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  #961  
Old 27.08.2020, 14:24
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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If they want to avoid all that perhaps they shouldn't commit the crime in the first place...

'Don't do the crime if you can't do the time'
Full Circle, since you seem to be in favor of minorities being brutally killed by law force or vigilantes for past records/potential crimes that haven't been judged in a fair trial yet...can you please comment on police brutality committed towards white people? How do you feel about that?

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...cam-tony-timpa

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-gun-hand.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/09/u...o-arizona.html

Did they deserve to die too? Especially Tony Timpa who called the police for help while going through a psychotic break down? Instead, they murdered him and then made fun of him afterword.

And please tell me, where in this statement from you does it say one should be killed? 'Don't do the crime if you can't do the time'
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  #962  
Old 27.08.2020, 15:14
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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Yes, but being arrested while black means being taken to gaol, spending the night there, being arraigned, given an unaffordable bail amount and held in custody until his trial date. Lose his job, perhaps his housing, and separated from his family. Then being offered a plea bargain where he pleads guilty for a reduced sentence or is threatened with an even longer sentence if he doesn't agree. If he goes to court he gets represented by a court appointed lawyer who is so overworked that probably will only meet with the 'suspect' once before the trial.

All this while being 'innocent until proven guilty'

It is no wonder that so many resist being arrested.

And no, this is not the plot from a detective novel, this is the way it is in the US.
Even for rich white people, such as Ghislaine.

Tom
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  #963  
Old 27.08.2020, 15:31
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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Full Circle, since you seem to be in favor of minorities being brutally killed by law force or vigilantes for past records/potential crimes that haven't been judged in a fair trial yet...can you please comment on police brutality committed towards white people? How do you feel about that?
I’m in favor of people being held responsible for their own actions.

Police brutality against anyone is never a good thing but I think we disagree on what constitutes police brutality.

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And please tell me, where in this statement from you does it say one should be killed? 'Don't do the crime if you can't do the time'
That statement was a response to the comment that ‘its no wonder so many (black people) resist being arrested’
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  #964  
Old 27.08.2020, 15:34
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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Did they deserve to die too? Especially Tony Timpa who called the police for help while going through a psychotic break down? Instead, they murdered him and then made fun of him afterword.
The remarkable thing, beyond your questions, is that none of these cases made international frontpage news at a time when comparable cases with black victims do.
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  #965  
Old 27.08.2020, 15:39
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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The remarkable thing, beyond your questions, is that none of these cases made international frontpage news at a time when comparable cases with black victims do.
2 of the links were from British papers?

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I’m in favor of people being held responsible for their own actions.

Police brutality against anyone is never a good thing but I think we disagree on what constitutes police brutality.
I see, you aren't a person of reason or sane mind. Being held responsible is being killed when you haven't committed an action that is a crime and it isn't police brutality to murder someone who hasn't committed a crime.
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  #966  
Old 27.08.2020, 15:48
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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I see, you aren't a person of reason or sane mind. Being held responsible is being killed when you haven't committed an action that is a crime and it isn't police brutality to murder someone who hasn't committed a crime.
Once the police officer informs you that you're under arrest then you are obliged to be arrested.
If you resist then you are commiting a crime and esculating the situtation.
If you give the police officer reason to believe that their life is in danger then they may use deadly force against you.
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  #967  
Old 27.08.2020, 15:49
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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once the police officer informs you that you're under arrest then you are obliged to be arrested.
If you resist then you are commiting a crime and esculating the situtation.
If you give the police officer reason to believe that their life is in danger then they may use deadly force against you.
shot in the back
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  #968  
Old 27.08.2020, 15:50
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

In case you folks missed the news on George Floyd:

Early this month bodycam footage was leaked. The full footage is easily found on YT, here's a short condensed version (he gets pinned to the wheel about 2min05 into the video, for those who want to watch but avoid that part). It shows that Floyd had been sat in the back of the car from the left, the sidewalk side. Before getting in he said he's claustrophobic, had Covid. The police appear reasonably patient and attentive, rolling down the window for him, etc. They're unimpressed by his declaration about Covid, possibly because they didn't believe him.

He woulnd't get in on his own so they had to push from the left and pull from the right passenger side, which explains how he got beside the right rear wheel later on. During that strugle he can be heard saying "I can't breathe" multiple times while he was mounting considerable resistance and still able to cause trouble for the police officers. At that time he was still in the car.

That puts his words while pinned down on the asphalt in a different light, he has demonstrated that he can't be trusted. According to reports it may even mean that the accused officers walk because the charge may be too high and thus should result in a "not guilty".
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  #969  
Old 27.08.2020, 15:51
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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2 of the links were from British papers?
Frontpage?

