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Old 29.04.2010, 18:17
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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Sorry but this is a big misconception. There is nothing like that in Standard teaching of Islam..nowhere! And there is no single muslim imam or cheikh who can tell or explain why God is doing/allowing something. I challenge you to bring a valid reference of something like that.
The standard opinion of belief of the arab street is that it happened because of the guilt felt by europeans after WWII and the corruption, ignorance and despotism of the arabic leaders.
Maybe God is allowing this or doing nothing because maybe he isn't there!
  #662  
Old 29.04.2010, 18:18
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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the allied and soviets splitted germany and each part got its share. Why didn't they give some part of it to the jews...after all it's the german who started and did all this mess.
I won't reply, as my response would risk invoking Godwin's law...
  #663  
Old 29.04.2010, 18:24
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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Aren't all children the same?
I don't know you tell me? Few posts back it was kind of obvious that an Atheist is lowest of the low so I assume their kids would be low too? So all kids are not same right?

Please place equal if not more blame on the Palestinian parents for brainwashing their kids and using them as propaganda fodder.
  #664  
Old 29.04.2010, 18:24
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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the allied and soviets splitted germany and each part got its share. Why didn't they give some part of it to the jews...after all it's the german who started and did all this mess.
The Jews have a much longer history of persecution but yes I believe that Germany as well as many other countries are guilty. But the Palestinians and now Lebanon will pay.
  #665  
Old 29.04.2010, 18:35
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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That logic doesn't work and you know it. Large parts of Scotland are unoccupied, heck, large parts of the Russia, the US and Canada are also unoccupied - why don't we just send them there? C'mon, you can do better than that Economisto.
He's parotting a piece of revisionist history made famous by the Joan Peters book, "From Time immemorial".
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  #666  
Old 29.04.2010, 18:38
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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the allied and soviets splitted germany and each part got its share. Why didn't they give some part of it to the jews...after all it's the german who started and did all this mess.
The first anti-Jewish pogroms occurered in ancient Babylon or maybe even in ancient Egypt. So maybe we should be looking at taking lands rom Egypt or Iraq?
  #667  
Old 29.04.2010, 18:38
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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He's parotting a piece of revisionist history made famous by the Joan Peters book, "From Time immemorial".
Thanks... loved the quote:

“when a number of scholars examined the book carefully, they concluded that it was of no scholarly value whatsoever. It ignores important parts of the documentary record, misuses the sources on which it does rely, and contains straightforward logical errors. Consequently, according to Menetrez, "Peters’ book has been rejected as worthless by the scholarly community around the world, including Israel"
  #668  
Old 29.04.2010, 18:40
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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I don't know you tell me? Few posts back it was kind of obvious that an Atheist is lowest of the low so I assume their kids would be low too? So all kids are not same right?

Please place equal if not more blame on the Palestinian parents for brainwashing their kids and using them as propaganda fodder.
Unfortunately most parents brainwash their kids! We all do it to some extent even when we try not to. This is the environment that the children are growing up in an environment caused by heavily armed Israeli oppression. The Zionists that want to reclaim the whole of the so called promised land want these children gone. What shoulod Palestinian parents do- say yes we accept - take our land, take our lives, take our children we are evil to resist?

To me all kids are the same flesh and blood. I don't see prisons for Israeli kids in Palestine. I don't see Israeli kids dying in the same numbers or suffering mutations due to the poisonous bombardments. I don't see Israeli kids being denied access to clean water.
  #669  
Old 29.04.2010, 18:40
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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The first anti-Jewish pogroms occurered in ancient Babylon or maybe even in ancient Egypt. So maybe we should be looking at taking lands rom Egypt or Iraq?
No let's take it from Italy because of Masada.
  #670  
Old 29.04.2010, 18:42
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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Thanks... loved the quote:

“when a number of scholars examined the book carefully, they concluded that it was of no scholarly value whatsoever. It ignores important parts of the documentary record, misuses the sources on which it does rely, and contains straightforward logical errors.
So it would feel very much at home here on EF then
.
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  #671  
Old 29.04.2010, 18:42
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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The first anti-Jewish pogroms occurered in ancient Babylon or maybe even in ancient Egypt. So maybe we should be looking at taking lands rom Egypt or Iraq?
Why not just give them Italy? The diaspora started before them, but it ended with the Romans...

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So it would feel very much at home here on EF then
.
Quite, but I didn't want to say it

Last edited by Carlos R; 29.04.2010 at 18:44. Reason: Merged posts
  #672  
Old 29.04.2010, 19:03
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Re: European jewish call for reason

I think the question you're asking is, with nowhere else to send them, would I send starving, persecuted Kurdish children to an unoccupied part of Scotland? The answer is Yes.

But hell, the logic wasn't great. But time has passed and soon there will be no one left from the 40s. This will confer absolute rights to the country, to the current regime much like the US government has absolute rights to the USA, irrespective of past injustices to the native population.


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That logic doesn't work and you know it. Large parts of Scotland are unoccupied, heck, large parts of the Russia, the US and Canada are also unoccupied - why don't we just send them there? C'mon, you can do better than that Economisto.
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Old 29.04.2010, 19:08
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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Unfortunately most parents brainwash their kids! We all do it to some extent even when we try not to. This is the environment that the children are growing up in an environment caused by heavily armed Israeli oppression. The Zionists that want to reclaim the whole of the so called promised land want these children gone. What shoulod Palestinian parents do- say yes we accept - take our land, take our lives, take our children we are evil to resist?
Yes always the Jews to blame for everything No self soul searching? It takes two to tango and the kind of brainwashing you are talking about is not the one I was talking about. I value life too much to put any ideology before my safety. If I had kids I would make sure they would not be hanging on the streets throwing rocks, being strapped with explosives or standing next to extremists while they do their dirty business.

