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  #21  
Old 04.01.2023, 09:42
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

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They are looking for solutions.
The drive to reduce motor vehicles in German cities (which were not built to cope with such large numbers of them), and encourage them to use healthy and sustainable forms of transport has created an abundance of parked bicycles blocking the pavements.
Parking them on the road is a solution.
Could they take a few spaces and add proper bicycle parking infrastructure?
I can remember seeing this being done in Graz (Austria) years back. For example - 3C8V+QV5 Graz, Austria

It ensures bicycles know they have parking, and there is less questions of small vehicles taking larger spaces. It looks as though Berlin is going for the laziest option.
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  #22  
Old 04.01.2023, 09:47
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

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I would call them naive and out of touch. But I also believe we need a certain level of human decency in dealing with refugees. I admire the people who actually have helped the refugees settling in, often by voluntary language training and practical advise in dealing with authorities.
yes but with such a broken system which allows itself to be gamed and exploited i think it makes it very difficult for many people.
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  #23  
Old 04.01.2023, 09:54
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

I honestly don’t understand why people would risk their lives getting to Germany if they hate it so much.

I also don’t understand why any country would tolerate it. I’m all for taking in true refugees and looking after them, but if they throw it back in your face, then send them home. If they have dual nationality then revoke it.
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  #24  
Old 04.01.2023, 10:22
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

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They are looking for solutions.
The drive to reduce motor vehicles in German cities (which were not built to cope with such large numbers of them), and encourage them to use healthy and sustainable forms of transport has created an abundance of parked bicycles blocking the pavements.
Parking them on the road is a solution.
They were built for them though, until the greenies came and throttled the movement of cars in cities. I understand that they wanted to make driving so uncomfortable and inconvenient that people would rather use public transport and bicycles instead of cars.
We are still waiting for public transport to be the knight in shining armor to happen and in the meantime roads are choked and traffic gridlocked for hours a day.
If I need a parking space and some bugger has a bicycle parked there, that bike is going to move.
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  #25  
Old 04.01.2023, 19:03
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

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They were built for them though, until the greenies came and throttled the movement of cars in cities. I understand that they wanted to make driving so uncomfortable and inconvenient that people would rather use public transport and bicycles instead of cars.
We are still waiting for public transport to be the knight in shining armor to happen and in the meantime roads are choked and traffic gridlocked for hours a day.
If I need a parking space and some bugger has a bicycle parked there, that bike is going to move.
Apparently, as per federal law, any vehicle can park on the (car) parking fields, though they must do so efficiently, like 4-5-6 bicycles per field. The reason being that the wording of the law speaks of "vehicles" which includes slow ones as well as those without motor like bikes, pedelecs, etc.

The issue in Berlin is that parking fees for cars are being raised while the fees for bikes have been lowered to zero. On top of that, the originally proposed wording of the law would have banned bikes from car parking spots, as parked bikes would have had to be allowed off the road only, but that clause got stricken. So now you have the situation where bicycles can lawfully block large parking spaces. Says the Berliner Kurier.
https://www.berliner-kurier.de/berli...-ist-li.293919

As a result, Berlin's bicycle mechanics will enjoy their booming business this year.

------------------------------

As for the criminals who block, threaten or even attack first responders:
They clearly have a problem with their host state. The humanitarian approach demands that they be relieved from the conundrum they're in, thus they should be helped and deported day before yesterday.
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Old 04.01.2023, 19:06
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

So the riots were because of bicycle parking?
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  #27  
Old 04.01.2023, 19:10
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

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I honestly don’t understand why people would risk their lives getting to Germany if they hate it so much.

I also don’t understand why any country would tolerate it.
most countries would not and do not accept such behaviour. the fact that countries like germany do makes them a soft touch (as well as generous) which attracts more of the same.
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  #28  
Old 04.01.2023, 20:02
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

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I guess it is a bit more complex. Germany had integration problems long before 2015, especially if I think of the Arab/Palestinian/Lebanese clans in cities like Berlin. And I know personally of several very successful integration stories from the 2015 wave.
Whilst there have been plenty of successful integration stories from the 2015 wave, the stark reality is that a significant majority of immigrants haven't been able to find work and are still completely dependent on the state for their existence in Germany.

We're heading into turbulent waters across the West, however Germany, perhaps more than most countries are facing down the proverbial barrel of a demographic gun. It was interesting to here Chancellor Scholz's plans for immigration reform (link below), that Germany are going all-in in attempt to resolve her problems through immigration in spite of the experience from 2015.