Let alone causing riots?
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  #970  
Old 27.08.2020, 16:07
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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shot in the back
While reaching for his knife
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  #971  
Old 27.08.2020, 16:10
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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While reaching for his knife
nice that US cops are clairvoyant then and knew he was going to pick it up and go for them.

Had he picked it up and turned round with it then fair enough, but I really don't get how anyone can ever say shooting someone 7 times IN THE BACK was self defense
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  #972  
Old 27.08.2020, 16:13
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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nice that US cops are clairvoyant then and knew he was going to pick it up and go for them.

Had he picked it up and turned round with it then fair enough, but I really don't get how anyone can ever say shooting someone 7 times IN THE BACK was self defense
The last time he was arrested they found a loaded gun in his car.

How are they to know he wasn't reaching for a gun?
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  #973  
Old 27.08.2020, 16:24
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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nice that US cops are clairvoyant then and knew he was going to pick it up and go for them.
What else was he doing in there?
He'd been given adeqaute warnings. He wasn't trying to get into the car, he was trying to get something out.
If he wanted to show them something, the obvious choice would have been 'Officer, I have something in my car I'd like you to see that wil clear this up'

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Had he picked it up and turned round with it then fair enough
If he picked it up and turned around, the police would be in mortal danger.
Why should they put themselves in mortal danger for someone who was aggressive, known to have had a gun, who told them he had a knife, who has a history of violence, and was wanted on a rape charge?


Anyway, seems to me, at no point in the confrontation did he help himself.
He's responsible for his own demise, no one else.
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  #974  
Old 27.08.2020, 16:31
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

Please stop bringing past convictions into it. It is irrelevant because...

1. Everyone, even felons, are entitled to fair and equal treatment under the law.

2. The chances of the police knowing all of this info is negligible at the time of shooting. 20/20 hindsight, retroactively crowbarring this stuff to justify (attempted) killing of a person doesn't wash.
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  #975  
Old 27.08.2020, 17:19
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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Please stop bringing past convictions into it. It is irrelevant because...

1. Everyone, even felons, are entitled to fair and equal treatment under the law.

2. The chances of the police knowing all of this info is negligible at the time of shooting. 20/20 hindsight, retroactively crowbarring this stuff to justify (attempted) killing of a person doesn't wash.
I agree it's all irrelevant.

What is relevant is that he resisted arrest, fought with the police and reached into his car for an unknown object which lead police to shoot him.
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  #976  
Old 27.08.2020, 17:28
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

LOL and all you people saying last time he did this that time he did that etc you really think the police knew all that? someone n the radio read out a full list of previous offences and bought them all upto speed??

we have no idea what knife *may* have been in the car, what if it was a swiss army knife? is that a death penalty offence?

we don't know if he was even going for a knife, and we'll never know, and please stop with the police in danger crap, they are police, its in their job description, they knew what they were signing up for, protect the public, that includes the victim and the kids in the car! But I guess certain posters would also be ok with stray bullets taking out his kids too.
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  #977  
Old 27.08.2020, 17:33
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

My momma always taught me two wrongs donít make a right.

The police were in no danger, not even perceived danger. They were just pissed because a black man was defying them.

Both of these individuals are going to be regretting their actions until their dying day.
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  #978  
Old 27.08.2020, 17:36
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

I still feel so on-the-fence about this particular incident. I'm reading through the posts here and I find myself agreeing with both sides. On the one hand, I'm not comfortable with feeling that someone deserves to lose their life for resisting arrest. But at the same time, I'm not sure I'm comfortable with thinking that a police officer shouldn't have the right to use their gun on someone when they feel or think that their own life is being threatened. And in this case, that cop had no idea what Jacob Blake was doing when he was reaching into his car. He had already clearly been resisting arrest. And if he hadn't resisted arrest and reached into his car, he would likely not be in a hospital bed right now.

I guess we all perceive and judge situations like this according to past experiences, etc. I'm not sure it's even really possible to judge it objectively (?). I don't know. But for me, I was saved by an off-duty cop from being raped at knife-point behind a building when I was 13 years old. So my default mode is not to dislike or distrust cops, I guess. Yet at the same time, I do realize that there is a problem with some cops using their guns when they don't need to or when they shouldn't have... sometimes. But if a cop truly believes that someone who is resisting arrest may be reaching for a gun, does that justify the cop using his or her gun first?
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  #979  
Old 27.08.2020, 17:43
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

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we don't know if he was even going for a knife,
Except he was reaching down where his knife was.
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Old 27.08.2020, 18:46
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Re: The racial time bomb-USA

Aw, sweet. You gave me neg rep with the comment "He's a rapist " I'm glad you take such merriment in reporting fake news.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/ja...ssault-charge/
https://www.politifact.com/factcheck...-child-rapist/

Btw, he's not a child rapist either. The whole thing was confected. Well done for falling for it!
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