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  #141  
Old 15.12.2020, 12:39
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

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One manīs freedom fighter is another manīs US, French and Israeli backed terrorist. At the end of the day it seems the poor guy was just another pawn in the great game.
https://www.tehrantimes.com/news/455...h-Zam-executed
Fakhrizadeh developed a nuclear bomb for a Tyrannical regime, as well as being a senior officer in an organization resposible for hostage taking, bombing and Turture. If you don't think it's a Terrorist organization then please provide a definition.

Zam was a journalist reporting the abuses of the said regime.

Some people don't see the difference.

Iran kidnapped Mr. Zam and killed him and bragged about it - It has no reason to complain when one of it's officers is killed.
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  #142  
Old 15.12.2020, 12:55
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

I am surprised that Israel did not blame the aliens
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  #143  
Old 15.12.2020, 13:26
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

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I think you are confusing criticism of the policies of the state of Israel as anti-Semitism.
Really?I havent seen all the " justice" people like you,saying nothing againts the dozens of countries with awful human records.
I havent seen the "indignant" like you,saying nothing againts UK or Turkey,for example,colonizing stolen foreign ground.
It seems you people have selective indignation.


Sadly I cant answer properly,since the moderator,A NON EUROPEAN,moderating an european forum,doesnt allow free speech.
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  #144  
Old 15.12.2020, 14:01
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

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Really?I havent seen all the " justice" people like you,saying nothing againts the dozens of countries with awful human records.
I havent seen the "indignant" like you,saying nothing againts UK or Turkey,for example,colonizing stolen foreign ground.
It seems you people have selective indignation.


Sadly I cant answer properly,since the moderator,A NON EUROPEAN,moderating an european forum,doesnt allow free speech.
Actually, it is a Swiss forum, not European.
And what is your connection with Switzerland?

Why do you believe free speech is allowed in a private forum?
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  #145  
Old 15.12.2020, 14:02
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

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No, he didn't.



In another thread you wanted advice how to enter banking / wealth management. This is exactly how NOT to

Dont worry,I already work in Banking,in one of the biggest international banks.
Sadly,in home office due to this terrible virus.
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  #146  
Old 15.12.2020, 14:04
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

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Actually, it is a Swiss forum, not European.
And what is your connection with Switzerland?

Why do you believe free speech is allowed in a private forum?

Switzerland sits in Africa?Wow,I failed geography,thanks.


Nothing,but then put,we,moderators,do whatever you want,and you,little people,must obey our wishes....
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  #147  
Old 15.12.2020, 14:26
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

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you,little people,must obey our wishes....
Spoken like a true banker!
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  #148  
Old 15.12.2020, 15:29
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

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In another thread you wanted advice how to enter banking / wealth management. This is exactly how NOT to
Actually, personal anecdote, I replied to open house ad once and expected a reply to schedule a viewing. I received no reply at all and after a few days decided to use my wife's Scandinavian last name instead of mine to reply to the same seller. Low and behold I received an immediate response form the owner (it was private, no-agent listing). I was by then fully expecting this from a Swiss, having numerous experiences with xenophobia...
Curious, I went ahead and found that guy on Linkedin, guess where he works? UBS wealth management department. Lol
So you might be not aware of the tone and caliber of the people occupying these positions in Central Europe.
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  #149  
Old 15.12.2020, 17:34
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

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Oh, absolutely, I have loads of those too. That doesn't mean that said banker/sales person is not a sub-optimal sales person as she/he clearly would have missed an opportunity for a quicker/less contentious sale. But then again, this has little to do with arielch's assertion that my criticism of Israel's policy is anti-Semitic, which it isn't, of course.
I understand though where he is coming from, he pretty clearly stated the double standard Western societies apply to Israel vs. any other country.
1. Israel is held to a higher expectations and standards than any surrounding country. Which is clearly racist and bigoted (according to liberal bible towards their less developed neighbors. Different example: France is allowed to perform atrocities on massive scale far away from their territory, so as NATO, Israel is not allowed to kill in defense because Jews are no longer viewed as victims, etc etc The examples are numerous. And such attitudes are clearly anti-semitic.
2. Gentiles cannot adjust still to the notion of Jews no longer acting as passive victims of their offenders (phycological problem me thinks) stemming from a 2000 y.o. pattern.
3. Most modern Socialist (read liberal) movements carry heavy undercurrent of antisemitism stemming from a general disappointment that Jews (of all people) managed to join the upper economic classes of societies they live in not by class struggle or revolution but by working within the system and becoming HAVES instead of persecuted and marginalized HAVE NOTS. For that , Socialists will never forgive the Jews.
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  #150  
Old 15.12.2020, 19:07
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

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Double standards are the rule of the game ever since there's been Homo Sapiens roaming the planet and it's not Israel's monopoly to complain about it. Practically EVERY country in this world can claim that at some point its being treated that way.