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I don't see Israeli kids dying in the same numbers or suffering mutations due to the poisonous bombardments. I don't see Israeli kids being denied access to clean water.
It's not for lack of trying though is it?

Last edited by scribble; 29.04.2010 at 19:13. Reason: soul not sole LOL
  #674  
Old 29.04.2010, 19:19
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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He's parotting a piece of revisionist history made famous by the Joan Peters book, "From Time immemorial".
No. He isn't. You get one more try before the buzzer...

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Unfortunately most parents brainwash their kids! We all do it to some extent even when we try not to. This is the environment that the children are growing up in an environment caused by heavily armed Israeli oppression. The Zionists that want to reclaim the whole of the so called promised land want these children gone. What shoulod Palestinian parents do- say yes we accept - take our land, take our lives, take our children we are evil to resist?

To me all kids are the same flesh and blood. I don't see prisons for Israeli kids in Palestine. I don't see Israeli kids dying in the same numbers or suffering mutations due to the poisonous bombardments. I don't see Israeli kids being denied access to clean water.
This all makes sense! No wait. I meant none of it does. OK, so if a child was in front of you pointing a gun to your head what would you do? I think "imprisoning" that child would be the lowest agression, highest risk strategy possible. Personally I'd kill it. Anyway, the reason why you don't see Palestinians imprisoning Israeli children, is because Palestinians are terrorists - they like blowing Israeli children to bolognese, not imprisoning them. Secondly, it's because on Monday mornings most Israeli children wake up, eat their cornflakes and get off to school while their Palestinian "peers" strap on bombs or pick up rocks to throw at people.
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  #675  
Old 29.04.2010, 19:25
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Re: European jewish call for reason

That's overstating it a little. I'm sure not all Palestinians are terrorists, any more than all Jews are rabid Zionists. I know Hoppy is irritating, but don't rise to the bait.
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  #676  
Old 29.04.2010, 19:44
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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That's overstating it a little. I'm sure not all Palestinians are terrorists, any more than all Jews are rabid Zionists. I know Hoppy is irritating, but don't rise to the bait.
I don't think Economisto was implying that. But he was implying that many of the Palestinian children who were apparently treated cruelly by the Israeli police may not have been as innocent as they seem.
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  #677  
Old 29.04.2010, 19:51
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Re: European jewish call for reason

I was implying that, but was also rising to the bait and didn't really mean it. Most Palestinians obviously aren't active terrorists. But I've been to Rafah and spoken to people there, and everyone I spoke to was in favour of killing Israelis and taking back land (although most of them were against martyrdom to do it). This is unsurprising, but the arguments here are so laughable I'm not sure how to respond half the time. I think we need to start by stopping using the word "Palestinians" since there is no single Palestinian desire, leader, people or anything else. If we stop viewing the middle east through the American constructed dynamic we might get somewhere. Or we could do the Lebanese power sharing government

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That's overstating it a little. I'm sure not all Palestinians are terrorists, any more than all Jews are rabid Zionists. I know Hoppy is irritating, but don't rise to the bait.
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I don't think Economisto was implying that. But he was implying that many of the Palestinian children who were apparently treated cruelly by the Israeli police may not have been as innocent as they seem.
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Old 29.04.2010, 20:35
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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I was implying that, but was also rising to the bait and didn't really mean it. Most Palestinians obviously aren't active terrorists. But I've been to Rafah and spoken to people there, and everyone I spoke to was in favour of killing Israelis and taking back land (although most of them were against martyrdom to do it). This is unsurprising, but the arguments here are so laughable I'm not sure how to respond half the time. I think we need to start by stopping using the word "Palestinians" since there is no single Palestinian desire, leader, people or anything else. If we stop viewing the middle east through the American constructed dynamic we might get somewhere. Or we could do the Lebanese power sharing government
This is true, many if not most will say this. I don't blame them, I'd probably feel the same way. Rafah is one of the most God forsaken refujee towns there is. Anyways, I don't want to stray from the point that I'm making. The Palestinian government has no illusions of getting their land back from Israel. The only thing they're going for is to keep the little land they have left. You and I both know that won't happen and in 100 years there Palestinians will be but a memory. We can still debate on it and admit it's wrong.
  #679  
Old 29.04.2010, 20:51
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Re: European jewish call for reason

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This is true, many if not most will say this. I don't blame them, I'd probably feel the same way.
OK, one can understand the frustration and anger of those Arabs who have been left to fester in squalid shanty towns in the West Bank and Gaza since Israel thrashed the invading Arab armies back in '67, but what about those rich Arabs from Qatar, Saudi Arabia and elsewhere who would also like to see the Israelis annihilated and their land returned to 'Palestinian' rule?

And don't tell me they don't exist, because I've met them...
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  #680  
Old 29.04.2010, 20:56
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Re: European jewish call for reason

And where are the Saudi royal family, the self-declared caliphate of the 20th and 21st century umma when their flock are starving? If they wanted to help their brothers they could easily.
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OK, one can understand the frustration and anger of those Arabs who have been left to fester in squalid shanty towns in the West Bank and Gaza since Israel thrashed the invading Arab armies back in '67, but what about those rich Arabs from Qatar, Saudi Arabia and elsewhere who would also like to see the Israelis annihilated and their land returned to 'Palestinian' rule?

And don't tell me they don't exist, because I've met them...

Last edited by economisto; 29.04.2010 at 20:59. Reason: spelled their like they're :-(
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