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  #901  
Old 25.08.2020, 19:02
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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It takes a second or two to turn around and pull a trigger. By then you're probably not in danger, you're probably dead.
I tend to think these cops who have to operate basically in war zones do not have the same support the army and other armed forces have. Being caught in riots and wrath - I bet they have perpetual PTSD, it's worse than just undertrained people who need to sleep a bit, train a lil more and get a few bucks more. I wonder how things will improve there..
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  #902  
Old 25.08.2020, 19:18
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

What war zone? Kenosha, WI?
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  #903  
Old 25.08.2020, 20:47
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

Apparently the victim is paralysed from the waist down. Almost worse than being killed.
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Old 25.08.2020, 21:12
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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... where people can commit crimes, resist arrest/attack the police and then complain about the severity of the response.
Yeah. He hadn't committed a crime.
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If the suspect has a violent history, previous firearms offences...
He didn't.
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I'd say resisting arrest is something you get the death sentence for. Not even in Texas
I suspect a missing "not" in there... However, in the UK it almost never does, because police aren't armed. It doesn't even get that you that here where police are armed.

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Ok, police and military work in different fields agreed.
I still think, its comparable in this context.
I only agree as far as if police are going to be armed, their remit for discharging their weapons is to eliminate the danger to the public. And that requires firing into the body where you are more like to hit.

A Basel police officer a few years ago stepped in front of a bullet aimed at a member of the public and lost his life as a result. He seemed to have understood that his duty was to protect. The US approach seems to be "I must defend myself against all potential threats". Which is where you get the "stand your ground" laws from. A strange people. They seem overwhelmed by fear. An American colleague of mine, who seems otherwise quite sensible and sane, whenever he comes to Europe, the first thing he does is buy a box knife "to defend myself with".
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Old 25.08.2020, 21:17
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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If the suspect has a violent history, previous firearms offences...
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He didn't.
Really? Is this not him?
https://racinecountyeye.com/police-k...ed-gun-at-bar/
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  #906  
Old 25.08.2020, 21:32
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

To be honest, I feel like the incident with Jacob Blake is something that I can't really form a sound opinion on until I know more details about it. From the video footage, it's not clear as to why exactly he was walking to his car and then opened his door. I also have not found it mentioned anywhere that a gun was found in his car (was one found?), to support a theory that he was reaching for a gun.

Regardless of who is at fault (perhaps both were wrong), it's very sad what happened and especially that it happened right in front of his three young kids.

Anyways, until I know more about what exactly happened, it's difficult for me to know who is really at fault for him being shot. But it never really made sense to me that a cop should first have to have a gun fired on himself before he is allowed to use his own.

Also, I am a "liberal" but I think people need to stop turning every incident where a black guy is shot, etc. by the police into an issue of race. The media blows it up because, well... sensationalism. And that keeps us enraged and engaged. And I'm getting tired of people turning incidents like this into a reason to loot and burn stuff down. If people want the cops to control their behavior, perhaps they need to consider controlling their own.
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  #907  
Old 26.08.2020, 00:55
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

...is to much at stakes to not be exploited by circle of interest...
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  #908  
Old 26.08.2020, 04:02
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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...is to much at stakes to not be exploited by circle of interest...
e, m, dysi?
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  #909  
Old 26.08.2020, 09:20
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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Also, I am a "liberal" but I think people need to stop turning every incident where a black guy is shot, etc. by the police into an issue of race. The media blows it up because, well... sensationalism. And that keeps us enraged and engaged. And I'm getting tired of people turning incidents like this into a reason to loot and burn stuff down. If people want the cops to control their behavior, perhaps they need to consider controlling their own.
What, and hold them accountable for their actions the same as everyone else?!
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  #910  
Old 26.08.2020, 09:21
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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Really? So even if he'd pulled out a gun and started shooting at the police then 7 shots wouldn't be justified?
How would they have shot him in the back if he was facing them? Joined up thinking my friend, joined up thinking.
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  #911  
Old 26.08.2020, 14:33
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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I would still argue no, but others would argue yes. His back was to them, so unless he fired a gun through his own body, they were not in danger.
That's like saying a black man is too stupid to realise that he can shoot past his own body, on either side, to shoot the guy in his back.
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Police should only discharge a firearm if there's imminent danger/threat of loss of life of themselves or others. Given that there were three children in the car and the cop still had his hand on the guy's shirt, I would argue that discharging their weapons did not protect anyone and instead actually put children at risk.
Reality proves you wrong, the children weren't harmed.

