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View Poll Results: Who will win the US election?
Trump/Pence 11 52.38%
Biden/Harris 10 47.62%
Voters: 21. You may not vote on this poll

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  #3621  
Old 07.01.2021, 13:43
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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No goats, but grandchildren- otherwise I would agree talktoyoulater
It will be all over in a flash. Do you really want them to suffer through growing up pains of life?
  #3622  
Old 07.01.2021, 13:47
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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This is a large part of the problem, when are the media going to be held to account (or rather hold themselves to account), for what's going on?
They wont, that's the thing about freedom of speech - everyone is entitled to an opinion and TV opinions are designed to shape voters. One person, one vote is a core problem which we all know is a problem, but have no means of solving within the current framework of what we call "democracy".

Reminds me of the wise words of George Carlin - think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that
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  #3623  
Old 07.01.2021, 13:52
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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Reminds me of the wise words of George Carlin - think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that

George Carlin and Christopher Hitchens are two people I genuinely miss.
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  #3624  
Old 07.01.2021, 13:56
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

It'll be interesting to see why the police shot one of them dead.
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  #3625  
Old 07.01.2021, 14:03
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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You mean like this?

https://www.news.com.au/technology/o...d23cf5536c5d02

Or this?

https://twitter.com/jihanbit/status/1346909463660396550

I'll ask you now for a second time, to please give an example of what you claim I said.
So you see one incident like that and you assume it means that the police in general just let them in? Please watch the videos in the following links (and the photos that appear here) and then tell me that the protestors were just being "literally" allowed to enter the Capitol building by the police rather than forcing their way in:

Here you can see them repeatedly trying to break down the barricades to push themselves in and assaulting police officers:

https://twitter.com/i/status/1346894257206923265

And here you can see them breaking out windows of the Capitol building and then climbing inside through the broken windows:

https://edition.cnn.com/videos/polit...ect-biden-win/

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  #3626  
Old 07.01.2021, 14:15
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

At 0.04 on the video you can clearly see a Pride flag. How confused was this poor person?!
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  #3627  
Old 07.01.2021, 14:18
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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So you see one incident like that and you assume it means that the police in general just let them in? Please watch the videos in the following links (and the photos that appear here) and then tell me that the protestors were just being "literally" allowed to enter the Capitol building by the police rather than forcing their way in:

Here you can see them repeatedly trying to break down the barricades to push themselves in and assaulting police officers:

https://twitter.com/i/status/1346894257206923265

And here you can see them breaking out windows of the Capitol building and then climbing inside through the broken windows:

https://edition.cnn.com/videos/polit...ect-biden-win/
So you back up your lies and misrepresentation with more misrepresentation?

I'll ask you for a third time, please provide an example of what you claim.
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  #3628  
Old 07.01.2021, 14:24
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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At 0.04 on the video you can clearly see a Pride flag. How confused was this poor person?!
Probably has a flag for every protest.
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  #3629  
Old 07.01.2021, 14:27
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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It's a difficult task considering how fractured the country is. People who believe that because the Dems have won by a whisker that it will be the end of it are misguided. It all depends on how Joe Biden leads, if he makes moves to consider reach across the aisle then there's a chance things could improve.

People shouldn't be surprised by what happened yesterday, it's been a long time in coming. The media and Democrats worked every day to delegitimise Donald Trumo for four years based largely on lies, and that has now come to a head and President Trump has played right into their hands. The sheer hypocrisy over reporting of BLM, Antifa, protests against Brett Kavanaugh etc. compared to what happened yesterday will not have been lost on many, just stoking tensions further.

7 million votes is a whisker? Trump did this and countless people have fed the monster that is his fascist ego.

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Trump "delegitimised" himself.

Wake up.
Exactly.

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Which is why I said he played into their hands. He could have gone gracefully but his ego, which has been his undoing for the entirety of his Presidency, has gotten the better of him.

