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  #61  
Old 07.04.2020, 12:17
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

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Excellent newbie groanage Scarfie. If indeed you are a newbie...

Anything concrete to contribute or are we just heckling from a distance?
Heís been around a pretty long time to be fair although not a very prolific poster. He seems to average between two and three posts a year.
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  #62  
Old 07.04.2020, 14:27
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

Fair enough then in this case- but I do wonder how many who flounced recently are back with other names- and with all their history erased?
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Old 25.04.2020, 19:56
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

Corbyn is back with his racist pals. He insists on supplying the EHRC with new evidence.
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  #64  
Old 24.07.2020, 20:17
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

Corbyn continues to damage Labour. His acolytes still rally behind him, willing to fund his legal fees (even though he is a millionaire)

Labour's antisemitism problem hasn't gone away.
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  #65  
Old 04.05.2021, 23:12
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

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We were all waiting for the tide to turn over Brexit too!

Most people realise that the Coronavirus is an international crisis, and not a time for cheap political points scoring. Normal people come together in such times.

Labour lost the last election because they were completely out of touch with their working class heartlands. They've now elected a privately educated, failed Crown prosecutor, knight of the realm, London-based REMAINER to win back those lost seats. Needless to say, it won't work.
Looks like he will have a jolly good go at losing another one (Hartlepool) on Thursday. It doesn't really get rougher, grittier, more traditional labour than Hartlepool.

To whoever made the original post (now quit) - what were you thinking???? Wasn't it obvious that he would fail to cut through. Labours heartlands up north are fed up to the teeth with Islington views and they just went ahead and did it again! And then selected a hardcore remainer ex-MP who lost his seat in the north-east last time around in a significantly more Brexit seat than the one he managed to lose last time.

Not only did they not get it in 2019 with Corbyn, they didn't get it again in 2020 with Starmer, they still don't get it now.
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Old 05.05.2021, 09:29
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

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Looks like he will have a jolly good go at losing another one (Hartlepool) on Thursday. It doesn't really get rougher, grittier, more traditional labour than Hartlepool.

To whoever made the original post (now quit) - what were you thinking???? Wasn't it obvious that he would fail to cut through. Labours heartlands up north are fed up to the teeth with Islington views and they just went ahead and did it again! And then selected a hardcore remainer ex-MP who lost his seat in the north-east last time around in a significantly more Brexit seat than the one he managed to lose last time.

Not only did they not get it in 2019 with Corbyn, they didn't get it again in 2020 with Starmer, they still don't get it now.
Labour's problems run mich deeper than only their leader. They've now lost with Brown, Miliband, Corbyn and likely next Starmer. It seems to me Johnson is able to get away with absolutely anything under the mantra of we got Brexit done. I mean the man is completely unfit to be Prime minister, I'm sure most Tories probably know that too. I would put forward that Johnson has a huge long list of failure both in his life before politics, during parliament, mayoralty and as foreign secretary and pm. None of that matters though apparently to the English electorate, who are seemingly happy to nitpick problems Witt Starmer and labour, sure Starmer was terrible yesterday on TV rounds, very negative and defeatist almost but Johnson seldom is able to get a coherent idea or sentence out without umming and arghing. "Islington"politics might seem elitist to voters in the red wall - Johnson is the epitome of posh Tory boy, privileged, Eton educated - I don't think I will ever understand how people can vote for him, I just hope he gets a good kicking in Scotland and history remembers him as the leader who lost the UK.
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  #67  
Old 05.05.2021, 09:46
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

Politics has always be a dirty game run by crooks.

BoJo is cast as a lovable rogue while labour is still appealing to cloth-cap voters, who no longer exist.

If Labour ever hope to regain power they need to take a leaf out of Blair's book and totally reinvent themselves - again.

Speaking of reinventing themselves: the original poster of this thread did just that...
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  #68  
Old 05.05.2021, 09:58
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

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Labour's problems run mich deeper than only their leader. They've now lost with Brown, Miliband, Corbyn and likely next Starmer. It seems to me Johnson is able to get away with absolutely anything under the mantra of we got Brexit done. I mean the man is completely unfit to be Prime minister, I'm sure most Tories probably know that too. I would put forward that Johnson has a huge long list of failure both in his life before politics, during parliament, mayoralty and as foreign secretary and pm. None of that matters though apparently to the English electorate, who are seemingly happy to nitpick problems Witt Starmer and labour, sure Starmer was terrible yesterday on TV rounds, very negative and defeatist almost but Johnson seldom is able to get a coherent idea or sentence out without umming and arghing. "Islington"politics might seem elitist to voters in the red wall - Johnson is the epitome of posh Tory boy, privileged, Eton educated - I don't think I will ever understand how people can vote for him, I just hope he gets a good kicking in Scotland and history remembers him as the leader who lost the UK.
Can't you see what connects Miliband, Corbyn and Starmer? They all live within about 2 or 3 miles of each other in Hampstead / Islington / Camden way.

