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Old 28.06.2020, 21:06
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

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Getting rid of them is a pathetic attempt of judging people from the past by the rules of today. Besides that a lot of people do not actually care about what statues they tear down, they way to often have no clue at all about the person, all they see is some white dude from the past and thus it must go down.

BLM is a huge pile of stinking marxist bull-shit who only wants more of "us against them" and I'm amazed at all the damn cowards and suck-ups these days who let them do so.
Why is it marxist? In the bad sense?
  #22  
Old 28.06.2020, 21:08
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

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hey! I demand reparations for the second and third anglo-dutch wars of sixteen hundred and something or other and what not. Especially the sneaky dutch raid on the medway. And get rid of willem van de velde´s painting glorifying britains defeat, it offends me greatly.

I actually wrote that in caps for better effect but EF´s filter won´t let me, so you are just going to have to imagine it.
Are you still doing worse than others because a significant amount of people in power still hold derogatory views of people like you?
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  #23  
Old 28.06.2020, 21:11
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

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Well, we've seen what happens when people who lack empathy make decisions and when people do not allow emotions like empathy to serve as their moral compass. Coincidentally, a lack of empathy is the broad definition of psychopathy, and a common characteristic among psychopaths is that they are detached from their emotions and have an on/off 'switch' for empathy.
.
I think you missed the 'hypocritical' part of Baizuo.
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Old 28.06.2020, 21:14
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

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But why do we have to come in terms with that past? And why only with a specific part of it? And why should only the white guy feel quilt over something that was practiced generations ago and worldwide by all? It is as stupid and misplaced as that in hundred years my small-small children would demand things from the Germans for invading the Netherlands 180 years ago.

They can kiss my ass with their quilt bull-shit.
Slave traders were great guys goddammit!
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Old 28.06.2020, 21:22
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

Did a survey online from a dutch newspaper investigating racism in NL. One of the questions was, if there are only two empty seats on the bus, who would you sit next to:

A) white person
B) black person
C) dont know

To me a question like this tells me more about the level of racism from the person making up the questionaire... and that is also my whole problem with all this woke stuff. People like that are so focussed on doing the right thing and not being perceived as racist, you practically have to be a racist to be so obsessively occupied by it.

Why is the question asker so hell bent on me selecting to which color of person i am going to sit next to on the bus ? I chose option c.
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Old 28.06.2020, 21:26
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

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I think you missed the 'hypocritical' part of Baizuo.
I'm not sure what you mean (but it's getting late, I'm tired and have a headache). Why are white people on the left hypocrites?

"Frpm wikipedia:
Baizuo (/ˈbaɪˌdzwɔː/; Chinese: 白左 báizuǒ, literally White Left)[1][2] is a derogatory Chinese neologism and political epithet used to refer to Western leftist ideologies primarily espoused by white people.[3] The term baizuo is related to the term shèngmǔ (圣母, 聖母, literally "Blessed Mother"), a sarcastic reference to those whose political opinions are perceived as being guided by emotions or a hypocritical show of selflessness and empathy.[
"
  #27  
Old 28.06.2020, 21:28
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

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hey! I demand reparations for the second and third anglo-dutch wars of sixteen hundred and something or other and what not. Especially the sneaky dutch raid on the medway. And get rid of willem van de velde´s painting glorifying britains defeat, it offends me greatly.

I actually wrote that in caps for better effect but EF´s filter won´t let me, so you are just going to have to imagine it.
Only a few groups are allowed such and only a by the minority chosen part of those who committed the behaviour can be held responsible.

Better dig up a minority that still suffers from those wars would not be surprised it that catches and some more statues have to go...
  #28  
Old 28.06.2020, 21:28
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

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Are you still doing worse than others because a significant amount of people in power still hold derogatory views of people like you?
Uhh! Wut?
  #29  
Old 28.06.2020, 21:33
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

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Did a survey online from a dutch newspaper investigating racism in NL. One of the questions was, if there are only two empty seats on the bus, who would you sit next to:

A) white person
B) black person
C) dont know

To me a question like this tells me more about the level of racism from the person making up the questionaire... and that is also my whole problem with all this woke stuff. People like that are so focussed on doing the right thing and not being perceived as racist, you practically have to be a racist to be so obsessively occupied by it.

Why is the question asker so hell bent on me selecting to which color of person i am going to sit next to on the bus ? I chose option c.
Reality: Option D: Everybody as long as it is not a Moroccan youngster with a funny shoulder bag and expensive trainings outfit.
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Old 28.06.2020, 21:35
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

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Slave traders were great guys goddammit!
In those days they actually might have been.
  #31  
Old 28.06.2020, 21:40
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

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Did a survey online from a dutch newspaper investigating racism in NL. One of the questions was, if there are only two empty seats on the bus, who would you sit next to:

A) white person
B) black person
C) dont know

To me a question like this tells me more about the level of racism from the person making up the questionaire... and that is also my whole problem with all this woke stuff. People like that are so focussed on doing the right thing and not being perceived as racist, you practically have to be a racist to be so obsessively occupied by it.

