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  #961  
Old 24.03.2010, 10:44
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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Not in that article. That article shows exactly what I think is the motivation behind the skeptics, that they don't want to do anything about it in case they disadvantage themselves against everyone else.
Which is at the root of all human dispositions, no?
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  #962  
Old 24.03.2010, 10:51
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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Which is at the root of all human dispositions, no?
What is your point? Sometimes we get together and decide to do something that will benefit us all.
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  #963  
Old 24.03.2010, 10:56
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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What is your point? Sometimes we get together and decide to do something that will benefit us all.
I understand the point being that no one is above human characteristics. Not even scientists that might also have a vested interest for power or money.
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  #964  
Old 24.03.2010, 10:58
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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I understand the point being that no one is above human characteristics. Not even scientists that might also have a vested interest for power or money.
I thought so, which is why we have publicly appointed panels, rather than rely on the reassurances of the private sector. To try and minimise the effect of the profit motive on the conclusions.
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  #965  
Old 24.03.2010, 11:17
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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I thought so, which is why we have publicly appointed panels, rather than rely on the reassurances of the private sector. To try and minimise the effect of the profit motive on the conclusions.
The danger with a publicly appointed panel is that it might be appointed by a government that has a vested interest in using this as an excuse to tax their citizenry to fille up the hole in their budget deficits. They reap power from actual $

And of course a private concern would have profit as a motive as well. They reap actual $

I think I would prefer the pure scientist but of course I guess I'm a dreamer - I'm not sure how many exist anymore. Corruption is everywhere and because of that motive must always be suspect, especially when we talk about controlling the very air we breathe. I think what disturbs me personally is that I feel there is an attempt to completely control us....ok I admit to "conflicts with authority" - LOL comes from overbearing parents.
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  #966  
Old 24.03.2010, 11:27
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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The danger with a publicly appointed panel is that it might be appointed by a government that has a vested interest in using this as an excuse to tax their citizenry to fille up the hole in their budget deficits. They reap power from actual $

And of course a private concern would have profit as a motive as well. They reap actual $

I think I would prefer the pure scientist but of course I guess I'm a dreamer - I'm not sure how many exist anymore. Corruption is everywhere and because of that motive must always be suspect, especially when we talk about controlling the very air we breathe. I think what disturbs me personally is that I feel there is an attempt to completely control us....ok I admit to "conflicts with authority" - LOL comes from overbearing parents.
So, it's a new world order thing, that multiple panels appointed by multiple governments are pushing some unknown conspiracy. This is utter fantasy.

Taxes can be used to discourage certain activities, as alternatives are found, the tax revenue diminishes and the aim is achieved.

EDIT: If anything, considering the ammount of lobbying of governments by the private sector, I would expect a truly corrupt government panel to side with that of the skeptics.
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  #967  
Old 24.03.2010, 11:43
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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It shows how the case is unravelling like a melting iceberg.
No, it shows political will is sometimes a difficult thing to muster. You're not a scientist, that's for sure.
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  #968  
Old 24.03.2010, 11:49
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

[QUOTE=cyrus;751933]So, it's a new world order thing, that multiple panels appointed by multiple governments are pushing some unknown conspiracy. This is utter fantasy.

QUOTE]

No, that is not what I meant. I was thinking of an individual country when I wrote it, not taking it to the extreme.

But hey who knows what the future holds?

Frequently "fantasy" is the stuff of technology and the future.

Also just for the record, I'm not married to anything about global warming, cooling or whatever is the latest. I'm old enough to remember the '70s and hearing about global cooling and how NY would be underwater by 2015 or something.

I was out with a friend one night and she was telling me about some islands, I think the name began with a T and she was going on about how we had the responsibility to re-locate these people. I poked around on the Internet the next day and found an article that spoke about how Charles Darwin predicted they would flood back 200 years ago.

So I think some folks ('using taxes to discourage activity' - truer words were never spoken!) would like to see something a bit more concrete. I don't use the word "finalized" because I don't believe in principle that science is ever finalized - it's just what we know and understand at any given point in time.
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  #969  
Old 24.03.2010, 11:57
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

OMG!!! I had no idea this was the same thread from 2007!!

very cool that such a thread didn't get so crazy that it had to be closed.
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  #970  
Old 24.03.2010, 12:18
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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So, it's a new world order thing, that multiple panels appointed by multiple governments are pushing some unknown conspiracy. This is utter fantasy.

QUOTE]

No, that is not what I meant. I was thinking of an individual country when I wrote it, not taking it to the extreme.

But hey who knows what the future holds?

Frequently "fantasy" is the stuff of technology and the future.

Also just for the record, I'm not married to anything about global warming, cooling or whatever is the latest. I'm old enough to remember the '70s and hearing about global cooling and how NY would be underwater by 2015 or something.

I was out with a friend one night and she was telling me about some islands, I think the name began with a T and she was going on about how we had the responsibility to re-locate these people. I poked around on the Internet the next day and found an article that spoke about how Charles Darwin predicted they would flood back 200 years ago.

So I think some folks ('using taxes to discourage activity' - truer words were never spoken!) would like to see something a bit more concrete. I don't use the word "finalized" because I don't believe in principle that science is ever finalized - it's just what we know and understand at any given point in time.
It's just this kind of fuzzy, uniformed thinking that makes fear-mongering and advertising effective.
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  #971  
Old 24.03.2010, 12:36
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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It's just this kind of fuzzy, uniformed thinking that makes fear-mongering and advertising effective.