In short, the moral term "double standards" is called "Realpolitik" in the real world
Nobody says it is a monopoly of Israel, don't get angry. You just punting to ''double standards are the norm'', it is deflective and unconvincing. If you think about what you wrote for a second you'd realize what double standards mean and that they can be applied both ways: 1. Gloss over atrocities and backwardness which liberals gladly do for nearly every repugnant regime in the World or 2. Call for defunding and boycotting the nation that merely defends its right to exist, which liberals gladly do vis a vis Israel.
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  #151  
Old 15.12.2020, 20:29
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

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Oh, absolutely, I have loads of those too. That doesn't mean that said banker/sales person is not a sub-optimal sales person as she/he clearly would have missed an opportunity for a quicker/less contentious sale. But then again, this has little to do with arielch's assertion that my criticism of Israel's policy is anti-Semitic, which it isn't, of course.
Me labelling antisemites to the people who lambast Israel,is not just directed at you,there are plenty of other antisemites in this forum.
For example,you complain about illegal takings of land an ocupation,well,you have the UK,and Trukey,just to name European countries,doing the same,when are you going to say something in regards?
Regarding sales,I have plenty of experience,dont worry,im not here to sell,i registered myself here,to get advice and took ideas,for the day Ill move to Switzerland,in fact,Im working in banking in Poland now,a country I never wanted to live in,on advice from people here,who told me,that I needed to acquiere banking experience first.

Last edited by arielch; 15.12.2020 at 20:30. Reason: grammar
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  #152  
Old 15.12.2020, 21:26
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

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You are clearly looking at this one-sided. Israel has illegally occupied vast spaces of land, effectively annexing the occupied lands to it's territory, while at the same time denying the people there the right to vote which makes Israel a non-democracy by todays standards. This goes far and beyond "the right to exist" which nobody (except Iran's clerical regime) has put a question on.

I am not sure who you call "liberals", but a certain non-liberal US President and his fans are quite ok with the atrocities within the US, the atrocities in Saudi Arabia, the atrocities in Israel, the atrocities in Egypt, the atrocities....you get my point.

And thus, we reach to the point I made - In short, the moral term "double standards" is called "Realpolitik" in the real world and happens all the time both ways.



You have completely missed my point: I am not "complaining" as I have no skin in this game, nor do I feel a victim of any sort. I observe and comment from the sidelines. I already said it a few times, but it looks like you need me to say it again - in the specific Iran vs. US/Israel/Saudi conflict, NOBODY is innocent and all are to be blamed for the atrocities towards each other.

Btw, the same goes for Israel vs. Palestine : both are to be blamed and none of the sides has any sort of moral high ground.
Fine,the UK,and Turkey,illegally ocuppy lands,when are you going to mention that?
Btw,from whom Israel occupies land?
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  #153  
Old 15.12.2020, 21:42
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

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You are clearly looking at this one-sided. Israel has illegally occupied vast spaces of land, effectively annexing the occupied lands to it's territory, while at the same time denying the people there the right to vote which makes Israel a non-democracy by todays standards. This goes far and beyond "the right to exist" which nobody (except Iran's clerical regime) has put a question on.

I am not sure who you call "liberals", but a certain non-liberal US President and his fans are quite ok with the atrocities within the US, the atrocities in Saudi Arabia, the atrocities in Israel, the atrocities in Egypt, the atrocities....you get my point.

And thus, we reach to the point I made - In short, the moral term "double standards" is called "Realpolitik" in the real world and happens all the time both ways.



You have completely missed my point: I am not "complaining" as I have no skin in this game, nor do I feel a victim of any sort. I observe and comment from the sidelines. I already said it a few times, but it looks like you need me to say it again - in the specific Iran vs. US/Israel/Saudi conflict, NOBODY is innocent and all are to be blamed for the atrocities towards each other.
You may not feel like a victim but it seems to me that when politicians mess things up, we are all paying for it. It is a bit like with ecological disasters. Or economy crisis sneaking up on us, unnoticed.

Everyone I know is somehow affected by the Middle East crisis, even if indirectly.

I know you meant this, too..I just want to say that you don't need to prove the credibility of your opinion by saying you have no stakes in this mess. We all do. Your opinion is legit.
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  #154  
Old 15.12.2020, 21:59
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

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It's worth checking the thread topic. Let me remind you that it's a thread about an Iranian scientist (or terrorist, depends who you ask) killed most likely by Israel. What does the UK and Turkey occupying lands have to do with that? Create a thread about it and we can debate it there


I was referring specifically to the Iran conflict But yes, sure, we're all victims of political decisions, no question there, it's only a matter of degree.

