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View Poll Results: Who will win the US election?
Trump/Pence 11 52.38%
Biden/Harris 10 47.62%
Voters: 21. You may not vote on this poll

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  #4041  
Old 13.01.2021, 21:31
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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And a total POS, like Pelosi.

Compared to those two, Trump looks reasonable.

Tom
Why (or how), exactly, are they unreasonable?
  #4042  
Old 13.01.2021, 21:33
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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Hence your confusion, because the trial need not be held immediately and can be held after Trump's term has ended.
No, this is not true. It is still a point of debate among legal scholars and far from certain whether the Senate can vote on his removal AFTER his term is over. Pelosi is obviously betting that it could be done AFTER, but it's not stated clear-cut in the constitution.

Check this, there are a few other good free sources, but this is the one I think explains it best

https://news.yahoo.com/can-trump-be-...210541103.html
  #4043  
Old 13.01.2021, 21:36
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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If President Trump is impeached, then in all likelihood he will be acquitted. What sort of precedent would that set?
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Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) sent a note to Republican colleagues Wednesday afternoon informing them that he remains undecided on whether to convict President Trump on an article of impeachment expected to be passed by the House.
Hmmmm..
  #4044  
Old 13.01.2021, 21:37
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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I have no idea how fine all this is to the 70mil supporters, to be honest, hence my post.
From what I can tell, his 70 million supporters are conflicted/split. Some are 100% behind him and are disappointed the riots didn't succeed in overturning the election. Others still think Trump is great but are mortified at what he said and how others acted. I think all of them are mad about his being cut off from social media, even if they understand the why.

Even the Republican party doesn't quite know what to do with itself. On the one hand the right thing to do would be to convict, remove from office, and bar from holding public office again. On the other hand, any Republican that votes for this knows he or she will face a primary challenge in the next election, and that challenge will come from a well-funded machine.

I did finally see that someone in Congress had proposed censure, which seems like a compromise that could get through.

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If President Trump is impeached, then in all likelihood he will be acquitted. What sort of precedent would that set?
He was already impeached and acquitted. In fact only three presidents have been impeached: Andrew Jackson, Bill Clinton, and Donald Trump. All three were acquitted.
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  #4045  
Old 13.01.2021, 21:39
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

I think people should study what reaction it will cause, this will not be taken well. Whoever is going to be blamed for it, it doesn't really matter at this point, I think. It just looks like they haven't metabolized 2016.
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  #4046  
Old 13.01.2021, 21:45
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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I think people should study what reaction it will cause, this will not be taken well. Whoever is going to be blamed for it, it doesn't really matter at this point, I think.
So Trump shouldn't be held accountable for instigating a violent riot on the Capitol for fear of what reactions that might cause -- if he is held accountable?

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It just looks like they haven't metabolized 2016.
If you mean by that what I think you mean by that, I think you need to ask yourself how Trump supporters have been 'metabolizing' Biden's win in 2020.
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  #4047  
Old 13.01.2021, 21:46
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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Even the Republican party doesn't quite know what to do with itself. On the one hand the right thing to do would be to convict, remove from office, and bar from holding public office again. On the other hand, any Republican that votes for this knows he or she will face a primary challenge in the next election, and that challenge will come from a well-funded machine.
I really think McConnell is tacitly supporting the impeachment as this will give him and the GOP enough ammo to purge Trump from the party.

The good news is that all seem to be now converging against him and hopefully they indeed manage to limit his options post 20th of Jan Let the man enjoy a well-deserved brake with a state-paid room and board in a prison of his choice!
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  #4048  
Old 13.01.2021, 22:26
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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I think people should study what reaction it will cause, this will not be taken well. Whoever is going to be blamed for it, it doesn't really matter at this point, I think. It just looks like they haven't metabolized 2016.
Of course it matters. Can't study something that hasn't happened yet. That's called guessing, no?

Haven't metabolized 2016? Like Trump's rabid fans are "metabolizing" Biden's win? I know you have a singular idiom but that's a peculiar word choice.

Just seen Pancakes response.