Brown lost because Labour had been in for 13 years. Partly because he is dour and difficult to like personally - but actually 2010 wasn't that bad for labour. The rot has set in since.

I don't like Johnson either but there's no more palatable alternative (blame FPTP for that). I don't give a monkeys if he is from a posh background - and his views are relatively appealing (not overly ideological and moderate socially) His character isn't.

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  #69  
Old 05.05.2021, 10:41
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

Labour have little hope of ever regaining power quite simply because they've completely lost their traditional working class base. It's somehow morphed into the party of champagne socialists, woke celebrities and career long public sector employees.

It's remarkable really, that in the age of the culture wars, the Labour Party almost always manages to find itself on the wrong side of the argument. The UK isn't the US, where the culture wars are more evenly balanced, and it comes across as if the Labour Party is yet tp grasp this point!
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Old 05.05.2021, 10:48
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

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Labour's problems run mich deeper than only their leader. They've now lost with Brown, Miliband, Corbyn and likely next Starmer. It seems to me Johnson is able to get away with absolutely anything under the mantra of we got Brexit done. I mean the man is completely unfit to be Prime minister, I'm sure most Tories probably know that too. I would put forward that Johnson has a huge long list of failure both in his life before politics, during parliament, mayoralty and as foreign secretary and pm. None of that matters though apparently to the English electorate, who are seemingly happy to nitpick problems Witt Starmer and labour, sure Starmer was terrible yesterday on TV rounds, very negative and defeatist almost but Johnson seldom is able to get a coherent idea or sentence out without umming and arghing. "Islington"politics might seem elitist to voters in the red wall - Johnson is the epitome of posh Tory boy, privileged, Eton educated - I don't think I will ever understand how people can vote for him, I just hope he gets a good kicking in Scotland and history remembers him as the leader who lost the UK.
Getting BREXIT was important to the Majority of the electorate who voted for BREXIT, yet people got in the way because they did not know what they were voting for. How condescending & let it be a lesson to politicians who try & fight the electorate. BoJo has also done well with the vaccine rollout so a double success story.
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  #71  
Old 05.05.2021, 10:54
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

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Can't you see what connects Miliband, Corbyn and Starmer? They all live within about 2 or 3 miles of each other in Hampstead / Islington / Camden way.

Brown lost because Labour had been in for 13 years. Partly because he is dour and difficult to like personally - but actually 2010 wasn't that bad for labour. The rot has set in since.

I don't like Johnson either but there's no more palatable alternative (blame FPTP for that). I don't give a monkeys if he is from a posh background - and his views are relatively appealing (not overly ideological and moderate socially) His character isn't.
Yes I do see the connection, and yes labour has lost its connection to its base vote in red wall seats. Its leaders should be more representative of society as a whole. That doesn't mean to say I think then that we should all just think that the Tories somehow represent the working class vote or have backgrounds that represent wider society - two thirds of current cabinet are educated at private schools and Tory leaders have a historic connection to Eton - Cameron, Johnson being the most recent. I see the problem as labour neglecting their traditional voters or taking them for granted. It is coming back to haunt them now whether Starmer is leader or not. That's no different though to how Tories treat Scotland for decades which will eventually come back to haunt them too.
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  #72  
Old 05.05.2021, 10:57
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

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Getting BREXIT was important to the Majority of the electorate who voted for BREXIT, yet people got in the way because they did not know what they were voting for. How condescending & let it be a lesson to politicians who try & fight the electorate. BoJo has also done well with the vaccine rollout so a double success story.
Have you looked at the actual figures?

As for not knowing what they were voting for, day by day, it is very clear that that was indeed the case. Abundantly so. And remind us of who voted Johnson in?
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  #73  
Old 05.05.2021, 10:59
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

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Have you looked at the actual figures?

As for not knowing what they were voting for, day by day, it is very clear that that was indeed the case. Abundantly so. And remind us of who voted Johnson in?
Johnson was leader of the Conservative party at the last General Election, the electorate knew exactly what they were voting for.
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  #74  
Old 05.05.2021, 11:04
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

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Yes I do see the connection, and yes labour has lost its connection to its base vote in red wall seats. Its leaders should be more representative of society as a whole. That doesn't mean to say I think then that we should all just think that the Tories somehow represent the working class vote or have backgrounds that represent wider society - two thirds of current cabinet are educated at private schools and Tory leaders have a historic connection to Eton - Cameron, Johnson being the most recent. I see the problem as labour neglecting their traditional voters or taking them for granted. It is coming back to haunt them now whether Starmer is leader or not. That's no different though to how Tories treat Scotland for decades which will eventually come back to haunt them too.
The Conservative party is more diverse than the others, first woman prime minister over 40 years ago, the second woman prime minister ....... they did not stop there. https://www.gq-magazine.co.uk/politi...arty-diversity
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Old 05.05.2021, 11:04
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

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Can't you see what connects Miliband, Corbyn and Starmer? They all live within about 2 or 3 miles of each other in Hampstead / Islington / Camden way.