It's clear now too that he never wanted to win the Georgia runoffs as it doesn't fit with his personal narrative. Putting himself before everyone and everything has resulted in this outcome.
He played in the Democrats hands? Can you clarify? Are you suggesting that yesterday's atrocity was due to the Dems?


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"Won by a whisker"

A landslide, larger-than-Trump's-2016, 74-vote margin in the Electoral College... the largest number of votes ever for a single candidate in any US presidential election... a popular vote victory by a margin of 7,059,741... that's some whisker.


Indeed, the media and the Democrats used four years or more of Trump's incessant lies against him -- who would give up a gift like that? Trump delegitimized himself.
Yep

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Yes, your inability to understand statistics on display once again. 51% to 47% is a whisker. It's closer still if you look at the states that swung it for Mr Biden.
But the Brexit 1% or whatever is was was a landslide majority?


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Oh come on .. It must be one of the most heavily defended buildings in the world .. Everybody knew there was going be a protest, the police and national guard were right there.. It was 'stormed' by a bunch of old ladies, nutjobs and actors, not a heavily armed professional militia.

You seriously think that the building could not have been defended if they wanted to defend it? That's the delusion right there.
They had guns, zip ties and, allegedly, bombs. Gods know who they were trying to get.


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The threat to democracy isn't in what they did yesterday. The threat to democracy is in Trump's denial of having lost the election and his persistent encouragement of his supporters' belief in his delusions that the election results are invalid... even going so far as to pressure Pence and other Republicans to back him to try to overturn the election results.

But you can try to downplay the events of yesterday all you want. That doesn't change what happened. But clearly you think it's fine for Trump supporters to assault police officers and break into the Capitol building during a Congressional session, forcing that session to be brought to an end and all Congress members to be evacuated.

I'm willing to bet both my kidneys that if it was Biden supporters doing that, people like yourself and other Trump supporters would be calling them out on it.
I'll add a kidney too. Also, if they were black.


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So you back up your lies and misrepresentation with more misrepresentation?

I'll ask you for a third time, please provide an example of what you claim.
What lies and misrepresentations? The capitol building was stormed by a potentially violent mob. Staffers were told to take breathing apparatus/masks when they went to safer places in case of chemical attack.

Prove what you assert. Put your money where your mouth is. Stop with the spin and open your eyes, even if that worryingly narrow mind is a bit of a lost cause.



They need to get Trump out. Now.

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  #3630  
Old 07.01.2021, 14:30
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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Oh come on .. It must be one of the most heavily defended buildings in the world ..
Then Iíve got news for you. It isnít and doesnít claim to be.
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  #3631  
Old 07.01.2021, 14:30
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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So you back up your lies and misrepresentation with more misrepresentation?

I'll ask you for a third time, please provide an example of what you claim.
What I claim? I'm not even sure what you're referring to, Tony, so please elaborate and please quote me where I said it.

.
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  #3632  
Old 07.01.2021, 14:38
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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They wont, that's the thing about freedom of speech - everyone is entitled to an opinion and TV opinions are designed to shape voters. One person, one vote is a core problem which we all know is a problem, but have no means of solving within the current framework of what we call "democracy".

Reminds me of the wise words of George Carlin - think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that
I agree limits of democracy is being stretched as people who believe in democracy don't behave in the way that we saw yesterday (and have seen on and off for the past four years). If people don't believe their vote matters or that the system isn't working for them then they get violent.

I don't think freedom of speech is the problem though, nor do I think authoritarianism or censorship is the answer. I do believe tech, the internet and its effect on main stream media is the catalyst that is causing many of the problems we're seeing.
  #3633  
Old 07.01.2021, 14:42
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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What I claim? I'm not even sure what you're referring to, Tony, so please elaborate and please quote me where I said it.
-->

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But you can try to downplay the events of yesterday all you want. That doesn't change what happened. But clearly you think it's fine for Trump supporters to assault police officers and break into the Capitol building during a Congressional session, forcing that session to be brought to an end and all Congress members to be evacuated.
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As the truth and facts matter to many on this forum, please point to an example where I've said it's "fine" for Trump supporters to assault police?
  #3634  
Old 07.01.2021, 14:43
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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I agree limits of democracy is being stretched as people who believe in democracy don't behave in the way that we saw yesterday (and have seen on and off for the past four years). If people don't believe their vote matters or that the system isn't working for them then they get violent.

