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  #281  
Old 22.08.2021, 22:43
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

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.....And rightfully so, the refugees need to be hosted by the countries that created them in the first place. I heard George W has quite a bit of a ranch...
Hmmm, I've been thinking this for a while now the first part as well as the Bush-ranch part.

The problem is that neither the US nor Germany are known to sweep up the messes they cause.

On the other hand Amrullah Saleh has claimed the office of acting president of Afghanistan on 17 August 2021. Isn't that reason to stay?
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  #282  
Old 22.08.2021, 22:45
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

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And rightfully so, the refugees need to be hosted by the countries that created them in the first place. I heard George W has quite a bit of a ranch...
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  #283  
Old 22.08.2021, 22:50
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

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On the other hand Amrullah Saleh has claimed the office of acting president of Afghanistan on 17 August 2021. Isn't that reason to stay?
Saleh is CIA and his (already former?) partner Masoud junior is MI6, so who knows. But it did not work for Juan "admire my Rolex and Trump-level fake tan while I pilfer billions" Guaido, so I think Saleh will be left to hang, hopefully just figuratively.
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  #284  
Old 22.08.2021, 23:36
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

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And rightfully so, the refugees need to be hosted by the countries that created them in the first place. I heard George W has quite a bit of a ranch...
Plenty of burning and daisycutting to do at Bush ranch, and of course shooting to your heart's contents ... heck it must remind him of what he so unfortunately missed in 'Nam.
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  #285  
Old 22.08.2021, 23:37
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

And the trailers are already there, since that's where a worthy president must keep the staff...

Pic at https://cryptome.org/eyeball/bush-ranch/bush-ranch.htm

Last edited by XDr; 23.08.2021 at 00:05. Reason: removed pic for size
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  #286  
Old 23.08.2021, 07:17
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

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Can't compare the two though. Austria is not a NATO member and has a well understood role within Europe. It barely sent anyone to Afghanistan, and effectively only as observers. So it does not have any Afghan translator/"partner" of whatever ilk to extract, which is the only group any of the Western invaders has agreed to help.
Switzerland is in the same situation, by the way. No Kurz politics, but it does not owe Afghan collaborators anything.

For Czechia, like most Eastern European countries, Afghanistan was the opportunity to prove themselves to NATO, having all but missed out on the turkey shoots and dismemberment of Yugoslavia. Specifically, given the 9/11 background, this was the perfect opportunity to suck up to the US (as can also be contrasted with their staying out of the Western European-instigated turkey shoots and dismemberment of Libya). So they went in heavy in Afghanistan, and stayed long, upping their participation when this or that US president decided to escalate (as in the Obama surge). This means they took on a lot of local partners, and now extract and continue to pay they must. Good if they do.

https://www.theguardian.com/news/dat...bers-nato-data
Czechs had quite a few local cooperators, during 2002-2020 CZ has built hospitals, schools, etc.
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  #287  
Old 23.08.2021, 08:51
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

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Plenty of burning and daisycutting to do at Bush ranch, and of course shooting to your heart's contents ... heck it must remind him of what he so unfortunately missed in 'Nam.
George W Bush was a fighter pilot in the Texas National Guard at the time of Vietnam.
The National Guard was never called up to serve in Vietnam.

I thought you were better than this?
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  #288  
Old 23.08.2021, 08:56
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

Joining the Nat'l Guard or the Coast Guard was a well-trodden path that was fairly certain NOT to result in being called up to 'Nam. Lots of (well-to-do) boys found safety there if they thought the gummint was coming for them.
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  #289  
Old 23.08.2021, 09:16
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

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Joining the Nat'l Guard or the Coast Guard was a well-trodden path that was fairly certain NOT to result in being called up to 'Nam. Lots of (well-to-do) boys found safety there if they thought the gummint was coming for them.
A sad slur on people voluntarily and honourably signing up for dangerous military duties.
Unlike people who avoided Vietnam due to mysterious symptoms that later disappeared without treatment.
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  #290  
Old 23.08.2021, 09:28
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

It is not a slur at all... many of my friends' families did it in order to do some service but stay out of what they considered an unwinnable and immoral war.
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  #291  
Old 23.08.2021, 09:52
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

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And the trailers are already there, since that's where a worthy president must keep the staff...

Pic at https://cryptome.org/eyeball/bush-ranch/bush-ranch.htm
Blimey, that's what I call professional stalking.
Still the place looks like I'd like it as neighbour's noise would not be an issue.
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  #292  
Old 23.08.2021, 09:52
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

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George W Bush was a fighter pilot in the Texas National Guard at the time of Vietnam.
The National Guard was never called up to serve in Vietnam.

