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  #41  
Old 07.07.2021, 23:08
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

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It was a riot instigated by a sitting President as part of an attempt to over throw the democratic process.
What part of Trump's speech precisely instigated a riot ?
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Old 07.07.2021, 23:28
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

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Letís take this apart step by step .

Just suppose an angry mob had managed to intervene in the congressional session .

And just imagine they had forced a different outcome to the meetings being held there , even to the point of declaring Trump as winner of the election .

Do you honestly believe for one moment that such a decision would have any value ? No, it would be declared void the very next day .

I repeat . At no point was the existence of democracy in the USA even remotely in question . Anybody who claims otherwise is trying to leverage this politically . And itís a very ugly and dishonest thing to do .

As such it was just a riot like any other . A question of public unrest that should be treated as such .

Just like, FOR EXAMPLE, the BLM riots .

That for example is not saying two wrongs make a right . It is showing that one riot is being treated differently to another for political purposes .
What does that matter??? All you're doing is trying to downplay it, once again. It's like saying "Well, the guy that broke into your house with a gun didn't actually have the chance to steal anything valuable or end up shooting anyone, therefore he's not really guilty of doing anything wrong."

This was not "just a riot like any other." This was a violent attack on the Capitol building in which the protestors attacked the Capitol police and broke out windows of the Capitol in order to push their way inside during the certification of an election after the (then) President told them to march down to the Capitol and "show strength" because (as Trump said) the election had been stolen from him.

I'm not sure you're even capable of having an intelligent conversation about this because clearly you're wearing the blindfold of cognitive bias. Do you think that the protestors who broke into the Capitol building and/or assaulted Capitol police officers that day should not be held accountable?
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Old 07.07.2021, 23:39
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

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What part of Trump's speech precisely instigated a riot ?
You know but anyway
"'If you don't fight like hell you're not going to have a country anymore".
"We are going to the Capitol"
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  #44  
Old 07.07.2021, 23:45
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

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I'm not sure you're even capable of having an intelligent conversation about this because clearly you're wearing the blindfold of cognitive bias. Do you think that the protestors who broke into the Capitol building and/or assaulted Capitol police officers that day should not be held accountable?
I have made it amply clear that they should be held accountable , to the same extent as any other riot .

You are the one who is blind to this , who is deliberately misreading my words and is trying to put other words into my mouth .
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  #45  
Old 08.07.2021, 00:10
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

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It is showing that one riot is being treated differently to another for political purposes .
Indeed, so far ca. 500 people have been arrested over Jan 6 versus ca. 14,000 over the BLM protests - see the difference?
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  #46  
Old 08.07.2021, 01:19
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

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Tell that to the police officer who had his head bashed in with a fire extinguisher.
Not true. Sicknick died from stroke, his death was declared a natural one.

It's mindblowing how people keep overblowing the event to this day, and choose to ignore the reality of what actually happened.
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I'm not sure you're even capable of having an intelligent conversation about this because clearly you're wearing the blindfold of cognitive bias. Do you think that the protestors who broke into the Capitol building and/or assaulted Capitol police officers that day should not be held accountable?
The usual personal attack, no surprise there.

Looking forward to your totally professional psychological online diagnosis of amogles. Or anybody else, for that matter. Come to think of it, I almost miss your "he's a psychopath" and "that's a sociopath". Almost.
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Indeed, so far ca. 500 people have been arrested over Jan 6 versus ca. 14,000 over the BLM protests - see the difference?
The study you used to love to use mentioned some 600 BLM riots, and that's only until August 2020 or so. Do the math (23 per BLM riot) - see the difference?

Of course that implies that each and every one of the other 8'000 BLM protests were 100% peaceful. I hope you agree at least silently that's an otherworldly and completely unrealistic assumption. And that doesn't even touch on the lawless 'autonomous' zones.

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  #47  
Old 08.07.2021, 07:01
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

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What part of Trump's speech precisely instigated a riot ?
Go listen to the speeches and if you donít understand it as clear as the mob did then you have a problem!
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  #48  
Old 08.07.2021, 07:41
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

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I have made it amply clear that they should be held accountable , to the same extent as any other riot .