The short distance plus the direction the shots had probably made it virtually impossible to harm the children in the car.
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There are other ways to take down a suspect that don't involve shooting.
They tried.
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Old 26.08.2020, 14:40
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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...is to much at stakes to not be exploited by circle of interest...
It is not like it'd take a lot of effort to exploit, for anyone who's in it for that. Anything is interpretable in a way it would suit some kind of interest.
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  #913  
Old 26.08.2020, 14:42
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

According to WRS the police in Berne yesterday stopped a wanted suspect from fleeing, by shooting his tires.

Funny that.
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Old 26.08.2020, 14:45
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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According to WRS the police in Berne yesterday stopped a wanted suspect from fleeing, by shooting his tires.

Funny that.
Apples and oranges.
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Old 26.08.2020, 14:50
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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According to WRS the police in Berne yesterday stopped a wanted suspect from fleeing, by shooting his tires.

Funny that.
Funny what. We surely do not have any Americans living in Switzerland exactly because it is a safe, logical, organized and civil society with low level of violent crime. Right?

It is too bad we do not have that fab EF member who used to be cop here any longer..He was very down to earth and analytical in these issues.

I personally think that these US incidents are not product of particularly racism but the fact these cops fear for their life, have attrocious conditions to work in, feel left to fend for themselves, etc. but it could be all of it together.
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Old 26.08.2020, 14:55
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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What, and hold them accountable for their actions the same as everyone else?!
Well, I think that in some cases, the cops acted wrongly with their guns and the person shouldn't have been shot. But in other cases, the cops using their guns was justified. And that is all regardless of the race of the person who was shot. But what I see happening is that when it's a black guy who is shot, it's automatically turned into an issue of race when in fact the guy's race may have had nothing to do with what happened. So rather than looking at each incident individually and judging it accordingly, it seems like (some) people are instinctively lumping every incident into the same category of "black man wrongly killed by racist cop."

But what I also see happening is that the right is trying to accuse the left of being too lenient toward black criminals and also being too quick to throw up "the race card." And maybe that is true in some cases. But one thing I do like about Kamala Harris is that, as a prosecutor, she was known to be tough on crime and was not known to favor one race over the other. In San Francisco, for example, she pushed for anyone who is caught carrying a gun without a license to spend time in jail.

Anyways, I think it's possible to view this issue correctly from both sides. Yes, sometimes black men are killed wrongly by the cops. And sometimes the cops using their guns is justified. Truth is not always so black and white (no pun intended ). Sometimes it's inside the gray area.
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Old 26.08.2020, 14:55
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

7 shots in the back, 7!! yes 7, let that sink in for a second.

lets assume all shots fired actual hit him as well, after all US cops seem to be good shots (lol)

how can anyone justify the police shooting someone 7 times IN THE BACK?????
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Old 26.08.2020, 14:59
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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7 shots in the back, 7!! yes 7, let that sink in for a second.

lets assume all shots fired actual hit him as well, after all US cops seem to be good shots (lol)

how can anyone justify the police shooting someone 7 times IN THE BACK?????
From the video he had his gun in the victim’s back. There was no way he could miss.
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  #919  
Old 26.08.2020, 15:08
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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According to WRS the police in Berne yesterday stopped a wanted suspect from fleeing, by shooting his tires.

Funny that.
Funny in that something from Hollywood happened in the real world?

Went looking for the story, cops shoot out the tyres of a crashed car. Near stationary target in a forest. Sensational headline though. He wasn't going very far tyres or no tyres, maybe headline could be "gun crazy cops fill crashed cars tyres with lead".
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Old 26.08.2020, 15:14
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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7 shots in the back, 7!! yes 7, let that sink in for a second.

lets assume all shots fired actual hit him as well, after all US cops seem to be good shots (lol)

how can anyone justify the police shooting someone 7 times IN THE BACK?????

If the cop genuinely believed the guy was reaching for a gun in his car, then I guess he felt he needed to make sure he wasn't going to be able to use it. If I was a cop and I honestly believed that someone was about to pull a gun on me (and I believe this is probably a fear that many cops live with on a daily basis), I'm not sure I would hesitate to be the first one to pull a trigger. And that is regardless of the other guy's race. That cop didn't have time to step back and consider his options. But I think we still need more info about this particular incident before we can even begin to judge whether or not the cop was justified in using his gun.

However, I would think that if a gun had been found in the guy's vehicle to support a theory that he was reaching for one, that info would have been made public by now. But who knows...
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