Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Off-Topic > Off-Topic > International affairs/politics  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 21.09.2022, 09:12
Phil_MCR's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Basel
Posts: 15,117
Groaned at 301 Times in 201 Posts
Thanked 19,229 Times in 8,093 Posts
Phil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond repute
Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Now that things are hotting up in the UA/RU conflict and nuclear option being flaunted once again. I was wondering what would happen if used nuclear weapons.

Let's say it was just a small nuclear attack on a small non-strategic UA village of 50 people. No military objective, just a probe attack to see how the west would respond and to threaten greater usage of nuclear weapons in the hope of pressuring UA to back down.

What responses would UA and its allies have? If there are no good options, what are the least bad ones?

I'd love to understand how the US are war-gaming these scenarios as they now get closer and closer to reality.
__________________
By replying to this post, you hereby grant Phil_MCR a royalty-free license to use, in any way, anything posted by you on the internet. If you do not accept, stop using EF and delete your account.
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank Phil_MCR for this useful post:
The following 5 users groan at Phil_MCR for this post:
  #2  
Old 21.09.2022, 09:28
slammer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Lummerland
Posts: 5,476
Groaned at 222 Times in 148 Posts
Thanked 10,077 Times in 3,903 Posts
slammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Quote:
View Post
Now that things are hotting up in the UA/RU conflict and nuclear option being flaunted once again. I was wondering what would happen if used nuclear weapons.

Let's say it was just a small nuclear attack on a small non-strategic UA village of 50 people. No military objective, just a probe attack to see how the west would respond and to threaten greater usage of nuclear weapons in the hope of pressuring UA to back down.

What responses would UA and its allies have? If there are no good options, what are the least bad ones?

I'd love to understand how the US are war-gaming these scenarios as they now get closer and closer to reality.
I have always said that Putin could go nuclear if he is pushed too far, both military with weapons from the west and economically via sanctions. Best case is that the US supplies Ukraine with tactical nukes and tells Selensky to have fun. Worst case? The sky is the limit.
I can also imagine the US supplying nukes as a deterrent.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 21.09.2022, 09:32
komsomolez's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: SZ
Posts: 3,509
Groaned at 325 Times in 227 Posts
Thanked 7,156 Times in 3,043 Posts
komsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Stupid click bait headline, and didn't that have space in the other thread?
Reply With Quote
The following 15 users would like to thank komsomolez for this useful post:
This user groans at komsomolez for this post:
  #4  
Old 21.09.2022, 09:35
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Nyon
Posts: 7,032
Groaned at 419 Times in 310 Posts
Thanked 9,725 Times in 4,550 Posts
bowlie has a reputation beyond reputebowlie has a reputation beyond reputebowlie has a reputation beyond reputebowlie has a reputation beyond reputebowlie has a reputation beyond reputebowlie has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Agreed as I’ve ignored that thread.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 21.09.2022, 09:49
slammer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Lummerland
Posts: 5,476
Groaned at 222 Times in 148 Posts
Thanked 10,077 Times in 3,903 Posts
slammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Sadly not click bait, in a report from dpa (Deutsche Presse Agentur) it is confirmed that Putin has ordered a partial mobilization and has ordered the nuclear forces in a higher state of readiness. The two breakaway republics are set to vote to join the Russian federation. That would mean that any Ukraine attack will be seen as an attack on Russian territory and according to Russian military doctrine..... Boom!
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users groan at slammer for this post:
  #6  
Old 21.09.2022, 10:00
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Bern
Posts: 2,386
Groaned at 465 Times in 302 Posts
Thanked 5,103 Times in 1,852 Posts
Susie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Not click bait:

President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia accelerated his war effort in Ukraine on Wednesday, announcing a new mobilization campaign that would mean calling up roughly 300,000 additional soldiers at a time when his troops have suffered humiliating losses on the battlefield.

In a rare videotaped address to the nation, Mr. Putin stopped short of declaring a full, national draft but instead called for a “partial mobilization” of people with military experience. He said that Russia’s goals in Ukraine had not changed and that the move was “necessary and urgent” because the West had “crossed all lines” by providing sophisticated weapons to Ukraine.

He accused the United States and Europe of engaging in “nuclear blackmail” but warned that Russia has “lots of weapons” in response.

“To those who allow themselves such statements about Russia, I want to remind you that our country also has various means of destruction, and some components are more modern than those of the NATO countries,” he said. “And if the territorial integrity of our country is threatened, we will certainly use all the means at our disposal to protect Russia and our people. This is not a bluff.”


https://www.nytimes.com/live/2022/09...aine-war-putin
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users groan at Susie-Q for this post:
  #7  
Old 21.09.2022, 10:10
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Bern
Posts: 2,386
Groaned at 465 Times in 302 Posts
Thanked 5,103 Times in 1,852 Posts
Susie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Quote:
View Post
Let's say it was just a small nuclear attack on a small non-strategic UA village of 50 people. No military objective, just a probe attack to see how the west would respond and to threaten greater usage of nuclear weapons in the hope of pressuring UA to back down..
Is there such a thing as a "small" nuclear attack??

