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  #581  
Old 28.04.2010, 19:17
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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Jordan is the only exception. However I'm sure you know the reason why Arab nations don't want to give them citizenship, or indeed why many Palestinians don't wish it either. Quite simply its because by accepting citizenship they weaken their case for a right of return. Israel and the UNHCR/UNWRA has an obligation (respected or not) towards the generations of Palestinians made Stateless post 1948, but an Egyptian with a Palestinian grandfather has effectively given up their claim.

Its no more, or less perverse than successful, integrated American and European Jews deciding to give up everything to live a Wild West existence in some frontier Israeli settlement.
Just to make things a bit more complicated... I can imagine another reason why Lebanon in particular is not giving citizenship to Palestinians. They are already in a struggle to balance power between the different groups. So making some thousand Palestinians (mostly Sunni I believe) citizens of Lebanon would not really ease their own problems... But then again keeping them in refugee camps for such a long time can not be right...
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  #582  
Old 28.04.2010, 19:17
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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Where did I say they should give up Jerusalem? You are putting words into my mouth that I didn't say.
Israel wants Palestine to give up Jerusalem
  #583  
Old 28.04.2010, 19:17
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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OK, I'll make it very simple for you to understand. Israel doesn't want a little piece of Muslim land. Israel wants Palestine, a land belonging to Palestinians who happen to be Muslims, Christians, Jews and Druze.
Palestine has already given more than HALF of it's land to Israel. Actually, it was FORCED to do so.

Also, it's ridiculous to assume that somehow Palestinians are religious fundamentalists who want to rule the world.
You're the one who's not understanding, my friend.

I'm not talking about Palestinians. I'm talking about the wider Muslim/Arab community. It was Egypt, Syria, etc who tried to destroy Israel and wipe it off the map. Therefore they are partly to blame for the current mess. If they had been good and freindly neighbours, Israel wouldn't have colonised their territories or even the West Bank or Gaza. Palestinians wouldn't be suffering as much as they are. These guys don't care about what happens to poor Palestinians (if they did they'd let them into their countries and shelter them). No they are using them as a useful tool. They know if they suffer they will hate Israel all the more.
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  #584  
Old 28.04.2010, 19:19
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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yak yak yak ... the British did yak yak yak .... It is Israel with the help of GB and US that kicked the Palestinians out. It is thier problmethey need to find a solution for these displaced people, which incidentally are not just Muslims but include Christians too.

.........UK motherland that abondoned her ethnic offspring!
Of course! It's Britains fault! It's obvious now that you think about it. remember the crusades ? Christ alive they've gone down the tubes since then haven't they ? Place is a mess nowadays.
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  #585  
Old 28.04.2010, 19:19
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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It depends who those people are.

If you're facing a religion and a culture that wants to overrun and rule the entire world, it would seem strange to me that they cannot tolerate another culture taking over a very little bit of what was theirs. It would seem to me that they cannot accept on themselves what they want to do to others.
It was never just theirs that's the whole point. Even if it was- so? Since the exodus of the Israel people began there have been many countries where the natives have been driven out. So NY should be goven back to the native Americans, Australia should be given back to the control of aboroginal councils- need I go on? Get real- it is about time the world stopped paying into this promised land fable, if so what's fair for one culture is fair for all let's start giving everything back.
  #586  
Old 28.04.2010, 19:20
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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The Arab countries never colonised the Palestine the Zionists did.
Are you so sure?

There is probably nobody in the region who didn't colonise (your word) or invade Palestine at one point. The same pattern as far as you can go back in history all the way to Biblical times. Never is a big word. Use it with caution.
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Old 28.04.2010, 19:21
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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It was never just theirs that's the whole point. Even if it was- so? Since the exodus of the Israel people began there have been many countries where the natives have been driven out. So NY should be goven back to the native Americans, Australia should be given back to the control of aboroginal councils- need I go on? Get real- it is about time the world stopped paying into this promised land fable, if so what's fair for one culture is fair for all let's start giving everything back.
Yes, you've said that before. But it doesn't answer the question.
  #588  
Old 28.04.2010, 19:23
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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Israel wants Palestine to give up Jerusalem
But I am not Israel now, am I? You are putting words into my mouth that I never spoke.
  #589  
Old 28.04.2010, 19:24
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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Some of my brothers and sisters were born in Kampala Uganda and hypocritically as socailists lived a wonderful colonial life until the Mau Mau kicked up.
Hoppy is there any country that you or your relatives are not connected with?
  #590  
Old 28.04.2010, 19:24
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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You're the one who's not understanding, my friend.

I'm not talking about Palestinians. I'm talking about the wider Muslim/Arab community. It was Egypt, Syria, etc who tried to destroy Israel and wipe it off the map. Therefore they are partly to blame for the current mess. If they had been good and freindly neighbours, Israel wouldn't have colonised their territories or even the West Bank or Gaza. Palestinians wouldn't be suffering as much as they are. These guys don't care about what happens to poor Palestinians (if they did they'd let them into their countries and shelter them). No they are using them as a useful tool. They know if they suffer they will hate Israel all the more.
Egypt and Jordan are in bed with Israel and currently do pretty much as Israel says. The Zionists shouldn't have been colonizing Palestine in the first place. That's how they could have kept out of this mess.

