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View Poll Results: Is Prince Andrew a big fat liar ???
Yes 40 76.92%
No 2 3.85%
Maybe 5 9.62%
Free Beer 5 9.62%
Voters: 52. You may not vote on this poll

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  #81  
Old 04.12.2019, 19:14
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

The Onion news organisation has highlighted that Prince Andrew's alleged activities are, in fact, central to the survival and existence of a well functioning Monarchy and should receive praise they deserve, not condemnation:

https://www.theonion.com/british-roy...n-t-1840178870
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  #82  
Old 04.12.2019, 19:17
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

Where is my free beer?
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  #83  
Old 05.12.2019, 02:59
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

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I think he is a disgusting peado bar-steward liar.

cheers
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Disgusting?
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  #84  
Old 05.12.2019, 10:02
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

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Disgusting?



Yes.





cheers
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  #85  
Old 05.12.2019, 13:01
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

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Disgusting?
I thought one would question the "bar-steward" part....oh, wait...
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  #86  
Old 07.12.2019, 17:35
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

From the point of view of public entertainment, it is almost irrelevant whether these new accusations against Prince Andrew are true or not, but there is potentially a huge jackpot waiting for those able to make successful claims against Epstein's estate, so we are likely to see more. Lawyers of the "ambulance chasing" breed can also be expected to do their bit to fan the flames for a cut of the loot.
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  #87  
Old 07.12.2019, 20:31
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

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From the point of view of public entertainment, it is...
...much more interesting to find out what ever happened with Ghislaine Maxwell - dead?
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  #88  
Old 07.12.2019, 21:18
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

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From the point of view of public entertainment, it is almost irrelevant whether these new accusations against Prince Andrew are true or not, but there is potentially a huge jackpot waiting for those able to make successful claims against Epstein's estate, so we are likely to see more. Lawyers of the "ambulance chasing" breed can also be expected to do their bit to fan the flames for a cut of the loot.
This is what happens when one enjoys the company of underaged girls who should have been at school at the time he met them and not drinking martinis with older males...

Of course, they all deny everything now... "I just looked but didn't touch, Your Honour!"
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  #89  
Old 08.12.2019, 10:43
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

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This is what happens when one enjoys the company of underaged girls who should have been at school at the time he met them and not drinking martinis with older males...

Of course, they all deny everything now... "I just looked but didn't touch, Your Honour!"

She wasn't underage at 17, young and obviously naive if she thought the martini's, private jet and the rest was all because Jeffrey was a kind chap.



I don't condone this in any way, but the girl is certainly no angel either and now wants to make some money. If it was that disturbing to her, why has it taken so long for her to cry about it ?
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  #90  
Old 08.12.2019, 12:45
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

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She wasn't underage at 17, young and obviously naive if she thought the martini's, private jet and the rest was all because Jeffrey was a kind chap.



I don't condone this in any way, but the girl is certainly no angel either and now wants to make some money. If it was that disturbing to her, why has it taken so long for her to cry about it ?
I suppose that you could also pose the rhetorical question, "What would her [Virginia Giuffre’s] mum have said had she been informed in advance about all this jet setting playboy stuff ?"

I guess a few warning words which the daughter would have anyway ignored.
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  #91  
Old 08.12.2019, 13:24
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

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She wasn't underage at 17,
Whether or not she was deemed to be underage for consensual sex, at 17, is a question of the jurisdiction (and there's quite a range, even within the USA), and such laws typically deal partly with the biological age, and partly also with differences in the ages and in the [power/dependence] relationship between the two parties.

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She was.... young and obviously naive if she thought the martini's, private jet and the rest was all because Jeffrey was a kind chap.
Yes, this is exactly the point. Young, naive, easily exploited.

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I don't condone this in any way, but the girl is certainly no angel either and now wants to make some money.
By "no angel"... perhaps you refer to some part of her previous sexual history or behaviour? Whatever those may have been, they don't make her immune to [further?] exploitation by the time she reached 17.

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If it was that disturbing to her, why has it taken so long for her to cry about it ?
Many victims of traumatic circumstances cannot bring themselves to cry about it early enough. If they could react fast enough, many would Get Out of the situation before things worsened.

Once a certain taboo has been broken, other factors such as shame and low self-exteem can hinder a victim from "just going home" if, indeed, home was a viable option in the first place. Moreover, the perpetrator can ensure that the victim has no money and no documents with which to flee, and can persuade them that nobody will believe their cry for help anyway, and that the world out there is much, much worse than staying here. If the perpetrator(s) also threaten the victim and his/her family, rank terror can prevent a victim from going for help.

Repeat, organised perpetrators understand such mechanisms and use them viciously to entrap their victims, even when they don't make use of a lock and key.
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  #92  
Old 08.12.2019, 13:54
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

Why the groan, Today only?
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  #93  
Old 08.12.2019, 13:58
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

What rubbish, vulnerable....