Brown lost because Labour had been in for 13 years. Partly because he is dour and difficult to like personally - but actually 2010 wasn't that bad for labour. The rot has set in since.

I don't like Johnson either but there's no more palatable alternative (blame FPTP for that). I don't give a monkeys if he is from a posh background - and his views are relatively appealing (not overly ideological and moderate socially) His character isn't.
I disagree with you that his views are appealing - to be honest I have found his previous comments over many years absolutely abhorrent and disgusting. I think that's the point, how many times in his career have disgraceful comments, failure and general incompetence been overlooked? What makes him so special? I really will never understand that.
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  #76  
Old 05.05.2021, 11:10
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

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I disagree with you that his views are appealing - to be honest I have found his previous comments over many years absolutely abhorrent and disgusting. I think that's the point, how many times in his career have disgraceful comments, failure and general incompetence been overlooked? What makes him so special? I really will never understand that.
I think you are mistaking the Tories with being popular in-Touch and liked. They are just less unpopular, out of touch and disliked than labour. I think people are pretty wary of Johnson, they are just fed up with Labour and want them nowhere near power.

Last edited by HickvonFrick; 05.05.2021 at 12:17.
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  #77  
Old 05.05.2021, 11:46
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

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The Conservative party is more diverse than the others, first woman prime minister over 40 years ago, the second woman prime minister ....... they did not stop there. https://www.gq-magazine.co.uk/politi...arty-diversity
I definitely don't associate the Tories with the word diversity. I work in a private school, it's s great place to work and for children to learn in. The alarm bells ring when two thirds of the government were educated at private schools - how is that diverse? It seems to me to be that social mobility and earning positions by merit and talent doesn't exist in our government. I mean the cabinet aren't exactly the best and brightest in their fields to put it kindly. Tories labour SNP, parliament as a whole all need to be more diverse in general - perhaps then people might actually feel some sort of connection with their elected representatives?
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Old 05.05.2021, 12:25
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

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I definitely don't associate the Tories with the word diversity. I work in a private school, it's s great place to work and for children to learn in. The alarm bells ring when two thirds of the government were educated at private schools - how is that diverse? It seems to me to be that social mobility and earning positions by merit and talent doesn't exist in our government. I mean the cabinet aren't exactly the best and brightest in their fields to put it kindly. Tories labour SNP, parliament as a whole all need to be more diverse in general - perhaps then people might actually feel some sort of connection with their elected representatives?
The tories have urban social liberal economic right wingers, patrician country squire types, hard right UKIPPY types and (newly in stock) red wall pork barrellers. That's diversity in itself. They also have remainders and leavers in numbers that are actually quite close to the country.

Labour have centre left urban remain woke, far left urban remain woke and that's about it. The old school northerner who used to be down a mine is pretty much extinct, and certainly not in a position of power.
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Old 05.05.2021, 12:27
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

Hello all, my first post and my 2 Rappen for what itís worth.
I grew up , the seven of us in a two up two down on a rough council estate near Brum. Of my siblings , friends of all colours ,shapes and sizes nobody votes labour any more, they have all moved to ukip, the conservatives, English democrats or the lcoal nut-job independent candidate.
They are under no illusions and all well aware that with conservatives and Boris what you see is what you get, however the big issue ( no pun intended) is that Labour is anything but.
It is comprised now mostly of middle class Guardianistas who sneer at the white ( is it allowed to say that on here? ) working class as bigoted racists. In this, as in many other things they are totally out of touch in particular with regards to love of country, decent values, patriotism,whatever. I have been to and seen Palestinian flags and ira banners at the Labour Party conference, the union flag and god forbid the cross of St George are seen as the symbol of the vile oppressors.
For a party which likes to portray itself as representing the working class it has a grand total of less than 3% of MPís who have a working class background. To the leftie-liberal teachers, lecturers, researchers etc who now seem to be labours preferred clientele manual labour is one of those nice baristas In Islington and physical work is not just comprised of turning the pages of the Guardian.
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Old 05.05.2021, 12:57
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Re: Keir Starmer elected as new Labour Leader

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I definitely don't associate the Tories with the word diversity. I work in a private school, it's s great place to work and for children to learn in. The alarm bells ring when two thirds of the government were educated at private schools - how is that diverse? It seems to me to be that social mobility and earning positions by merit and talent doesn't exist in our government. I mean the cabinet aren't exactly the best and brightest in their fields to put it kindly. Tories labour SNP, parliament as a whole all need to be more diverse in general - perhaps then people might actually feel some sort of connection with their elected representatives?
Not sure its the Private school is the right target. The private school is where people go to learn, they also go to oxford, cambridge but no one complains about that. If its the networking after private school, where family connections get them into business, thats a concern then its the network, not the school thats the fault.

It's not a criticism, but its just you hear that the common point amongst various positions is that they all went to a private school, but so do business titans, many top end professors and academics, all sorts of people, but its only the politicians and in particular the conservative ones, that seem to get this singularly pointed out.
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