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Old 22.09.2019, 19:15
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Privilege

It seems like every week that some notable or other is having his youthful (or not so youthful) follies exposed. If it's not wearing blackface to parties, it's dressing as a nazi, sexual abuse or unhygienic practices with farmyard animals.

Now, this is the thing I don't get. I don't think I'm particularly special. Like most of us, I had a blast in my late teens and twenties. To be honest, I'm glad it all happened long before cellphone cameras and facebook. But never - not once - was I ever even tempted to rape a sleeping woman, or dress up as a "south sea savage", or do things to a pig's head. It just wasn't how our crowd - otherwise as degenerate and wasted as any other - operated.

So what is it with the likes of Kavanagh and Trudeau? What do they all have in common?

The only thing I can think of is privilege: because of who they are, because of what they are, they didn't have to worry about the consequences of their actions... at least, not until the chickens came home to roost in a new age of (not entirely unwelcome) social media-fuelled puritanism.

So what do you think? Why are so many of our "betters" such revolting human beings?
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Old 22.09.2019, 19:20
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Re: Privilege

I think they don't consider it really as revolting or such, they are just to far apart from everyday live and average society to realise that what they do is not socially acceptable.
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Old 22.09.2019, 19:37
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Re: Privilege

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So what is it with the likes of Kavanagh and Trudeau? What do they all have in common?
Behaving like Jeremy Kyle guests when they have the money and knowledge to know better, but that little bit of depravity still gets the better of them. The thing is that because they have a public profile you get to hear about them and not the guy who did x, y and z for four cans of Stella.
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Old 22.09.2019, 19:42
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Re: Privilege

I've counted my privileges. White. Middle class. Rich. From Yorkshire. Male. Ginger.

That's a 6 - I'm perfect.
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Old 22.09.2019, 20:02
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Re: Privilege

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So what do you think? Why are so many of our "betters" such revolting human beings?
Because they got caught at it.

Tom
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Old 22.09.2019, 20:08
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Re: Privilege

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I've counted my privileges. White. Middle class. Rich. From Yorkshire. Male. Ginger.
White. Working class. Not rich. From Lancashire. Female. L'Oreal Excellence 8.3.

What's my score?
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Old 22.09.2019, 20:11
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Re: Privilege

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White. Working class. Not rich. From Lancashire. Female. L'Oreal Excellence 8.3.

What's my score?
Well if coming from Yorkshire gets a positive point, you must get triple coming from Lancashire.
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Old 22.09.2019, 20:17
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Re: Privilege

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Why are so many of our "betters" such revolting human beings?
Social media will reveal all the hypocrites. It shows how high the standard is to be truly morally superior.
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Old 22.09.2019, 20:27
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Re: Privilege

Well, interesting thread.

I, for one, can think of media and digital era, is here to expose the things like e.g. xenophobic attacks on foreigners in SA, well these anyway used to take place on regular basis in the past and nobody was caring the least. There was no WhatsApp, FB, Instagram, Twitter and what’s nots tools to manipulate pictures from different places in Africa and make us believe it is what it is and escalate it globally. You gotta check all facts first before you will start drawing your own conclusions. Populism and scaremongering working at it’s best. Sure, there are underlying problems in every society but actions speak louder than pictures!

Just an example of fake Mugabe’s coffin that circulated on media.
https://factcheck.afp.com/these-are-...billion-casket

Another example, latest strain of xenophobic attacks taking place in South Africa:
https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-af...-stoke-tension

Basically, there is so much bullshit surrounding the media and you have to decide for yourself what to believe in ...
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Old 22.09.2019, 20:30
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Re: Privilege

Youngest of nine from a very hard working Irish Catholic family and yet, we lived in a so called "nice" neighborhood. My parents put everything into education; that said, we were the ones who did the menial jobs in the neighborhood that none of the other kids had an interest in: newspaper delivery, babysitter, snow shoveler you name it and it was passed down from sibling to sibling. My family held the monopoly on the part time jobs in the area.

My father's mantra, was the that the other "spoiled" children whose families we serviced would be disadvantaged in the "real" world. But that was not always the case as I reminded my father years later.

That said, my parents' sacrifice for education benefitted all of us - as did my Dad and Mom's hard work ethic. My Mom would often say to us, "Life isn't fair; so how are you going to make a difference?" Wise words...
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Old 22.09.2019, 20:32
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Re: Privilege

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Old 22.09.2019, 21:01
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Re: Privilege

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I've counted my privileges. White. Middle class. Rich. From Yorkshire. Male. Ginger.

That's a 6 - I'm perfect.
We expect you to post tons of naughty, non-pc photos and videos from your past as soon as you checked all your albums, hard-disks and old handies then.

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Maybe priviliged kids are bored and our wild was not wild enough for them?