Every 17 year old knows that their penis or vagina is just not for pissing with


Human beings can quite capably reproduce, thus have sex at ages less than 12, so it is not really biological reasons that prevent this but more so psychological and emotional reasons that are more to the point.


I don't think the girl was exploited, more to the point she knew exactly what was happening and went long with it as it was cool at the time and she was having a good time compared to her friends.



It's always the fault of somebody else, never the person concerned, she knew exactly what she was doing when she did it, she now regrets it, she see's an angle to cash in on the episode and has taken it exactly same way as she did when she was 17
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  #94  
Old 08.12.2019, 17:37
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

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Why the groan, Today only?
I don't know why (I mean, I have read similar posts and don't agree), but everything you wrote we have already debated and most people here agree with you.
We're running in circles on this thread, don't see the point of repeating ourselves. Not saying your opinion is not important, just wanted to remind you there are two "camps" (however marginal one of them) and one won't convince the other.
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  #95  
Old 08.12.2019, 17:51
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

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Why the groan, Today only?

Do i really need to explain it to you ?


The girl knew exactly what was going on and her place in that sort of society and to say otherwise is pure bullshit.


She is neither stupid not retarded, she was 17 at the time so was perfectly conscious of what was happening and what she was doing.


Fun at the time, not so much fun now and why not make a bit of money too.


Prince Andrew is not the sharpest knife in the box, that is for sure, but he's not entireyl guilty of what he is being dragged through the mud for.
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  #96  
Old 08.12.2019, 17:57
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

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I don't think the girl was exploited, more to the point she knew exactly what was happening and went long with it as it was cool at the time and she was having a good time compared to her friends.
Would you say the same thing if the girl was with a teacher?

She probably wouldn't get such expensive gifts of course but these things still happen so it's obviously not just about the gifts and holidays, is it?

Because of the exploitation/grooming element, in the U.K. at least, it is against the law for an adult in a position of authority over a child to have a relationship with that child.
Outside of this relationship, it's not illegal.

Do you know why the first position is illegal?

Could you possibly see an parallels in the Epstein case?
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  #97  
Old 08.12.2019, 18:04
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

Aren’t these two statements oversimplifying the situation in order to shift the blame to the girl? Making out that she was the brains and fully complicit and poor divvy Andrew was just naive and easily led.

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She is neither stupid not retarded, she was 17 at the time so was perfectly conscious of what was happening and what she was doing.


Quote:
Prince Andrew is not the sharpest knife in the box, that is for sure, but he's not entireyl guilty of what he is being dragged through the mud for.
Thick as he may well be, he’s been a royal his whole life long. He must have known at some point that the shit would hit the fan. Clearly they didn’t pay off the oh-so-smart girly enough, or her pay out has now run out.
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  #98  
Old 08.12.2019, 18:10
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

I genuinely believe Andrew thought he was above all of it due to his family, he really is a few sandwiches short of a picnic, even a very small picnic.


She knew what she was doing, make no mistake about that, she also probably could do with an extra coating of Heniz sandwich spread too


Come whatever, every 17 year old knows the functions of their body, maybe not the emotions, but the functions and what is right and wrong.


She did it to have a good time and now regrets it and is trying to make money out of it, blatently
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  #99  
Old 08.12.2019, 19:02
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

Exactly, not mature in the emotions, physically but not psychologically developed.

Here's a narrative by a teenager.
https://www.teenagewhisperer.co.uk/c...tion-grooming/

She explains her emotional turmoil when she got involved in what she first thought was an exciting and loving relationship, when she thought she knew what she was doing, and having good times. And then how the perpetrator changed that, and before she understood what was happening, she was exploited and abused, and how she couldn't "just leave", not until she knew someone would try to believe and support her.

We don't know, of course, about Epstein's accusers, who is telling how much truth, or not. But no, not every 17-year-old is mature enough to know what she is letting herself into when she is welcomed by a rich, powerful, older man who introduces her to more powerful, older men. And it is in that discrepancy of power, that the abuse lies.
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  #100  
Old 08.12.2019, 20:28
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Re: Prince Andrew = Pinocchio ???

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Would you say the same thing if the girl was with a teacher?

She probably wouldn't get such expensive gifts of course but these things still happen so it's obviously not just about the gifts and holidays, is it?

Because of the exploitation/grooming element, in the U.K. at least, it is against the law for an adult in a position of authority over a child to have a relationship with that child.
Outside of this relationship, it's not illegal.

Do you know why the first position is illegal?

Could you possibly see an parallels in the Epstein case?
Ah, I see that I read your post incorrectly. I first thought you were saying that as long as an adult is not connected to a child in a position of authority, it's perfectly legal for an adult to have a sexual relationship with a child, in the UK. That shocked me. Now, I think you were referring not to children in general, but specifically to the UK age of consent, being 16.

I wonder about the "position of authority or trust"... does that mean only formalised, professional authority or trust, e.g. teacher?

Does being wealthy and powerful and having dazzled or tricked the child with grooming, equate to being in a position of trust over a 16 or 17-year-old? Is being a prince a postition of authority and trust?
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