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  #201  
Old 04.08.2011, 16:19
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

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  #202  
Old 04.08.2011, 16:23
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

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England adopted me in 1970 - and I lived there most of my adult life. London, Stoke and Newcastel-u-Lyme (Hoppy when were you there? For us 1972-75) and East Leicestershire. With family in Surrey, Norfolk and Devon and Notts. Married a Brit and acquired British Nationality in 72. A big part of my heart and soul will always be in the UK, and I love our regular visits all over the country. Just like my native and current country, CH - loving it doesn't mean one isn't able to see the good and the bad- that there are wonderful people in both, quite a few indifferent and a flexible % of bar stewarts. Loving both does not stop you from appreciated some aspects of one, and hate others, and vice versa. And it certainly never will be for me one against the other. Like children, or even pets, you can love both just as much, but in a different way.

A lot of Swiss and French do hate the US, though.
Between 72 and 75 I lived in a lot of different places, but school ( when I went) was near Cheadle. I lived in Meir Heath, Shelton (Stoke), Heaton Moor and London at that time. I was very into Northern Soul. I have been back, Hanley has a lot of ring-roads. I worked in Newcastle-under-Lyme, while at school and my sister lived there. Did you go to the festival in Newcastle -under-Lyme. I also worked at the Rose and Crown, Basford where a lot of talented musicians played mostly Santana/ Chick Corea type stuff. I took the money on the door! Were you at the Newcastle -u-L festival where they roasted an Ox?

This is where my parents are buried- Ilam Hall near Dovedale

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ilam_Hall_04.jpg

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  #203  
Old 04.08.2011, 16:24
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

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sorry, just my experience of living there for 30+ years, and experiencing my house, car and business being burgled multiple time, with no police investigations, paying stupid amounts of tax, paying 20 each way on the train to go 40km, and taking 90 minutes(when it bothered to run), having the inland revenue send bailiffs round to my business in front of customers because one of the inept staff managed to put a decimal point in the wrong place, but don't worry I was entitled to 250 compensation, and to top it all when we found out who robbed us having the police threaten to arrest me if anything where to happen to the scroates (and no, they didn't even speak to them)

this was in Norfolk and Kent (the garden of england LOL)

seriously happy my son doesn't have to grow up there
Don't debate, she's the type to be shocked if you use "rude language" to a negative behavior:
"There is absolutely no excuse for being so rude about somebody who is asking for information. Ignore or say what you have to say in a polite manner."
Odile 2011,

If you extend the logic you should be sorry for scaring the man who robbed you! You should have said what you had to say in a polite manner.


PS: I think she must have worked for the British government, politically correct obliged
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  #204  
Old 04.08.2011, 16:26
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

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Don't debate, she's the type to be shocked if you use "rude language" to a negative behavior:
"There is absolutely no excuse for being so rude about somebody who is asking for information. Ignore or say what you have to say in a polite manner."
Odile 2011,

If you extend the logic you should be sorry for scaring the man who robbed you! You should have said what you had to say in a polite manner.


PS: I think she must have worked for the British government, politically correct obliged
Is any of this actually relevant to the thread?
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  #205  
Old 04.08.2011, 16:32
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

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Is any of this actually relevant to the thread?
Well yes, she said "BigBlue2 - what a sad statement you make- and I totally disagree with it- not my experience at all. With my kids and so many of my ex students I am still in touch with. From ordinary comprehensives, and who have made excellent careers and are still thriving."

He "hate the uk" for his experience, which he quoted-
Then someone said it's sad and she disagrees-

So the guy is faking? or has he the right to express his opinion based on his experience?

I experienced and observed some of what he said, and I understand why he would hate the UK.

But I also understand that someone else, probably living in nice area, protected and not aware of everything can disagree. But to say it's sad and disagreeing... that's no more being neutral!
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  #206  
Old 04.08.2011, 16:32
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

When we first moved to Switzerland we stayed at the park Hotel in Winterthur- that was OK. Then they moved us to one of the soviet-type concrete blocks, where you got spied and checked on- especially when using the washing machine.
It was an aesthetic hell-hole which is why we moved out to a village.
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  #207  
Old 04.08.2011, 16:34
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

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Between 72 and 75 I lived in a lot of different places, but school ( when I went) was near Cheadle. I lived in Meir Heath, Shelton (Stoke), Heaton Moor and London at that time. I was very into Northern Soul. I have been back, Hanley has a lot of ring-roads. I worked in Newcastle-under-Lyme, while at school and my sister lived there. Did you go to the festival in Newcastle -under-Lyme. I also worked at the Rose and Crown, Basford where a lot of talented musicians played mostly Santana/ Chick Corea type stuff. I took the money on the door! Were you at the Newcastle -u-L festival where they roasted an Ox?