As a small aside, I have to laugh when people say the future of young people was stolen due to Brexit. Free movement or no free movement, if you have a desired skill or profession, you will be able to work where you want simply due to the demographic crisis.

Whilst immigration will surely plug some gaps, I think Germany will struggle to attract the number of skilled workers in certain niche industries that she needs. Language will also remain a significant obstacle. Given the many geopolitical and economic changes taking place at the moment, perhaps a rethink of the country's economic model may bring more benefits. And whilst mass immigration may be a net economic benefit, there are perhaps bigger social implications that need to be considered as seen in Berlin over the New Year.


Germany and immigration: Plans for reform

https://www.dw.com/en/germany-and-im...fom/a-63925044
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  #29  
Old 04.01.2023, 20:45
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

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What good old days, how far do you want to go back. This kind of behavior would not have been tolerated way back in the seventies and eighties, even in the nineties, just before the rot set in.
It is a big issue, the problem is here and it´s not going to go away anytime soon. Thing is nobody wants to talk about it out of fear of being called a racist thus committing political suicide.
But the writing is on the wall, why else are we seeing a political jerk to the right?
But the East German protests in the Autumn of 1989 that led to the dismantling of the wall then the large riots in Germany, at Hoyerswerda in September 1991, Berlin in November 1991, and at Rostock in August 1992
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  #30  
Old 04.01.2023, 20:52
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

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But the East German protests in the Autumn of 1989 that led to the dismantling of the wall then the large riots in Germany, at Hoyerswerda in September 1991, Berlin in November 1991, and at Rostock in August 1992
Eastern Germany never "denazified" or properly digested the Third Reich and WW2. It went straight into the next cultish dictatorship. The few "immigrants" in the GDR were Vietnamese and Mosambiqan guest workers who were largely separated from the population. They had no lobby and quickly became victim of East German fascism. That still exists at shocking levels.

None of which has anything to do with or justifies the behaviour some of the mostly "Muslim" male youth are showing.
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  #31  
Old 04.01.2023, 21:01
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

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So the riots were because of bicycle parking?
They protest to be provided one so they, too, can use the parking spots.
It's all about equality nowadays.
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  #32  
Old 04.01.2023, 21:08
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

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Whilst there have been plenty of successful integration stories from the 2015 wave, the stark reality is that a significant majority of immigrants haven't been able to find work and are still completely dependent on the state for their existence in Germany.

We're heading into turbulent waters across the West, however Germany, perhaps more than most countries are facing down the proverbial barrel of a demographic gun. It was interesting to here Chancellor Scholz's plans for immigration reform (link below), that Germany are going all-in in attempt to resolve her problems through immigration in spite of the experience from 2015.

As a small aside, I have to laugh when people say the future of young people was stolen due to Brexit. Free movement or no free movement, if you have a desired skill or profession, you will be able to work where you want simply due to the demographic crisis.

Whilst immigration will surely plug some gaps, I think Germany will struggle to attract the number of skilled workers in certain niche industries that she needs. Language will also remain a significant obstacle. Given the many geopolitical and economic changes taking place at the moment, perhaps a rethink of the country's economic model may bring more benefits. And whilst mass immigration may be a net economic benefit, there are perhaps bigger social implications that need to be considered as seen in Berlin over the New Year.


Germany and immigration: Plans for reform

https://www.dw.com/en/germany-and-im...fom/a-63925044
It is not true that "that a significant majority of immigrants haven't been able to find work".

According to the OECD 64% of the foreign-born population are employed.

According to the 2020 report "Germany: Half of the refugees find jobs within five years".

Posting fake information does not solve anything.
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  #33  
Old 04.01.2023, 21:37
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

Thats the problem ,when you take all the refugees without a perspective for them make a living.
Without a reasonable knowledge of german language they can't enter the workforce , they need education and training. This will take a lot of time.
German can ' t be learned in a year.
Otherwise they turn to crimes like selling drugs or theft. When they don't work and remain in their clans,it will
be the same like areas in sweden, where even the police will not enter certain areas.The banlieue in paris is the same.
NYE 2015 was very bad , NYE 2022 is the same .
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  #34  
Old 04.01.2023, 21:53
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

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Thats the problem ,when you take all the refugees without a perspective for them make a living.
Without a reasonable knowledge of german language they can't enter the workforce , they need education and training. This will take a lot of time.
German can ' t be learned in a year.
Otherwise they turn to crimes like selling drugs or theft. When they don't work and remain in their clans,it will
be the same like areas in sweden, where even the police will not enter certain areas.The banlieue in paris is the same.
NYE 2015 was very bad , NYE 2022 is the same .
Never mind a year, how about 7! Learning the language is also only a part of the issue, being able to speak a language doesn't help if you have little or no other skills to offer.

