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  #101  
Old 13.02.2021, 23:07
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

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result: 57-43.
Trump won. He's back.
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  #102  
Old 13.02.2021, 23:11
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

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Exactly. Mitch's words may seem honourable, but his actions are spineless and unprincipled.
Is what the Dems did to get Clinton off the hook honorable and principled?

Do you think it helps to overcome the divide that Pelosi calls all GOP members on Capitol Hill and Trump enemies of the state? Or that she claimed that the election in 2016 was stolen?

Basically everybody expects "honorable" action when it suits them, and closes both eyes when it doesn't.
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  #103  
Old 13.02.2021, 23:32
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

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Is what the Dems did to get Clinton off the hook honorable and principled?

Do you think it helps to overcome the divide that Pelosi calls all GOP members on Capitol Hill and Trump enemies of the state? Or that she claimed that the election in 2016 was stolen?

Basically everybody expects "honorable" action when it suits them, and closes both eyes when it doesn't.

Politics is like soccer/football...small fouls and yellow cards are part of the game/theatrics, but the boundaries are clear. Trump was way over the line in all respects, a pure narcissist with autocratic ambitions. Had it not been for COVID, he would have almost certainly got a 2nd term and completely destroyed the guardrails.



This impeachment was lose-lose for the dems: not to go ahead would have made them look like pussies, going ahead with the outcome pre-determined empowers Trump and other kooks alike.



As others have pointed out, impeachment is a political process, not a judicial one. Those reckonings will arrive sooner than later.
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  #104  
Old 13.02.2021, 23:32
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

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Exactly. Mitch's words may seem honourable, but his actions are spineless and unprincipled.
Now trying to play both sides after the vote
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Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell called the Jan. 6 Capitol attack a “disgrace.”

"They did this because they had been fed wild falsehoods by the most powerful man on Earth. Because he was angry. He had lost an election.
Former President Trump's actions preceded the riot were a disgraceful, disgraceful dereliction of duty," McConnell said.
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  #105  
Old 13.02.2021, 23:35
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

Trump is acquitted on the 1st article
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  #106  
Old 14.02.2021, 00:18
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

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No, but I think it was important to show the consequences of Trump‘s actions.
Perhaps, but realistically a waste of time and money.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-56056310

Tom
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  #107  
Old 14.02.2021, 00:25
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

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Perhaps, but realistically a waste of time and money.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-56056310

Tom
Probably cost less than just one of Trump's golf trips, rumoured to have cost hundreds of millions over four years. Not that I mind, he could do little damage to the country/world while busy playing.
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  #108  
Old 14.02.2021, 09:54
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

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Trump won. He's back.
Neither is the case.
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  #109  
Old 14.02.2021, 10:16
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

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Politics is like soccer/football...small fouls and yellow cards are part of the game/theatrics, but the boundaries are clear.
More like Kindergarden
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  #110  
Old 14.02.2021, 11:10
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

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Neither is the case.
His brand has suffered a lot of damage.
Even Mitch McConnell was calling yesterday for civil or criminal cases against Trump.
Mitch probably sees longer-term the risk if Trump stays involved in politics and starts, for example, putting up his own candidates in primaries where he feels the incumbent treated him unfairly.
Such actions will split the GOP between traditionalists and the extreme Trumpers so ensuring Trump was the last GOP President.
  #111  
Old 14.02.2021, 11:19
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

Polls are showing Trump's popularity at all time low. Republican registered voters leaving by the tens of thousands. His other legal problems hopefully mounting. His "base" is still there and he controls it, but the platform gets smaller.

Biden's to f--- up. He needs to stay in the center, and hope that the stock market does not correct too hard.
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  #112  
Old 14.02.2021, 11:34
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

Good and clever statement by Biden.
President Biden on late Saturday night issued a statement on the acquittal of former President Trump, in which he said that he was thinking about those who protected the Capitol on Jan. 6, adding that though Republican senators largely did not vote against Trump, the “substance of the charge” was not in dispute.

“Even those opposed to the conviction, like Senate Minority Leader McConnell, believe Donald Trump was guilty of a ‘disgraceful dereliction of duty’ and ‘practically and morally responsible for provoking’ the violence unleashed on the Capitol.”