I thought you were better than this?
Yep, like many of the elite, he got put in the NG because it would not be called up, and even though he was barely qualified and certainly not an exemplary pilot.
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/bush...raphy-1.211785
https://www.washingtonpost.com/gdpr-...bush072899.htm
https://www.history.com/this-day-in-...national-guard


Are you saying he wanted to go to Vietnam? If so, show what he did to get there. If not, draw your conclusions.


By the way, no such question about HW, his father. He did serve with great honor.

Last edited by XDr; 23.08.2021 at 09:57. Reason: HW
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  #293  
Old 23.08.2021, 10:01
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

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A sad slur on people voluntarily and honourably signing up for dangerous military duties.
Unlike people who avoided Vietnam due to mysterious symptoms that later disappeared without treatment.
Indeed. This "voluntarily and honourably signing up for dangerous military duties" was called the Draft.
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  #294  
Old 23.08.2021, 10:09
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

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.......he was barely qualified and certainly not an exemplary pilot........
No doubt your judgement is based on your own exemplary military service?
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  #295  
Old 23.08.2021, 11:37
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

Well, at least Harry Windsor did spend time in Afghanistan.

Though always shadowed by two Ghurkas and mostly flying a rescue helicopter otherwise, but still.

Rich people weren't dumber or less connected back then than they are now.

After Korea and by the time Vietnam came around, they knew better than to send their kids into that shit-show of a war.

My cynicism says that these CG or NG loopholes were specifically created (or widened) for that purpose.
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  #296  
Old 23.08.2021, 17:59
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

NG and Coast Guard were easily gained by pulling connections; my brother's was that my uncle was a general in WWII and a folk hero fighter pilot who didn't want him in that mess. In the draft, IV-F was for those who either were truly unfit or pretended to be/had the money to pay for a Dr.'s assessment such as bone spurs. There were many classifications that could keep you safe, such as sole surviving son, extreme hardship, divinity school, etc., but some of them were just deferments.

Marton, to be fair, yes lots of people "signed up," but many more didn't have any choice--they simply didn't have the options that wealthier peeps did. They were cannon fodder and either returned with various problems or in a box.
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Old 24.08.2021, 20:52
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

A bit of a long read, but a strong article by Edward Girardet. Girardet is an American journalist, now based half-time in Geneva, who has been working the Afghanistan beat since the 1970s. He has interviewed all the sides to the conflict (even critical early players like Ahmad Masoud, bin Laden etc.) over the years.
https://lenews.ch/2021/08/20/the-wes...understanding/
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  #298  
Old 29.08.2021, 15:59
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

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I’ll bite. What US atrocities?
this one rings a bell.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Varvar...%20five%20more.

On 30 May 1999, as part of the NATO bombing of Yugoslavia, the NATO bombed a bridge crossing the Velika Morava river in Varvarin. It was Sunday and the streets were full of people going to the market or coming back from the Orthodox church service for the Holy Trinity that had just finished. Soon after noon, two low-flying NATO F-16 warplanes fired the first laser-guided bomb strike against the bridge, killing three people and severely injuring five more. A few minutes after the first strike, as people rushed to the bridge to help the injured, two more bombs were fired. In total, 10 people were killed and 17 were severely injured.[2][3][4]

The 10 fatal victims were Sanja Milenković (15), Milan Savić (28), Vojkan Stanković (30), Zoran Marinković (33), Stojan Ristić (52), Ratibor Simonović (24), Ružica Simonović (55), Milivoje Ćirić (66), Dragoslav Terzić (67) and Tola Apostolović (74).[5]

The nationality of the pilots is unknown and the military purpose of the operation remains unclear.[1]
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  #299  
Old 29.08.2021, 19:48
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

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The Russians and Chinese still have their embassies in Kabul, they simply said no need to evacuate. They seem to be on top of the situation regarding the government change, unlike Biden's administration

There is no secured road leading to the airport, there has never been. All the trips from the airport to the US embassy were done by helicopters, never by road.

There is no more ATC services for the whole Afghanistan, their airspace is uncontrolled. The only Tower services are done by the US military when a plane is inbound
Realpolitik

Hurricane Ida will hit us coast tonight with strength 3 or 4, which will push Afghanistan out of the headlines probably never to return.
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Old 29.08.2021, 20:03
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Re: Afghanistan: misplaced trust in USA evident?

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Realpolitik

Hurricane Ida will hit us coast tonight with strength 3 or 4, which will push Afghanistan out of the headlines probably never to return.
Oh yeah, floods are better than wars.

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