Or maybe we're all weired as we go all outraged about Kavanaugh, yet he just carries on making a career while we call others criminals and lock them up.
I think that's it. What's crime done by "normal" people, is only a scandal for celebrities.
And people sure love the tabloids.
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Old 22.09.2019, 21:02
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Re: Privilege

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.... e.g. xenophobic attacks on foreigners in SA, well these anyway used to take place on regular basis in the past and nobody was caring the least.
While I agree with you about the danger and annoyance of distortion through fake (not just inadvertently erroneous, but deliberately confabulated) news, I think that the bad events which took place in the past did, indeed, cause many people to care. Yes. Some to be scared, to flee if they could, to lose their possessions, livelihoods or even lives, and some to go in and try to set things right.

Last edited by doropfiz; 22.09.2019 at 21:21.
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Old 22.09.2019, 21:12
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Re: Privilege

Because they have had generation upon generation of different rules applying. Look at when the first police force was formed in the UK, the thief takers etc. The upper classes were considered untouchable because crime only happened to, and because of, the poor.


There were only something like 8 investigators for the whole country.

I suspect that's one of the reasons (amongst so many others) Agatha Christie was so popular: posh folks gettung their comeuppances and doing un-posh things.

Last edited by RufusB; 22.09.2019 at 21:17. Reason: Afterthought
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Old 22.09.2019, 21:17
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Re: Privilege

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It seems like every week that some notable or other is having his youthful (or not so youthful) follies exposed.

[...]

So what do you think? Why are so many of our "betters" such revolting human beings?
I believe nobody digs in the past of ordinary people, that's why our "betters" look so bad in comparison. I'm sure there are also non-famous adults with shameful events in their youths.
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Old 22.09.2019, 21:19
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Re: Privilege

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Why are so many of our "betters" such revolting human beings?
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Because they got caught at it.
Tom
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What's crime done by "normal" people, is only a scandal for celebrities. And people sure love the tabloids.
I don't think it is just about the public popularity of scandal about prominent people.

DB's point was not only about being caught and hitting the social media, but that back then, and also now, his kind of blast just never went/goes as far into the kind of degenerate behaviour that is told of some of the current celebreties.

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Now, this is the thing I don't get. I don't think I'm particularly special. Like most of us, I had a blast in my late teens and twenties. To be honest, I'm glad it all happened long before cellphone cameras and facebook. But never - not once - was I ever even tempted to rape a sleeping woman, or dress up as a "south sea savage", or do things to a pig's head. It just wasn't how our crowd - otherwise as degenerate and wasted as any other - operated.
As DB sets it out, even if he were a majorly tabloid-able public figure, there ain't never gonna be a photo of him doing those kinds of things, because he doesn't want to, in the first place, with or without a camera.

I think Edwin has a point, that a certain amount of celebrity and priveledge has the potential to take one out of connection with the realities of the pain and suffering of others. Or else to believe in one's own invincibility, because one is likely to be able to call on connnections, or to be wealthy enough to pay fantastic sums, under the table if need be, to police, lawyers and judges who will do anything.

Such bizarre acts are also done by ordinary-looking folk, like Josef Fritzl. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fritzl_case
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-case-timeline
Might he have been caught sooner, had he been famous enough for a journalist to research, more thoroughly, why his daughter had disappeared?
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Old 22.09.2019, 21:20
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Re: Privilege

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While I agree with you about the danger and annoyance of distortion through fake (not just inadvertently erroneous, but deliberately confabulated) news, I think that the bad event which took place in the past did, indeed, cause many people to care. Yes. Some to be scared, to flee if they could, to lose their possessions, livelihoods or even lives, and some to go in and try to set things right.
Agreed. That was very traumatic experience for many foreigners to have their shops looted and being displaced. Those xenophobic attacks had no justification and do not represent mentality of majority people in RSA. They are barbaric acts committed by criminals and opportunists that cannot be justified. Diaspora takes place in Zimbabwe, South Africa and other African countries. Another big issue is women being victims of rape. Many protests take place. Media as much as they try to help but they also tend to blow things out of proportion.
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Old 22.09.2019, 21:23
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Re: Privilege

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Agreed. That was very traumatic experience for many foreigners to have their shops looted and being displaced. Those xenophobic attacks had no justification and do not represent mentality of majority people in RSA. They are barbaric acts committed by criminals and opportunists that cannot be justified. Diaspora takes place in Zimbabwe, South Africa and other African countries. Another big issue is women being victims of rape. Many protests take place.
Yes! It is tragic. And I agree with you, not the mentality of the majority.

And were these events, which are happening to ordinary men and women to happen to prominent people, they's probably get much more coverage.
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Old 22.09.2019, 21:23
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Re: Privilege

Not sure categorizing what Fritzl did as bizarre is going quite far enough. And that's a different thing to what DB is getting at. I think.

Back on topic, money greases the wheels.
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Old 22.09.2019, 21:23
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Re: Privilege

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I believe nobody digs in the past of ordinary people, that's why our "betters" look so bad in comparison. I'm sure there are also non-famous adults with shameful events in their youths.
Yeah, but that's the thing. I'm a no-name wanker from the Midlands. My mates were mostly no-name wankers from the Midlands and North. We got up to all sorts of mayhem, but we never saw the need to molest young women or wear racist outfits to parties - and I don't think there was anything particularly special or virtuous about our crowd.

But these high court judges and prime ministers... it's a whole different level of "partying"...
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