Fuzzy? Uninformed?? Fear-mongering??

I'm hardly fear mongering. In fact, I believe I indicated that I've seen all this before in the 1970's in NY when it was then called global cooling.

Uninformed? You are as "uninformed" as the latest blogosphere article quoting from the latest scientific "research".

Fuzzy? well yes .....now you sound like my husband when I *AM* doing fuzzy math to justify why I spent too much on shoes !
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  #972  
Old 24.03.2010, 13:00
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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I'm old enough to remember the '70s and hearing about global cooling and how NY would be underwater by 2015 or something.
Er, why would cooling lead to a sea temperature rise?

This just doesn't make sense.
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  #973  
Old 24.03.2010, 13:12
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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Er, why would cooling lead to a sea temperature rise?

This just doesn't make sense.
<sigh> Ok point made.... but only due to coming back to this thread while I'm in the middle of something else of much more importance - cleaning out my closet

Be assured that I did the 3rd grade science experiment of freezing and boiling water and I understand the concepts quite well as evidenced by boiling my tea in the morning and getting some crushed ice when I make a Cosmopolitan in the evening. So far I haven't confused the two.

In the 70's NY harbors never froze over and I rest very well at night being completely convinced that NYCity will not be under water due to global warming by the year 2015 or the year 2035 or the year 2050.

and now back to sorting through my summer sandals
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  #974  
Old 24.03.2010, 13:25
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

Wow so many pages to read......it may have been said before

Cows farting cause global warming & its been talked about in NZ
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  #975  
Old 01.04.2010, 21:28
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The global warming scam - a pretext for dictatorship?

James Lovelock in the Guardian:

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We need a more authoritative world. We've become a sort of cheeky, egalitarian world where everyone can have their say. It's all very well, but there are certain circumstances – a war is a typical example – where you can't do that. You've got to have a few people with authority who you trust who are running it. And they should be very accountable too, of course.

But it can't happen in a modern democracy. This is one of the problems. What's the alternative to democracy? There isn't one. But even the best democracies agree that when a major war approaches, democracy must be put on hold for the time being. I have a feeling that climate change may be an issue as severe as a war. It may be necessary to put democracy on hold for a while.


(emphasis mine)
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Old 01.04.2010, 21:34
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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Fuzzy? Uninformed?? Fear-mongering??

I'm hardly fear mongering. In fact, I believe I indicated that I've seen all this before in the 1970's in NY when it was then called global cooling.

Uninformed? You are as "uninformed" as the latest blogosphere article quoting from the latest scientific "research".

Fuzzy? well yes .....now you sound like my husband when I *AM* doing fuzzy math to justify why I spent too much on shoes !
Yeah, I'm as 'uninformed' as having a background in geophysics, geochemistry, geophysical fluid dynamics, and having been to numerous climate and numerical weather prediction conferences. Now, if you're of the opinion that my background has lead to 'fuzzy thinking', well I can't help that.
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  #977  
Old 01.04.2010, 21:36
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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This just doesn't make sense.
that's because someone's science education stopped in the 70's but they continued to listen to the voices telling them what to think.
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Old 01.04.2010, 21:49
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Re: The global warming scam - a pretext for dictatorship?

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Haa! That's what I've been smelling all this time.
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  #979  
Old 01.04.2010, 22:03
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

"Global Warming - what's behind it?"

A way of governments making an excuses for more taxes.

Something else for the boys in the City to play with and make money from(Carbon Trading).

Non human aspect such as the condition/state of the sun which temperature varies and volcanoes have a much greater impact on the earth than a few power stations.
A volcano produces so manty gases and produces so much heat compared to a load of power stations. One musn't forget that land only covers 25% of the planet so there are more than three times the number of volcanos erupting under the sea and those would surely warm up the sea and create currents and create more warming than the humans on the planet at the moment.

I would say that we need to keep more trees and green on the planet in order to feed ourselves.

If there is really Global warming issues, the solution would surely be to reduce the population by contraception. Less people would have a huge so called reduction on the damage man is doing to the planet and I would say that one has to look at water and food shortage as an issue as opposed to global warming.
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  #980  
Old 01.04.2010, 22:10
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Re: Global Warming - what's behind it?

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"Global Warming - what's behind it?"

A way of governments making an excuses for more taxes.

Something else for the boys in the City to play with and make money from(Carbon Trading).

Non human aspect such as the condition/state of the sun which temperature varies and volcanoes have a much greater impact on the earth than a few power stations.
A volcano produces so manty gases and produces so much heat compared to a load of power stations. One musn't forget that land only covers 25% of the planet so there are more than three times the number of volcanos erupting under the sea and those would surely warm up the sea and create currents and create more warming than the humans on the planet at the moment.

I would say that we need to keep more trees and green on the planet in order to feed ourselves.

If there is really Global warming issues, the solution would surely be to reduce the population by contraception. Less people would have a huge so called reduction on the damage man is doing to the planet and I would say that one has to look at water and food shortage as an issue as opposed to global warming.
Stick wth what you know. This clearly isn't it.
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