I am not well versed on weapons of war, but that doesn't seem possible - and if it is, I am sure it would still be the beginning of WWIII - although I'm sure even China and India would distance themselves if Putin strikes first.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank Susie-Q for this useful post:
  #8  
Old 21.09.2022, 10:12
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Vaud
Posts: 158
Groaned at 43 Times in 26 Posts
Thanked 247 Times in 105 Posts
keyboardandmouse has an excellent reputationkeyboardandmouse has an excellent reputationkeyboardandmouse has an excellent reputationkeyboardandmouse has an excellent reputation
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Quote:
View Post
Not click bait:

President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia accelerated his war effort in Ukraine on Wednesday, announcing a new mobilization campaign that would mean calling up roughly 300,000 additional soldiers at a time when his troops have suffered humiliating losses on the battlefield.

In a rare videotaped address to the nation, Mr. Putin stopped short of declaring a full, national draft but instead called for a “partial mobilization” of people with military experience. He said that Russia’s goals in Ukraine had not changed and that the move was “necessary and urgent” because the West had “crossed all lines” by providing sophisticated weapons to Ukraine.

He accused the United States and Europe of engaging in “nuclear blackmail” but warned that Russia has “lots of weapons” in response.

“To those who allow themselves such statements about Russia, I want to remind you that our country also has various means of destruction, and some components are more modern than those of the NATO countries,” he said. “And if the territorial integrity of our country is threatened, we will certainly use all the means at our disposal to protect Russia and our people. This is not a bluff.”


https://www.nytimes.com/live/2022/09...aine-war-putin
As I already said on the other thread tactical nuclear weapons are the threat. He wont try and flatten London, the risk is by proclaiming the region as russian and then Ukraine carries on into it, he could chuck in a small, tactical nuclear weapon "in self defence" because from their perspective its an invasion of Russia now, something to which they will respond to, they have said publicly.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank keyboardandmouse for this useful post:
  #9  
Old 21.09.2022, 10:22
slammer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Lummerland
Posts: 5,476
Groaned at 222 Times in 148 Posts
Thanked 10,077 Times in 3,903 Posts
slammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Quote:
View Post
Stupid click bait headline, and didn't that have space in the other thread?
Jeez Komsomolez, you are quick on the groan trigger. I mean this is happening right now. If you want to groan, groan at Putin.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank slammer for this useful post:
The following 2 users groan at slammer for this post:
  #10  
Old 21.09.2022, 10:29
komsomolez's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: SZ
Posts: 3,509
Groaned at 325 Times in 227 Posts
Thanked 7,156 Times in 3,043 Posts
komsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Quote:
View Post
Jeez Komsomolez, you are quick on the groan trigger. I mean this is happening right now. If you want to groan, groan at Putin.
No. There is no Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine. There are signals of weakness from the Kremlin, supported by the Chinese now calling for peace talks.

Y'all need to calm down. And move back to the other thread.
Reply With Quote
The following 6 users would like to thank komsomolez for this useful post:
This user groans at komsomolez for this post:
  #11  
Old 21.09.2022, 10:30
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Bern
Posts: 2,386
Groaned at 465 Times in 302 Posts
Thanked 5,103 Times in 1,852 Posts
Susie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Quote:
View Post
As I already said on the other thread tactical nuclear weapons are the threat. He wont try and flatten London, the risk is by proclaiming the region as russian and then Ukraine carries on into it, he could chuck in a small, tactical nuclear weapon "in self defence" because from their perspective its an invasion of Russia now, something to which they will respond to, they have said publicly.
Apologies, I have been away from EF for a bit and did not recall that thread.

Perhaps the title should be changed to "Russia and Ukraine War" and all related posts can be made there.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 21.09.2022, 10:34
Axa's Avatar
Axa Axa is offline
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Suhr, Aargau
Posts: 4,601
Groaned at 82 Times in 75 Posts
Thanked 6,475 Times in 3,064 Posts
Axa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Quote:
View Post
Sadly not click bait, in a report from dpa (Deutsche Presse Agentur) it is confirmed that Putin has ordered a partial mobilization and has ordered the nuclear forces in a higher state of readiness. The two breakaway republics are set to vote to join the Russian federation. That would mean that any Ukraine attack will be seen as an attack on Russian territory and according to Russian military doctrine..... Boom!
You're late to the party.

Nuclear forces are in high alert since Feb 27 2022. https://apnews.com/article/russia-uk...e5a2f936725550

Or, is this a higher more high highestest state of readiness as the last months?
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank Axa for this useful post:
  #13  
Old 21.09.2022, 10:39
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Bern
Posts: 2,386
Groaned at 465 Times in 302 Posts
Thanked 5,103 Times in 1,852 Posts
Susie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Quote:
View Post
Or, is this a higher more high highestest state of readiness as the last months?
Putin is about to lose and he's more of a cornered rat than he's ever been ...

https://www.vice.com/en/article/v7dx...feels-cornered
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Susie-Q for this useful post:
This user groans at Susie-Q for this post:
  #14  
Old 21.09.2022, 10:40
Ato Ato is offline
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: ZH
Posts: 1,989
Groaned at 35 Times in 31 Posts
Thanked 3,839 Times in 1,563 Posts
Ato has a reputation beyond reputeAto has a reputation beyond reputeAto has a reputation beyond reputeAto has a reputation beyond reputeAto has a reputation beyond reputeAto has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Quote:
View Post
You're late to the party.