Why is the question asker so hell bent on me selecting to which color of person i am going to sit next to on the bus ? I chose option c.
There is a difference between acknowledging race and being racist. Acknowledging race or perceived race was necessary to ask the question in the survey, which is apparently trying to gauge whether or not the participants' make generalizations or assumptions about a stranger's character based on their race.

My best friend is a psychology professor at Indiana State University and teaches classes on racism. She is white but married to a black man. Much of her research focuses on racism. But according to your theory, does that mean she's racist?
  #32  
Old 28.06.2020, 21:43
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

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Did a survey online from a dutch newspaper investigating racism in NL. One of the questions was, if there are only two empty seats on the bus, who would you sit next to:

A) white person
B) black person
C) dont know
I saw one similar. It was.

If there are only two empty seats on the bus, who would you sit next to:
A) white person
B) black person
C) whichever isn't EdwinNL

(Only teasing Edwin - I'm glad you post here).
  #33  
Old 28.06.2020, 21:43
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

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Slave traders were great guys goddammit!
In case you are genuinely concerned, have a look at this report and perhaps actively do something for the estimated 40 million people in slavery today.
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  #34  
Old 28.06.2020, 21:50
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

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There is a difference between acknowledging race and being racist. Acknowledging race or perceived race was necessary to ask the question in the survey, which is apparently trying to gauge whether or not the participants' make generalizations or assumptions about a stranger's character based on their race.

My best friend is a psychology professor at Indiana State University and teaches classes on racism. She is white but married to a black man. Much of her research focuses on racism. But according to your theory, does that mean she's racist?
It depends... she will probably have a tendency to see peoples motivation more being based on racism than on other things. Economics automatically assume people make decisions based on what is best for them economically. Car enthousiasts will assume people buy a car for power and performance, not because of the cute color. Tax advisors automatically assume people want them to find loopsholes to pay less tax.

Regarding the bus question, my answer is, want to sit in the isle, at the front, on the sidewalk side. But no it had to be a question about race....
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  #35  
Old 28.06.2020, 22:08
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

White people trying to say that racism against blacks doesn't exist or isn't a legitimate problem anymore.

I guess that's one manifestation of 'white privilege?' Gaslighting black people?

"Racism. It's just all in your head. Get over it."

"Slavery existed over a hundred years ago and up until a few decades ago, it was commonplace and acceptable for white people to think of blacks as being inferior -- forcing them to use separate bathrooms, hanging them from trees, etc. But that was a few decades ago. Therefore, racism couldn't possibly be a legitimate problem today."
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  #36  
Old 28.06.2020, 22:16
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

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It depends... she will probably have a tendency to see peoples motivation more being based on racism than on other things. Economics automatically assume people make decisions based on what is best for them economically. Car enthousiasts will assume people buy a car for power and performance, not because of the cute color. Tax advisors automatically assume people want them to find loopsholes to pay less tax.
Or maybe because racism is still very much commonplace in America.

But I guess that white people can easily ignore or negate it when it's not something that they themselves have to deal with on a regular basis.

In the 90s, I dated a guy who is half-black / half-white. He remembers waking up one night when he was around the age of four or so to find a cross burning in their front yard because people in the neighborhood were pissed off that his white mother had married a black man.

My father still uses "the N word" and thinks that whites are inherently superior to black people, as did all four of my grandparents.

My mother once told me that she knows none of her employers would ever hire a black person.

I remember kids spitting on a black kid when I was in first grade and making fun of him for the color of his skin.

Now tell me again how racism is just all in people's heads?

Last edited by Pancakes; 28.06.2020 at 22:28.
  #37  
Old 28.06.2020, 22:31
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

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Now tell me again how racism is just all in people's heads?
No one has ever said such a thing.

What people have said, is at this point activists are taking things to such an extreme, that people are afraid to voice an opinion that sways from their narrative. People are doing bizarre stuff to cover their asses when they have in fact done nothing wrong. I saw something today the BBC food website had pulled a load of recipes that referred to food such as "asian salad" for fear that this is racist. Next we will no longer be able to say we are going to a Chinese/Indian etc restaurant. It's getting out of hand.
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Old 28.06.2020, 22:31
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

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Now tell me again how racism is just all in people's heads?
You are getting to emotional, nobody here is saying that racism does not exist.
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Old 28.06.2020, 22:41
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

You’re just trying to justify not doing anything to end it. When are you going to share that article about Irish slaves?

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You are getting to emotional, nobody here is saying that racism does not exist.
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  #40  
Old 28.06.2020, 22:58
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Re: Jonathan Pie on "Woke Utopia"

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You’re just trying to justify not doing anything to end it. When are you going to share that article about Irish slaves?
Racism will never end.

You can try to end it in the western world, but this will do nothing about racism in Russia, the middle and far east.

All this emphasis on history, slave trade... what racism basically boils down to is running statistics on people and to base your decisions on that. This happens everywhere. Amazon keeps track of who buys what, and will notice regional and cultural preferences for certain goods. Is it racist that Amazon knows hair products to make an Afro are more sold in black neighbourhoods than in white ? Or that women buy more tampons than men (sexism !). Technically just tailoring the ads on your website is racist. This will never stop.
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