This is where my parents are buried- Ilam Hall near Dovedale

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ilam_Hall_04.jpg

I grew up in margate during the the 70's and always thought I remembered it with rose tinted glasses, but an old school friend posted some home videos of the seafront etc during that time, and it really was lovely, clean, friendly, people having fun, thriving. Take a trip there now (if your very brave!) its no exaggeration to say its a total toilet, we go back to the uk a couple of times a year and you can see it getting a little bit worse each time.
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  #208  
Old 04.08.2011, 16:39
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

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I grew up in margate during the the 70's and always thought I remembered it with rose tinted glasses, but an old school friend posted some home videos of the seafront etc during that time, and it really was lovely, clean, friendly, people having fun, thriving. Take a trip there now (if your very brave!) its no exaggeration to say its a total toilet, we go back to the uk a couple of times a year and you can see it getting a little bit worse each time.
The area where I grew up started bad, and has just got worse. It was a nasty, scruffy, violent place back in the seventies, and it's an even more nasty, scruffy, violent place now.

I guess that's progress of some sort, though.
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  #209  
Old 04.08.2011, 16:53
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

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The real England is an ugly, soulless place. It's better to sit and look at a National Trust calendar than actually go and live there.
Oddly (as I didn't have him down as this sort of person) it appears that DB likes living here because there are less poor people to ruin the surroundings.
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  #210  
Old 04.08.2011, 17:02
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

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Oddly (as I didn't have him down as this sort of person) it appears that DB likes living here because there are less poor people to ruin the surroundings.
Actually, that's not the case - the village in which we live in Glarnerland couldn't really be described as 'posh', even if it is surrounded by spectacular mountain scenery. It is an industrial village, not dissimilar to the one I grew up in, except that the factories here are still working...

Unlike anywhere I've lived in England, though, people round here have some pride in their surroundings. Fences and walls are well maintained, there is hardly any graffiti, street furniture hasn't been trashed for no good reason, there are rarely broken bottles or puke strewn across the pavement.

It isn't about poverty - it's about respect. Here you can leave a plant pot on the steps outside your house, and not have it smashed up by passing drunks. Here you can have an allotment and not have it ruined by bored kids pulling up all the seedlings. Here you can leave your car on the street and not find footprints on the roof and a smashed window in the morning.

And I'm not trying to compare the Zurich Gold Coast with Moss Side here - I'm comparing like with like: small towns or big villages, with a largely working class population, a few shops, a couple of pubs and a station.

Yet they are worlds apart. Why? Beats me. All I know is that I'd rather live here than there.
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  #211  
Old 04.08.2011, 17:11
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

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I grew up in margate during the the 70's and always thought I remembered it with rose tinted glasses, but an old school friend posted some home videos of the seafront etc during that time, and it really was lovely, clean, friendly, people having fun, thriving. Take a trip there now (if your very brave!) its no exaggeration to say its a total toilet, we go back to the uk a couple of times a year and you can see it getting a little bit worse each time.
I do go back, the poor areas are still poor and the natural beauty is still there.
I have only been disappointed in one area- Black Park has now become a dog toilet with lots of Pitbulls
http://www.buckscc.gov.uk/bcc/parks/black_park.page

London is buzzing- more exciting than ever. I will be there for the Olympics and rambling on the South Downs.
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  #212  
Old 04.08.2011, 17:12
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

Well I grew up in a tiny fishing village in Cornwall with a couple of shops and half a dozen pubs. And I can assure you DB that none of what you describe above happens there (except, perhaps, in the height of the tourist season ...) Cornwall is now an economically depressed area, not dissimlar in that respect to some of the northern English places that you describe.

Similarly, my sister lives in a tiny village in Somerset with no shops and one pub, which is beautifully and respectfully maintained.

Some English people do take a pride in where they live, you know
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Old 04.08.2011, 17:15
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

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It isn't about poverty - it's about respect.
Agreed.
What does the government do about it? Are they not the one who are suppose to lead the country? To manage the society?

What are they doing *besides pocketing expenses??

But maybe because they're living in their bubble they have actually not experienced "lack of respect"? So they think it's not really true, they would "disagree" on any negative description?

I would think so...
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  #214  
Old 04.08.2011, 17:16
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

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Well I grew up in a tiny fishing village in Cornwall with a couple of shops and half a dozen pubs. And I can assure you DB that none of what you describe above happens there (except, perhaps, in the height of the tourist season ...) Cornwall is now an economically depressed area, not dissimlar in that respect to some of the northern English places that you describe.

Similarly, my sister lives in a tiny village in Somerset with no shops and one pub, which is beautifully and respectfully maintained.