Nuclear forces are in high alert since Feb 27 2022. https://apnews.com/article/russia-uk...e5a2f936725550

Or, is this a higher more high highestest state of readiness as the last months?
They've yet to reach the "Really much higher than super serious high alert" threshold, then we'll know they're serious.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Ato for this useful post:
  #15  
Old 21.09.2022, 10:44
komsomolez's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: SZ
Posts: 3,509
Groaned at 325 Times in 227 Posts
Thanked 7,156 Times in 3,043 Posts
komsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Quote:
View Post
Putin is about to lose and he's more of a cornered rat than he's ever been ...

https://www.vice.com/en/article/v7dx...feels-cornered
This piece is from 1 March. Written by a hack who normally writes on Trump - in Vice of all publications - and seems to have no credentials on anything Russia. Lame.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank komsomolez for this useful post:
This user groans at komsomolez for this post:
  #16  
Old 21.09.2022, 10:54
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Zurich
Posts: 14,033
Groaned at 1,374 Times in 914 Posts
Thanked 21,113 Times in 8,069 Posts
Chuff has a reputation beyond reputeChuff has a reputation beyond reputeChuff has a reputation beyond reputeChuff has a reputation beyond reputeChuff has a reputation beyond reputeChuff has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Why does this need its own thread when we already have the main Ukraine war thread? Maximum scaremongering impact?
Reply With Quote
The following 5 users would like to thank Chuff for this useful post:
  #17  
Old 21.09.2022, 10:54
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Bern
Posts: 2,386
Groaned at 465 Times in 302 Posts
Thanked 5,103 Times in 1,852 Posts
Susie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond reputeSusie-Q has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Quote:
View Post
This piece is from 1 March. Written by a hack who normally writes on Trump - in Vice of all publications - and seems to have no credentials on anything Russia. Lame.
I didn't realize I had to post articles from today or this week about Putin's character.

That story is confirmed and has been told by many lauded experts on Putin and Russia.

Denying how dangerous Putin is right now = LAME
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Susie-Q for this useful post:
This user groans at Susie-Q for this post:
  #18  
Old 21.09.2022, 11:03
Axa's Avatar
Axa Axa is offline
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Suhr, Aargau
Posts: 4,601
Groaned at 82 Times in 75 Posts
Thanked 6,475 Times in 3,064 Posts
Axa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Quote:
View Post
Why does this need its own thread when we already have the main Ukraine war thread? Maximum scaremongering impact?
Always consider the possibility of EF being a channel for everyone's fears and frustrations. There's also the fear Phil_MCR is also displaying on the high interest rate thread and connect the dots. I don't think it's trolling, just pure anxiety and existential dread.
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank Axa for this useful post:
  #19  
Old 21.09.2022, 11:04
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Vaud
Posts: 158
Groaned at 43 Times in 26 Posts
Thanked 247 Times in 105 Posts
keyboardandmouse has an excellent reputationkeyboardandmouse has an excellent reputationkeyboardandmouse has an excellent reputationkeyboardandmouse has an excellent reputation
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Quote:
View Post
Always consider the possibility of EF being a channel for everyone's fears and frustrations. There's also the fear Phil_MCR is also displaying on the high interest rate thread and connect the dots. I don't think it's trolling, just pure anxiety and existential dread.
Now im scared.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank keyboardandmouse for this useful post:
  #20  
Old 21.09.2022, 11:12
slammer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Lummerland
Posts: 5,476
Groaned at 222 Times in 148 Posts
Thanked 10,077 Times in 3,903 Posts
slammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine

Quote:
View Post
No. There is no Russian nuclear attack on Ukraine. There are signals of weakness from the Kremlin, supported by the Chinese now calling for peace talks.

Y'all need to calm down. And move back to the other thread.
Well I do hope you are right. However I also think that one can express ones fears and doubts without „sanctions“
I don’t think that Putin will roll over if the Chinese ask nicely, and I don’t see a Situation like Britain during the Suez Crisis where Truman told the British government to cut that shit out.
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Rebuilding Ukraine markalex International affairs/politics 11 24.03.2022 21:58
Nuclear attack warning for Hawaii- false !?! Guest International affairs/politics 104 16.01.2018 08:45
femmes tische in Russian (for Russian-speaking women) sweti Commercial events 0 19.01.2015 12:15
Russian Pyramid (aka Russian billiards) abdallah.elguindy Sports / Fitness / Beauty / Wellness 0 12.03.2012 15:59


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 07:50.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0