You think all other secret services dont kill people?the sdece,MI6cia,and so forth?The world of intelligence is a dirty business.
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  #155  
Old 16.12.2020, 14:20
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

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You are clearly looking at this one-sided. Israel has illegally occupied vast spaces of land, effectively annexing the occupied lands to it's territory, while at the same time denying the people there the right to vote which makes Israel a non-democracy by todays standards. This goes far and beyond "the right to exist" which nobody (except Iran's clerical regime) has put a question on.
This is not true obviously. So called Palestinians don't recognize Israel right to exist. It is a common knowledge you choose to ignore for some reason.
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You are clearly looking at this one-sided. Israel has illegally occupied vast spaces of land, effectively annexing the occupied lands to it's territory, while at the same time denying the people there the right to vote which makes Israel a non-democracy by todays standards.
So called Palestinians are self-governed and free to move about their settlement areas (West Bank and Gaza). Israel has ended military occupation of these areas in 1982, but you choose to ignore this fact for some reason. So called Palestinians don't have a right to vote in Israel for the same reason Puerto Ricans don't vote in US elections or Italians don't vote in French. It is not a unique situation and calling Israel NOT A DEMOCRACY based on this is a mistake you choose to make.
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I am not sure who you call "liberals", but a certain non-liberal US President and his fans are quite ok with the atrocities within the US, the atrocities in Saudi Arabia, the atrocities in Israel, the atrocities in Egypt, the atrocities....you get my point.
Mute point as I am referring to liberals and socialists (DNC, Socialist parties of EU, US and L. America, Communists, etc. etc.) who are actively and openly anti-Semitic in a press and public life, specifically vis a vis Israel while remaining quiet about human rights violations , ethnic cleansing, press censorship, persecution of women and minorities around the World. The reason they choose to focus on Israel cannot be explained by anything other than deep seeded, engendered anti-Semitism.
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And thus, we reach to the point I made - In short, the moral term "double standards" is called "Realpolitik" in the real world and happens all the time both ways.
Repeating a sophistic argument multiple times does not make it any more true. You seem to not understand the meaning of the terms you are trying to use to fortify your arguments.
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  #156  
Old 16.12.2020, 18:53
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

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I think you have revealed your prejudices too early which makes any argument of yours on that topic weak. It helps to be a tad more discreet Moreover, this thread is not about Palestine, I understand you and arielch have some biases and want to turn this into an Israeli discussion but please don't. Create another thread and we can depreciate our keyboards there.
Iran is an anti-west, anti-free media, anti-women, anti-gay country.

One would expect itis image and public relations to be similar to North Korea's.

However - Many are claiming Neutrality, or "Iran is just as bad as the others (read: Israel) " - which it is obviously not.

Why ?
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  #157  
Old 16.12.2020, 18:53
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

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I think you have revealed your prejudices too early which makes any argument of yours on that topic weak. It helps to be a tad more discreet Moreover, this thread is not about Palestine, I understand you and arielch have some biases and want to turn this into an Israeli discussion but please don't. Create another thread and we can depreciate our keyboards there.
On a contrary, I simply do not repeat prevailing nonsense fed by the media machines.
Arabs currently living on territory of Ancient Egypt call themselves Egyptians, which is just as absurd as Arabs living on territory of Ancient Palestine (named after Philistines by Romans) call themselves Palestinians.
The naming situations would be just as grotesque if, for example; Turks would have called themselves Byzantines.
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  #158  
Old 16.12.2020, 20:21
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

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Absolutely! EVEN IF Iran was secular and semi-normal, acquiring a nuclear bomb would only be increasing the overall volatility, not decreasing it. The fact that it's ruled by a bunch of religious fanatics who cannot be trusted makes their acquisition of a nuclear bomb extremely dangerous and should be stopped at all costs. Luckily, everyone that matters (Dems, GOP, EU, China, Russia) is on that page.
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Having said that, the fact that Iran IS a bad actor, doesn't make it's enemies GOOD actors. My point is that in this particular conflict ALL actors are bad and ALL actors are contributing to the volatility. Comparing whose less bad is counterproductive as it sort of implies that one side has a moral high ground. Neither do.
Iran has no justification for denying Israel its right to exist. Israel does not question Iran's. Which does not mean Israel is on the high ground, it rather shows how abysmal the Iranian approach is (again, mostly of of self-justification of their cleptocratic regime).
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  #159  
Old 16.12.2020, 20:37
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

It is the intent of actions that matter. What is the intent of Israely actions? Do they simply hate muslim scientists?

What is the intent of Iranians? Do they simply want nuclear energy cause they ran out of oil reserves?

I think it is all too obvious...
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Old 16.12.2020, 20:40
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Re: Nuclear Scientist killed in Iran.

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Iran's challenge to Israel's existence is a classic WTF. It's mere rhetoric, which can never be actioned while at the same time discredits almost everything the mullahs say re the outside world. It's true that recently they have subdued this and the last time I remember someone high up mentioning it officially was Ahmadinejad and now he's sidelined even by his own conservative circles (although he's rumored to want to run for president next summer and apparently he's learned how to use a mobile phone with Tweeter so this has the promise of absurd Tweets which could entertain us for a while)
But you would agree that this is a difficult starting point to be "morally" on a level playing field?
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