Last edited by RufusB; 13.01.2021 at 22:38.
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  #4049  
Old 13.01.2021, 22:26
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

Lawmakers in the House have passed the threshold of votes needed to impeach President Trump.
Voting continues.
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  #4050  
Old 13.01.2021, 22:26
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

This is all hopeless. They should form a governing triumphirate of Oprah Winfrey, Bruce Springsteen and Tom Brady for life.
  #4051  
Old 13.01.2021, 22:45
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

The ten Republicans’ votes made this the most bipartisan presidential impeachment in history.
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  #4052  
Old 13.01.2021, 23:09
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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He was already impeached and acquitted. In fact only three presidents have been impeached: Andrew Jackson, Bill Clinton, and Donald Trump. All three were acquitted.
It's your turn to add an "ETA" that 22 yards already said this...
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  #4053  
Old 13.01.2021, 23:16
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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The ten Republicans’ votes made this the most bipartisan presidential impeachment in history.
I posted a list of those 10 GOP Senators here. There are some surprisingly conservative Representatives on that list.
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  #4054  
Old 13.01.2021, 23:19
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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Why (or how), exactly, are they unreasonable?
Because Ticino Tom disagrees with them. No more no less.
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  #4055  
Old 13.01.2021, 23:40
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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The ten Republicans’ votes made this the most bipartisan presidential impeachment in history.
That's true, although 81 Republicans sided with the Democrats in voting not to levy a fourth impeachment charge, of abuse of power, on Bill Clinton -- which I guess would be the most bipartisan rejection of impeachment.
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  #4056  
Old 14.01.2021, 07:54
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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Did people get stuff reversed? Because they fear that 78yr old Trump will run again? That's a potent fear, like that's supposed to apease the 70mil supporters...Who do they consider these supporters to be, to remove Trump a few days before end, to prevent him running, to close his channels he talked to his people through..They think they will be ok with all that? Nobody talked to them before, through Twitter nor other way. They will not be happy with these quick maneuvres. 70mil voters aren't Chubaka whackos or confused folk coz "they did not know any better" as people here often say, patronizingly. This time now is too critical for treating the choice of millions of people as a 'lapse of reason', which removing their choice definitely comes across like. If they go ahead with this, they lost their next elections already. Vendetta is not a good political campaign. Biden gotta stop this or he'll face ton of problems, it's not fair to him.
Why do you assume the 70 million voters are a homogenous mass? You often seem to speak for large groups of people or assume things about them.

...and "talk to his people"? His people?
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  #4057  
Old 14.01.2021, 08:15
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

MC is apparently unable to understand that Trump's impeachment has nothing to do with a "vendetta agenda" but has everything to do with him being held accountable for his actions and the consequences of his actions.

Similarly, when someone is tried in a court of a law for a crime, they are not tried due to a "vendetta agenda." And if they are convicted and imprisoned, it is because they are viewed as a threat to society.

But clearly some people are desperately trying to change the narrative on all of this because in their minds, Trump is never accountable for his own actions or behavior and there is, instead, always someone else to blame.
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  #4058  
Old 14.01.2021, 08:18
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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He was already impeached and acquitted. In fact only three presidents have been impeached: Andrew Jackson, Bill Clinton, and Donald Trump. All three were acquitted.
I think I didn't make my point clearly enough. Since the impeachment last year, impeachment has now lost its gravity and the door has been left open for future Presidents to be impeached over any misdemeanor.

What I rather meant is how will it look, or rather how President Trump will manipulate the outcome once he is likely acquitted by the Senate? Won't he just say it exonerates of any wrong doing? This is why I'm not sure it's the best course of action (unless of course the votes are there).
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  #4059  
Old 14.01.2021, 08:18
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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But clearly some people are desperately trying to change the narrative on all of this because in their minds, Trump is never accountable for his own actions or behavior and there is, instead, always someone else to blame.
Yes, the mainstream media, the social media, everybody but the person who kept giving ammunition and material to his opponents. Never a step back and a moment of self-reflection, always on power trips.
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  #4060  
Old 14.01.2021, 08:27
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Re: Trump or Biden .Who you got?

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I think I didn't make my point clearly enough. Since the impeachment last year, impeachment has now lost its gravity and the door has been left open for future Presidents to be impeached over any misdemeanor.

What I rather meant is how will it look, or rather how President Trump will manipulate the outcome once he is likely acquitted by the Senate? Won't he just say it exonerates of any wrong doing? This is why I'm not sure it's the best course of action (unless of course the votes are there).
Even if the Senate did vote against Trump this time around, he would still play the victim about it and claim that he isn't guilty -- no matter what. Because that's what he does (as well as his followers).

I think the House would be foolish to refuse to impeach him simply for fear of any backlash (same with the Senate vote). To do that is the same as essentially catering to his demands as well as the demands of his support base. What kind of message does that get across if the US government allows a President to use lies and rhetoric to instigate a violent attack on the US Capitol but then refuse to hold him accountable for it?
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