You are the one who is blind to this , who is deliberately misreading my words and is trying to put other words into my mouth .
We are not misreading your words, you are perfectly clear. You seek to trivialize an attempt to frustrate the democratic process in the USA as if it was mob breaking into store to steal a couple of TVs. Well if you think that your democracy is worth no more than a couple of TVs, then that is disappointing.

A generation of Americans thought democracy was so precious they were willing to die for it and for the Republicans to fail to defend that right, to fail to appreciate that there are principles higher than party politics is unbelievable. There should be no question of a politician having exhausted all the legal remedies being allowed to go further and to receive the support of one of the two main parties in the country in doing so.

And to see, what I thought were intelligent people behave like lackies parroting off the same nonsense is shocking.
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Old 08.07.2021, 07:52
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

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Not true. Sicknick died from stroke, his death was declared a natural one.

It's mindblowing how people keep overblowing the event to this day, and choose to ignore the reality of what actually happened.
.
Yes it is mind blowing to think that anyone watching the events of the day would seek to the manís death from them. The man was going to die of natural causes that day anyway, sure of courseÖ.

Party politics versus core principles upon which the state was founded and party politics wins, utterly disappointing.
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Old 08.07.2021, 07:55
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

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We are not misreading your words, you are perfectly clear. You seek to trivialize an attempt to frustrate the democratic process in the USA as if it was mob breaking into store to steal a couple of TVs. Well if you think that your democracy is worth no more than a couple of TVs, then that is disappointing.
At what moment was the democracy of the USA in danger ?

Nowhere in the constitution is there any mention that whoever breaks into the. Capitol building holds the power . In history we had things like the stone of Scone or magical crowns and scepters blessed by God himself or magical seashells and skulls of ancestors and whoever had them in their hand had the rightful power . And if anybody stole them there was an existential crisis of the kingdom .

The whole point about democracy is that no . We moved beyond that concept. The magical skull on a stick has been replaced by an abstract one that the mob can’t steal . Thanks to 200 years plus of enlightenment .

There is no holy seat of power and there is no magical scepter . You can burn the capitol building to the ground as if it were a Walmart store and that is pure vandalism , nothing else . Or iconoclasm if you like . Or a minor inconvenience for the working of government .

You know , during WW2 the entire British empire was governed from a disused tube station . The Germans could have bombed Westminster and it would have made no difference . Nobody suggested such a relocation was an attack on democracy .
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Old 08.07.2021, 08:12
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

Oh goodness...

You are comparing protests & ensuing riots over systemic racism for centuries with a bunch of crybaby rednecks who didn’t get their way and decided to violently attacked the HQ of the nations government. They smeared poop on the walls for goodness sakes!!

My question to you is, if the rolls were reversed and it was “Antifa” or BLM who invaded the capitol, how would your opinion stand now? Would you say the reaction to it was “overblown”?

P.S. This was an attack on democracy - quite basic really, they tried to overthrow a democratic election.
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Old 08.07.2021, 09:01
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

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At what moment was the democracy of the USA in danger ?

Nowhere in the constitution is there any mention that whoever breaks into the. Capitol building holds the power . In history we had things like the stone of Scone or magical crowns and scepters blessed by God himself or magical seashells and skulls of ancestors and whoever had them in their hand had the rightful power . And if anybody stole them there was an existential crisis of the kingdom .

The whole point about democracy is that no . We moved beyond that concept. The magical skull on a stick has been replaced by an abstract one that the mob canít steal . Thanks to 200 years plus of enlightenment .

There is no holy seat of power and there is no magical scepter . You can burn the capitol building to the ground as if it were a Walmart store and that is pure vandalism , nothing else . Or iconoclasm if you like . Or a minor inconvenience for the working of government .

You know , during WW2 the entire British empire was governed from a disused tube station . The Germans could have bombed Westminster and it would have made no difference . Nobody suggested such a relocation was an attack on democracy .
So, because they were unsuccessful at overturning an election and stopping certification of the votes, are we supposed to completely ignore their attempts?

In the future, whenever Americans are unhappy with the outcome of an election, should it be considered perfectly acceptable for them to storm the Capitol building, and assault police officers, etc. in an attempt to overturn that election process, as long as they're unsuccessful in their attempt?
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Old 08.07.2021, 09:14
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

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So, because they were unsuccessful at overturning an election and stopping certification of the votes, are we supposed to completely ignore their attempts?

