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  #841  
Old 16.02.2010, 11:37
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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Sure, if you take it in isolation. This belittling of such small gestures does nothing to help.

I'm not belittling it. I'm just trying to put it in its proper perspective. Again, I think this is improvement. But if it doesn't really have anything to do with the problems at hand, then its malarky.
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  #842  
Old 16.02.2010, 11:42
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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I'm not belittling it. I'm just trying to put it in its proper perspective. Again, I think this is improvement. But if it doesn't really have anything to do with the problems at hand, then its malarky.
Well if you think there's nothing that can be done anyway, what's the point in bothering? You seem to see it as some sort spiritual penance.

Lot's of little changes can make huge differences, whether you believe that or not.
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  #843  
Old 16.02.2010, 11:50
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I think this is a very commendable attitude. Responsibility is a great thing. We should all make sure we clean up the mess we leave behind. We generate way too much trash.

But I'm suspicious of the fad nature of this trend. Turning off a lightbulb can make one feel they've done their part, and feel quite self-righteous about it. But in the whole scheme of things, it may not amount to much.
I get that and greenpeace is very middle class if your poor and struggling worrying about the envioroment is not your first priority its just getting by.I just feel and believe we should all do what we can as i fear for my childrens future and its heartbreaking to see the suffering all ready caused by its effects and it will get alot worse.I dislike the spoilt attitudes of some people who protest way too much because they dont want to give up anything.Over consummerism materialism doesnt make people any happier either.During these economic problems there has been a significant reduction in co2.Cliched as it is everyone can make a difference.
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Old 16.02.2010, 11:58
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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Well if you think there's nothing that can be done anyway, what's the point in bothering? You seem to see it as some sort spiritual penance.

Lot's of little changes can make huge differences, whether you believe that or not.

Here you go again with the "You seem" Cyrus. I really do find it silly conversing with you.
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  #845  
Old 16.02.2010, 11:59
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Over consummerism materialism doesnt make people any happier either.
It's made me happy!

I can remember when I couldn't afford nice new things. I was really miserable then.

Now I've got lovely shoes and a hat and a new pair of mittens, and I'm happy as a pig in ****.

That's your theory buggered, ain't it?
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  #846  
Old 16.02.2010, 12:06
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I get that and greenpeace is very middle class if your poor and struggling worrying about the envioroment is not your first priority its just getting by.I just feel and believe we should all do what we can as i fear for my childrens future and its heartbreaking to see the suffering all ready caused by its effects and it will get alot worse.I dislike the spoilt attitudes of some people who protest way too much because they dont want to give up anything.Over consummerism materialism doesnt make people any happier either.During these economic problems there has been a significant reduction in co2.Cliched as it is everyone can make a difference.

All I'm saying is that it is like barking up the wrong tree. The only way you can get this to work is to enforce it on ALL people around the world. In the meantime, you have a burgeoning Chinese and Indian population who are rapidly ramping up their consumption.

A perfect example are coal burning power plants. Those generate a heck of a lot more carbon than we can save in our lifetimes on our own.

I think the "self-sacrifice" of foregoing another material thing, which I find to be admirable and a positive action, can also make people feel they've done their part. But in reality, is really not having done anythng at all. It's a bit like homeopathy for the climate.
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  #847  
Old 16.02.2010, 12:12
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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It's made me happy!

I can remember when I couldn't afford nice new things. I was really miserable then.

Now I've got lovely shoes and a hat and a new pair of mittens, and I'm happy as a pig in ****.

That's your theory buggered, ain't it?
poverty is a curse.Its not what I meant I have nice shoes too but dont feel the need to have 50 pairs which is kind of my point.Advertsements are to create dissatifaction if we dont have the latest designer kitchen or sofa etc how unfufilled we'll be.It works and they get very rich.We get sucked into the con.
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  #848  
Old 16.02.2010, 12:19
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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Advertsements are to create dissatifaction if we dont have the latest designer kitchen or sofa etc how unfufilled we'll be.It works and they get very rich.We get sucked into the con.
I hardly ever watch the television, never read newspapers, and only read The Week magazine, which carries advertisements for products I'll never afford.

Adverts are entertaining, but a bit wasted on the likes of me (although I was inspired to go and buy some Carlsberg beer after watching Ice Cold in Alex, so maybe John Mills is in on the conspiracy?).

I just like to own nice things. They make me happy.

Does that make me a bad person?
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  #849  
Old 16.02.2010, 12:24
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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Does that make me a bad person?
No.

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  #850  
Old 16.02.2010, 12:26
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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No.
Thank you.

