02.10.2018, 10:07
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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I honestly have no idea what you just said. English please?
Well, I was suggesting that if EVERYONE had a bit of that "self interest" in their own environment the world would be in a better state.

Basically clean up your own shit and just use what you need.

Hope that's good enough Engrish...
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Old 02.10.2018, 10:10
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

Let me help you with that pattern: the ozone layer has been really weakened and the increased green house effect is the source of the climate change. Its happening and it is a fact. I find it bizarre that people still debate about it, what we should debate about are the necessary next steps. the key problem is that most people in the governments are men and women in their 50s... and it seems to be human nature to have more short term survival instincts than the capability to plan ahead for generations.


Plastic: I love the smugness of the thread so far. Its all the bloody Asians dumping it in the Ocean, isn't it? We are all so awesome at recycling and stuff... The thing is that this plastic comes from the one region of the planet where we put the vast majority of our factories to. That microplastic might come from a drinking straw used by some Indonesian, it might just as well come from some waste from a factory making toys for Switzerland. And recycling meant for most of the world till the beginning of this year that they sold their plastic trash to China. Now the Chinese decided to not buy everyones crap anymore and the stuff is piling high in the west. Back then did people pay for recycling plastic as a resource, now you can get paid to accept it.


I lived five years in South East Asia and spend most of my weekends scuba diving. Its not some myth, the plastic trash is absolutely visible as soon as you enter the ocean. Ive been to some of the most remote places imaginable and it was full of trash that clearly wasn't produced there. Anyone who thinks that this is some local problem is naÔve.
Two facts:
- over 50% of all plastic ever made was produced since 2002
- about three billion humans currently rely on fish as their main source of protein.


It really does not take much to see the problem.
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