The CURRENT situation has nothing to do with the 6 day war. It has to do with the Zionists want to build the temple so the Messiah will come. In order to do so they need Jerusalem. ALSO, the evangelical Christians believe that JESUS will not come back until all Jews go back to the land of "Israel". Israel is trying to colonize Palestine. Palestinians logically don't want it. The people who you are trying to bring into the picture aren't in Palestine, they're in Europe...
You're completely misinformed and shouldn't be allowed to vote in any country. Period
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  #591  
Old 28.04.2010, 19:27
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Re: European jewish call for reason

The last thing I'm going to say is that if Israel wants to commit ethnic cleansing then it should do so with it's own money and hopefully repay the US, GB and everyone else for the ABSURD amount of aid it had been given.
This little country with the population of Switzerland has gobbled up 114 billion dollars in direct US aid. Not to mention arms, food, technology.
  #592  
Old 28.04.2010, 19:29
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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Have you been to Leicester recently?
Actually I will be going in a couple of months, I expect to see lots of British people, the BNP say that they expect to do well in the election- so much for acceptance.
  #593  
Old 28.04.2010, 19:30
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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The last thing I'm going to say is that if Israel wants to commit ethnic cleansing then it should do so with it's own money and hopefully repay the US, GB and everyone else for the ABSURD amount of aid it had been given.
This little country with the population of Switzerland has gobbled up 114 billion dollars in direct US aid. Not to mention arms, food, technology.
it's funny how the people who end conversations with "the last thing im going to say on this" type lines is when they've started off sounding nice and reasonable and then steadily progressed to sounding more and more extreme until they "sign off" with a really absurd generalization so that they leave the room with the hands over their ears.

And i don't know anything about the conflict except that lots of people seem to die and its all the blighty's fault.
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  #594  
Old 28.04.2010, 19:31
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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Are you so sure?

There is probably nobody in the region who didn't colonise (your word) or invade Palestine at one point. The same pattern as far as you can go back in history all the way to Biblical times. Never is a big word. Use it with caution.
Biblical times, I detect a faint hint of Christian interpretation?
  #595  
Old 28.04.2010, 19:36
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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Hoppy is there any country that you or your relatives are not connected with?
Mine's the type of family that likes to roam around- not always a good thing!
I'm even supposed to have Jewish in there somewhere. I am a diaspora-can I have my own homeland- I'd like yours.

Oh yes people keep putting yadda, yadda's in my qouteds- is that some kind of biblical times language- some abcient form of aramaic, or just teh language of the tongues- yadda yadda gobbledy gook I need a translation.
  #596  
Old 28.04.2010, 19:36
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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It was never just theirs that's the whole point. Even if it was- so? Since the exodus of the Israel people began there have been many countries where the natives have been driven out. So NY should be goven back to the native Americans, Australia should be given back to the control of aboroginal councils- need I go on? Get real- it is about time the world stopped paying into this promised land fable, if so what's fair for one culture is fair for all let's start giving everything back.
Ok let's forget the historic Jewish connection to the land and Jerusalem. So now 60+ years have passed since modern Israel was created. Which is roughly same age as many modern post colonial era countries. Time for you to move on and stop living 60+ year in the past too

Just like native Americans ain't getting USA back same way Israel ain't going anywhere. Modern Israel is here to stay.
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  #597  
Old 28.04.2010, 19:38
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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Ok let's forget the historic Jewish connection to the land and Jerusalem. So now 60+ years have passed since modern Israel was created. Which is roughly same age as many modern post colonial era countries. Time for you to move on and stop living 60+ year in the past too

Just like native Americans ain't getting USA back same way Israel ain't going anywhere. Modern Israel is here to stay.
Great-lets talk about the Goldstone report- and is it true that he can't go to the Barmitzvah?

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Goldstone bar mitzvah saga exposes moral decadence of Jewish leadership– and burgeoning universalism in the grassroots






http://mondoweiss.net/2010/04/goldst...rassroots.html
  #598  
Old 28.04.2010, 19:39
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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Mine's the type of family that likes to roam around- not always a good thing!
I'm even supposed to have Jewish in there somewhere. I am a diaspora-can I have my own homeland- I'd like yours.
I don't believe in silly concepts like my homeland, my religion, my people, my race.....
So you can have what you want.
  #599  
Old 28.04.2010, 19:40
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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Great-lets talk about the Goldstone report- and is it true that he can't go to the Barmitzvah?
Talk about going tangent
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Old 28.04.2010, 19:43
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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it's funny how the people who end conversations with "the last thing im going to say on this" type lines is when they've started off sounding nice and reasonable and then steadily progressed to sounding more and more extreme until they "sign off" with a really absurd generalization so that they leave the room with the hands over their ears.

And i don't know anything about the conflict except that lots of people seem to die and its all the blighty's fault.
What absurd generalization? Did I just say all Americans are fat or something like that?
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