But I might still have to indulge in some retail therapy to get over my 5 minutes of anguish and hurt.

Does anyone know where I can buy Manolo Blahnik shoes?

I live in Zurich.
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  #851  
Old 16.02.2010, 12:31
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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I was inspired to go and buy some Carlsberg beer after watching Ice Cold in Alex
Well done for not drinking Holsten pils in response.
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  #852  
Old 16.02.2010, 12:34
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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Does anyone know where I can buy Manolo Blahnik shoes?

I live in Zurich.

Hey... ahh... ummm... they make shoes for men too?
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  #853  
Old 16.02.2010, 12:34
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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All I'm saying is that it is like barking up the wrong tree. The only way you can get this to work is to enforce it on ALL people around the world. In the meantime, you have a burgeoning Chinese and Indian population who are rapidly ramping up their consumption.

A perfect example are coal burning power plants. Those generate a heck of a lot more carbon than we can save in our lifetimes on our own.

I think the "self-sacrifice" of foregoing another material thing, which I find to be admirable and a positive action, can also make people feel they've done their part. But in reality, is really not having done anythng at all. It's a bit like homeopathy for the climate.
Of course it needs political will and it s changing but far too little too late probaly.But Martin Luther King didnt say I have a nightmare!!
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  #854  
Old 16.02.2010, 12:35
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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Hey... ahh... ummm... they make shoes for men too?
It's Fastnacht, ain't it?
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  #855  
Old 16.02.2010, 12:38
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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But Martin Luther King didnt say I have a nightmare!!
So what's your dream? Forcing a pre-industrial lifestyle upon all of us?
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  #856  
Old 16.02.2010, 12:40
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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Here you go again with the "You seem" Cyrus. I really do find it silly conversing with you.
I'm stating my opinion and trying to make it clear that it is only my opinion.

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All I'm saying is that it is like barking up the wrong tree. The only way you can get this to work is to enforce it on ALL people around the world. In the meantime, you have a burgeoning Chinese and Indian population who are rapidly ramping up their consumption.

A perfect example are coal burning power plants. Those generate a heck of a lot more carbon than we can save in our lifetimes on our own.

I think the "self-sacrifice" of foregoing another material thing, which I find to be admirable and a positive action, can also make people feel they've done their part. But in reality, is really not having done anythng at all. It's a bit like homeopathy for the climate.
I disagree. It's true we need to encourage action on a global scale, but how can we do that if we aren't prepared to make our own sacrifices.

While it can be said that such small changes have no effect, it encourages a mindset that brings greater change. As they say, every great journey begins with a single footstep. So turning off a lightbulb leads to wondering what other small changes can be made.
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  #857  
Old 16.02.2010, 12:45
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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While it can be said that such small changes have no effect, it encourages a mindset that brings greater change.
Such attention to economy and frugality was widespread in the days of our parents and grandparents - and look at the world they've given us!

We're patting ourselves on the back for re-discovering what our forebears had been doing for years - yet their actions obviously didn't make much difference to the state of the world.

Sure, turn your lights off - I do it when I'm at home - but be honest and say that it's about saving money, not changing the world.
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  #858  
Old 16.02.2010, 12:50
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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Sure, turn your lights off - I do it when I'm at home - but be honest and say that it's about saving money, not changing the world.
True, but to be honest, my power bill is not one of my greater concerns, a little encouragement helps.
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  #859  
Old 16.02.2010, 12:59
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I disagree. It's true we need to encourage action on a global scale, but how can we do that if we aren't prepared to make our own sacrifices.

While it can be said that such small changes have no effect, it encourages a mindset that brings greater change. As they say, every great journey begins with a single footstep. So turning off a lightbulb leads to wondering what other small changes can be made.

That's a sweet sentiment. But how do you do get everyone to do this, if not by force? And if it were possible to get everyone to agree on this, which would be a first in human history, aren't there more important issues and actions to take on before this one? Global Warming or not, there are people here on earth who will starve to death TODAY. This is factual, not some imagined future 30 years from now. Is this not more pressing?
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  #860  
Old 16.02.2010, 13:08
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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That's a sweet sentiment. But how do you do get everyone to do this, if not by force? And if it were possible to get everyone to agree on this, which would be a first in human history, aren't there more important issues and actions to take on before this one? Global Warming or not, there are people here on earth who will starve to death TODAY. This is factual, not some imagined future 30 years from now. Is this not more pressing?
Much to the ire of the denialists, it seems people are being persuaded to take steps. The world will always have people who take advantage, this doesn't mean we can't take steps ourselves.

You think climate change won't make these problems worse? if it isn't the cause of some of it already.
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