He was referring to the fact that most GOP senators who voted for acquittal said it was because they believed it was unconstitutional not because they thought Trump was innocent of the charges.
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  #113  
Old 14.02.2021, 11:48
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

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Cowards
Absolutely!
It is a stain on America's history, and sends a really clear message. You can pretty much do anything as President of the United States and get away with it!

Sad!
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  #114  
Old 14.02.2021, 11:52
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

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Trump won. He's back.
Yes, winners usually throw massive temper tantrums that result in voter fraud attempts, a riot on the nation’s capital, that resulted in death and feces smeared on walls and being the first POTUS to be impeached twice.

Impeachment is the opposite of a fair trial, where juries are selected in order to make sure there are no biases and are most definitely not made of co-conspirators themselves. Time will only tell if Trump will rightfully face a real judge and jury ... but he is anything but a winner.
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  #115  
Old 14.02.2021, 12:01
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

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Trump won. He's back.
Yes but will he be back to buy Greenland to expand his golfing empire ?
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  #116  
Old 14.02.2021, 12:50
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

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Absolutely!
It is a stain on America's history, and sends a really clear message. You can pretty much do anything as President of the United States and get away with it!

Sad!
Disagree. This is much more a sign of the incompetence and lack of any political skill in the Dem leadership than anything else. Already a month ago it was clear that the GOP will NOT vote along the Dems. This is far more damaging now that it would have been if they had NOT proceeded with the second impeachment and had instead prosecuted Trump for taxes. Now they have absolutely cemented the perception among millions of Americans that this is a witch-hunt AND have shown that they are everything but competent in all things Senate. Pelosi should have been removed long time ago.

I cannot quote myself from a thread that's closed, but the post is here:

https://www.englishforum.ch/internat...ml#post3260366
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  #117  
Old 14.02.2021, 13:57
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

A split in the Republican Party is absolutely something that benefits the democrats in a winner takes all system such as the us electoral system . Not just for the presidency but on all levels of government .

It is thus not unlikely that at least parts of the Democratic Party are trying to play this tactically to foster that division .

But it is a dangerous game that can easily backfire . The Tea Party similarly initially caused a lot of damage to the GOP but in the longer term came back and hurt the Democrats.
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  #118  
Old 14.02.2021, 14:07
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

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It is thus not unlikely that at least parts of the Democratic Party are trying to play this tactically to foster that division
This would have been a credible theory IF the Dem leadership had shown at least some political cunning; so far, it's showing incompetence that is mind-boggling. Just the handling of the whole show yesterday and their inability to even control the impeachment which they triggered should tell you something. At some point this looked like a saga that will drag on for possibly weeks and months with witnesses coming and stalling. This would have ripped Biden of his ability to push for legislation, much more important topic than the personal vendetta of Pelosi.

I still believe, the best course of action is leave Trump our of the spotlight for a couple of months, this is what he hates and then prosecute him for taxes in the fall and then have Biden pardon him after a few other months.
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  #119  
Old 14.02.2021, 14:26
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

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This would have been a credible theory IF the Dem leadership had shown at least some political cunning; so far, it's showing incompetence that is mind-boggling.
I disagree. I give them a ton of credit for creating a lot emotional reaction around the Capitol siege and impeachment theatrics. They did it through media who of course played along since emotion means visibility an ratings. It was well executed on their part, they manipulated a lot of smart people into believing their narrative and caving into emotions.

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This would have ripped Biden of his ability to push for legislation, much more important topic than the personal vendetta of Pelosi.
This was obvious from the start. I think she's in for hard times.

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I still believe, the best course of action is leave Trump our of the spotlight for a couple of months, this is what he hates and then prosecute him for taxes in the fall and then have Biden pardon him after a few other months.
I think this will happen.
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  #120  
Old 14.02.2021, 14:43
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Re: Trump - post Presidency thread

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I disagree. I give them a ton of credit for creating a lot emotional reaction around the Capitol siege and impeachment theatrics. They did it through media who of course played along since emotion means visibility an ratings. It was well executed on their part, they manipulated a lot of smart people into believing their narrative and caving into emotions.
Yes, the Democrats were emotional and theatric in comparison to the violent mob in Buffalo Bill costume who built a hanging platform and smeared poop on the walls.

Honestly - I’m sick of Tories and Czechs thinking they have any proper perspective on American politics. You don’t see me commenting on frequently or as a subject matter expert on Brexit threads...
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