In the future, whenever Americans are unhappy with the outcome of an election, should it be considered perfectly acceptable for them to storm the Capitol building, and assault police officers, etc. in an attempt to overturn that election process, as long as they're unsuccessful in their attempt?
How about we reverse the question .

Every time a member of a minority gets killed by a rogue cop , should it be perfectly acceptable to burn down thousands of Wal Mart stores, because you know , in a mature democratic society thatís how you deal with cops who have gone bad ?
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Old 08.07.2021, 09:16
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

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Not true. Sicknick died from stroke, his death was declared a natural one.

It's mindblowing how people keep overblowing the event to this day, and choose to ignore the reality of what actually happened.

The usual personal attack, no surprise there.

Looking forward to your totally professional psychological online diagnosis of amogles. Or anybody else, for that matter. Come to think of it, I almost miss your "he's a psychopath" and "that's a sociopath". Almost.

The study you used to love to use mentioned some 600 BLM riots, and that's only until August 2020 or so. Do the math (23 per BLM riot) - see the difference?

Of course that implies that each and every one of the other 8'000 BLM protests were 100% peaceful. I hope you agree at least silently that's an otherworldly and completely unrealistic assumption. And that doesn't even touch on the lawless 'autonomous' zones.
Sicknik was assaulted -two men have been charged, how can you claim that is not true? The OP did not claim it caused his death as you are implying.

It is also ugly and dishonest to keep referring to the BLM protests as riots
The Major Cities Chiefs Association, a professional association comprised of local law enforcement heads from the 69 largest police agencies in the United States produced a report stating violence was limited to 7% of BLM protests.
So it is not an otherworldly and completely unrealistic assumption that the other protests were peaceful, it is supported by facts from the people who know.
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Old 08.07.2021, 09:17
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

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How about we reverse the question .

Every time a member of a minority gets killed by a rogue cop , should it be perfectly acceptable to burn down thousands of Wal Mart stores, because you know , in a mature democratic society thatís how you deal with cops who have gone bad ?
Is your real name Tucker Carlson?
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Old 08.07.2021, 09:18
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

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So, because they were unsuccessful at overturning an election and stopping certification of the votes, are we supposed to completely ignore their attempts?
They were not just unsuccesful at overturning an election. They weren't even remotely close. It is delusional to think that anything they could have done would have had any effect on the election.

What happened at the capitol was iconoclasm. The same as tearing down statues. It is going after symbols of things.

At the end of the day it is ignorant vandalism, pure and simple. There are laws against that.
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Old 08.07.2021, 09:28
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

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They were not just unsuccesful at overturning an election. They weren't even remotely close. It is delusional to think that anything they could have done would have had any effect on the election.

What happened at the capitol was iconoclasm. The same as tearing down statues. It is going after symbols of things.

At the end of the day it is ignorant vandalism, pure and simple. There are laws against that.
Not vandalism but terrorism. From the UN, terrorism involves the intimidation or coercion of governments through the perpetration of violence causing death, serious injury.
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Old 08.07.2021, 09:52
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

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Not vandalism but terrorism. From the UN, terrorism involves the intimidation or coercion of governments through the perpetration of violence causing death, serious injury.
Can you show me one member of government who was intimidated to the point that they even vaguely considered giving in to the demands of the people who invaded the Capitol?

If just going through threatening motions is terrorism, every hate preacher is a terrorist.
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Old 08.07.2021, 10:01
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

I think that what happened on a federal level continues to embolden state legislatures to adopt more restrictive voting procedures that run along party lines. Thatís a problem because itís unfair, and itís a distraction. In that sense, it is an attempt to weaken democracy.
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Old 08.07.2021, 10:01
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Re: January 6 US Capitol Insurrection

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How about we reverse the question .

Every time a member of a minority gets killed by a rogue cop , should it be perfectly acceptable to burn down thousands of Wal Mart stores, because you know , in a mature democratic society thatís how you deal with cops who have gone bad ?
It is absolutely not OK, and please show me where ďthousandsĒ of Wal Mart stores were burned down.

Can you please answer my question now?
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