Some English people do take a pride in where they live, you know

and both places have some of the highest house prices in the uk and well out of reach of most 'working class' (whatever that means) people. lots of retired people
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Old 04.08.2011, 17:18
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

She ... that is me- worked as a teacher in city comprehensives in one of the most multicultural towns in the Midlands- so in no way protected from the realities of life. And as a teacher in inner city schools, I am quite used to cope very well with rude behaviour and language. I don't expect it from adults talking to newcomers asking for help and support though. I lived very close to 2 of the largest council estates where I had many friends, still have. Yes, there are some areas which are very tough to live in- I so agree. But to condemn the whole country for 'having gone to the dogs' and having 2 types of areas, the absolutely dire and terrible, and the ultra-posh la Cotswolds- is not my experience in the 41 years I lived there full-time- and the part-time life I still have now. In a very ordinary little market town in the very ordinary parts of the Midlands - and where most people on a normal income can afford to buy a decent house still.
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Old 04.08.2011, 17:19
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

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and both places have some of the highest house prices in the uk and well out of reach of most 'working class' (whatever that means) people. lots of retired people
I would agree re certain parts of Cornwall, where property prices are now absurdly high. However, there are still affordable pockets both there and in Somerset, many of which are still in desirable areas. Just about everywhere in the UK has lots of retired people!
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Old 04.08.2011, 17:30
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

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Actually, that's not the case - the village in which we live in Glarnerland couldn't really be described as 'posh', even if it is surrounded by spectacular mountain scenery. It is an industrial village, not dissimilar to the one I grew up in, except that the factories here are still working...

Unlike anywhere I've lived in England, though, people round here have some pride in their surroundings. Fences and walls are well maintained, there is hardly any graffiti, street furniture hasn't been trashed for no good reason, there are rarely broken bottles or puke strewn across the pavement.

It isn't about poverty - it's about respect. Here you can leave a plant pot on the steps outside your house, and not have it smashed up by passing drunks. Here you can have an allotment and not have it ruined by bored kids pulling up all the seedlings. Here you can leave your car on the street and not find footprints on the roof and a smashed window in the morning.

And I'm not trying to compare the Zurich Gold Coast with Moss Side here - I'm comparing like with like: small towns or big villages, with a largely working class population, a few shops, a couple of pubs and a station.

Yet they are worlds apart. Why? Beats me. All I know is that I'd rather live here than there.
I think that is about parenting skills and the family unit - not the country
Britain a great place - but it is blessed with some of the worst parenting skills in the world, and it has been like that for two generations.
Unfortunately Thatcher's "me, me ,me" and "I want it now" money grabbing policies got the ball rolling ....
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  #218  
Old 04.08.2011, 17:31
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

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and both places have some of the highest house prices in the uk and well out of reach of most 'working class' (whatever that means) people. lots of retired people
And house prices ins CH are what , more affordable?
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  #219  
Old 04.08.2011, 17:39
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

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And house prices ins CH are what , more affordable?
the point being, most houses in cornwall etc are privately owned, its an expensive area, with very little industry or jobs, so to live there you pretty much have to be a person of independent means, or you have to work your arse off to stay there, so you take better care of things and your surroundings.

whereas somewhere like margate, with massive unemployment, an inept corrupt local government etc where a huge percentage of people live in council provided accommodation, have no hope and couldn't give a toss, and you have a toilet, but its like a cancer, and spreads - quickly

and unfortunatly most of the working population in the uk have much of a choice where they live, they live where they can afford that is good for where they work.

gated communities are getting more and more common
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Old 04.08.2011, 17:43
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Re: Why do people hate the UK ?

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She ... that is me- worked as a teacher in city comprehensives in one of the most multicultural towns in the Midlands- so in no way protected from the realities of life. And as a teacher in inner city schools, I am quite used to cope very well with rude behaviour and language. I don't expect it from adults talking to newcomers asking for help and support though. I lived very close to 2 of the largest council estates where I had many friends, still have. Yes, there are some areas which are very tough to live in- I so agree. But to condemn the whole country for 'having gone to the dogs' and having 2 types of areas, the absolutely dire and terrible, and the ultra-posh la Cotswolds- is not my experience in the 41 years I lived there full-time- and the part-time life I still have now. In a very ordinary little market town in the very ordinary parts of the Midlands - and where most people on a normal income can afford to buy a decent house still.
Great that's more understandable than "I disagree" with his sad perception...

So how do you explain that some citizen have experienced "2 types of area" in the UK?
Also are those areas so "distinct" or separate? Because I've witnessed not respectful behavior from people from crap area in other nicer area. (Of course it's not only people from crap area who are not respectful).

I'm really curious about your sentence: "But to condemn the whole country for 'having gone to the dogs' and having 2 types of areas"...

So is it politically correct to say that or refuse to accept the reality? Or is it that more you think that there's no real issue with poorer areas?

I'm just trying to understand your view here-


Also what do you think the government do about the "not respectful actions"? Have you felt that the situation was "under control" where citizen could be safe, protected and criminals stopped in a reasonable time frame?

Because that's seems to be why "he hates the UK"
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