This is why so many Afghans and Syrians remain reliant on handouts after such a long time.

Germany: Two-thirds of Syrian refugees unable to support themselves

https://www.infomigrants.net/en/post...ort-themselves

Germany Is Short of Workers, but Its Migrants Are Struggling to Find Jobs

https://www.wsj.com/articles/germany...bs-11670844930
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  #35  
Old 04.01.2023, 21:55
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

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Thats the problem ,when you take all the refugees without a perspective for them make a living.
Without a reasonable knowledge of german language they can't enter the workforce , they need education and training. This will take a lot of time.
German can ' t be learned in a year.
Otherwise they turn to crimes like selling drugs or theft. When they don't work and remain in their clans,it will
be the same like areas in sweden, where even the police will not enter certain areas.The banlieue in paris is the same.
NYE 2015 was very bad , NYE 2022 is the same .
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64% of the foreign-born population are employed.

According to the 2020 report "Germany: Half of the refugees find jobs within five years".

Posting fake information does not solve anything.
And there you go.
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  #36  
Old 04.01.2023, 22:32
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

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According to the 2020 report "Germany: Half of the refugees find jobs within five years".

Posting fake information does not solve anything.
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While 68 percent reported having a job, this included both full and part-time. Moreover, 17% of this group are involved in a paid training scheme and 3% have a paid internship, a form of employment that often does not pay enough to live off.

About 12% are under-employed, for example in so-called "mini-jobs" that pay a maximum of €450 a month.

The study also revealed that only 29% of these employed refugees were women as traditional gender roles continue to keep women with children in the home.
So much for your own fake news.
Neither an internship nor a minijob is enough to live on.

Even the 49% with steady employment don't necessarily work full time, or fully fund their own lives. Steady employment can be as little as 20%. Gee, I wonder why they don't the mention how many still depend on the public's funds.

You're a prime example for the stubborn refusal to accept and concede that far from everything is fine and dandy.
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  #37  
Old 04.01.2023, 22:46
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

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Never mind a year, how about 7! Learning the language is also only a part of the issue, being able to speak a language doesn't help if you have little or no other skills to offer.

This is why so many Afghans and Syrians remain reliant on handouts after such a long time.

Germany: Two-thirds of Syrian refugees unable to support themselves

https://www.infomigrants.net/en/post...ort-themselves

Germany Is Short of Workers, but Its Migrants Are Struggling to Find Jobs

https://www.wsj.com/articles/germany...bs-11670844930
Moving the goal posts again.

First, you posted "a significant majority of immigrants haven't been able to find work" which is untrue.

Now you post "Two-thirds of Syrian refugees unable to support themselves" so it is now not all immigrants but just Syrians.

If you bothered to read the article you linked you would have seen it is not true that the majority have not been able to find work.

I quote "One reason for the relatively high proportion of Syrians receiving benefits, according to a study done by the Employment Agency last year, is that refugees often lack documents with formal qualifications and are employed in areas with "pay in the lower pay range.".

I quote "benefits are also paid to those who earn so little that they cannot support themselves on their income.".

So the problem is not "no job" but the job pays very little.
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  #38  
Old 04.01.2023, 22:58
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

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So much for your own fake news.
Neither an internship nor a minijob is enough to live on.

Even the 49% with steady employment don't necessarily work full time, or fully fund their own lives. Steady employment can be as little as 20%. Gee, I wonder why they don't the mention how many still depend on the public's funds.

You're a prime example for the stubborn refusal to accept and concede that far from everything is fine and dandy.
Also moving goalposts.
My point was the claim the majority of immigrants do not have a job is false, everything you have posted supports my point.

Of course, people in low-paid jobs and internships are entitled to public benefits.

Also from TC's link "Syrians now make up the largest group among foreign doctors, with 4,970 employed ", is described as a Kafkaesque process for a Syrian doctor to qualify in Germany.
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  #39  
Old 04.01.2023, 23:19
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

The news reported that it was mainly migrants responsible fror the trouble. That is of course water on the AFD‘s mill and they are already in „told you so“ mode. Lefties and greenies are in spin mode and Scholze is trying to calm things down. There will be a run to the AFD and the greatest nightmare of both the SPD and CDU.
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  #40  
Old 04.01.2023, 23:57
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Re: Germany NYE 2022

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Also moving goalposts.
My point was the claim the majority of immigrants do not have a job is false, everything you have posted supports my point.
In other words you agree that the majority can't fund their own lives. Not even now.

At long last we're getting somewhere.
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