I don't think freedom of speech is the problem though, nor do I think authoritarianism or censorship is the answer. I do believe tech, the internet and its effect on main stream media is the catalyst that is causing many of the problems we're seeing.
Twitter and Facebook haven't banned Trump because he generates clicks.
  #3635  
Old 07.01.2021, 14:44
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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I'll add a kidney too. Also, if they were black.
if they were black they would not have made past the stairs. they would have been shot or tear gassed.

"White privilege is violently storming the US Capitol and just...being sent home"


that video of the lady rioter being helped back down the steps?

"My husband does not hold my hand as tenderly as that officer helping the terrorist down the steps"


taking selfies with the police? it just goes on and on...
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  #3636  
Old 07.01.2021, 14:46
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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Yes, I had commented with that because of what you had written below, where you were obviously trying to downplay the situation from yesterday:

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This is what I'm trying quite hard to understand. Why is the world losing their minds when the police literally opened up the front doors and let them in? The fact that the guy appearing on all the front pages is topless and wearing a Jamiroquai hat should give an indication of how much of a serious threat to democracy this posed.
  #3637  
Old 07.01.2021, 14:53
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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Yes, I had commented with that because of what you had written below, where you were obviously trying to downplay the situation from yesterday:
Downplaying the seriousness of the situation in relation to the media and international outcry for such reasons as many of the protestors being in fancy dress, mostly unarmed, were taking selfies with police, were allowed to gain access to the building by police is not the equivalent of saying it's fine to assault police? You do get that, right?!
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  #3638  
Old 07.01.2021, 15:01
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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So what is the issue? That Pancake added "you clearly think"? Is that what has your knickers knotted?
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  #3639  
Old 07.01.2021, 15:03
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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Downplaying the seriousness of the situation in relation to the media and international outcry for such reasons as many of the protestors being in fancy dress, mostly unarmed, were taking selfies with police, were allowed to gain access to the building by police is not the equivalent of saying it's fine to assault police? You do get that, right?!
Yeah, and this goes back to my original point. The police in general did NOT allow all the protesters to gain access to the building. See my earlier post, with the video links and the photos -- where protestors were breaking down barricades and trying to force their way in and breaking out windows of the Capitol building and climbing inside, scaling walls, etc. The video that you had posted shows one police officer finally opening a barricade after protestors were pushing their way in. That is NOT the police in general. My other statement was a hypothetical comment -- that if you believe the protesters were allowed in and did nothing wrong because they were simply taking selfies then you are okay with the fact that they were also assaulting police officers and breaking out windows, etc. Or is it that you just forgot to mention that and/or chose to ignore it?

Jesus. Trying to engage in an intelligent conversation with you is like trying to have a rational, intelligent conversation with a two-year old.

You clearly perceive and filter events according to what you want to be true rather than what is true. You cherry-pick information and ignore anything that conflicts with your cognitive biases.

I'm going to put you back on my ignore list because I'd rather not waste any more of my time trying to engage in rational conversations with irrational people on the Internet. Biden's win was made official today. This is a day of celebration for me -- not a day to waste arguing with denialists on the Internet.
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  #3640  
Old 07.01.2021, 15:04
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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Downplaying the seriousness of the situation in relation to the media and international outcry for such reasons as many of the protestors being in fancy dress, mostly unarmed, were taking selfies with police, were allowed to gain access to the building by police is not the equivalent of saying it's fine to assault police? You do get that, right?!
Ah. So you are now saying your words were misconstrued? How do you know they were mostly unarmed? Has that been verified? They looked like a fairly organised, violent mob. They chased police. Their body language alone was threatening.
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