Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Language corner  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 21.07.2008, 01:48
matika's Avatar
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Pittsburgh, PA, US
Posts: 9
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
matika has no particular reputation at present
Greets to Everyone [Hearing impairment and Dialect]

My name's Kate, and I'm a writer and linguist (specialties in college, what was I thinking??) I'm divorced from a Swiss and we share custody of our kids. Though we've actually been divorced for some time, he requested that I consider moving to either Switzerland or perhaps southern Germany (lives in Aargau).

On the various considerations, I have come across a couple of issues that I would like some feedback on from some of the seasoned residents of Switzerland. The permit is not an issue--but rather language. I speak some Standard German, but my real problem lies in the fact that I am severely hearing-impaired.

For this reason, it may behoove me to ask some readers' opinions of which dialects of Swiss German may be more understandable to deaf ears (so to speak). Are there some dialects that are considered "clearer" than others?

Also as a matter of merely curiosity (for, at this stage at least, I have no reason to get Swiss citizenship), is knowledge of Swiss German sign language considered eligible for linguistic capabilities on citizenship?

Anyway, saying hi to everyone and looking forward to reading your responses!
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 21.07.2008, 02:35
Oldhand's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Zürich
Posts: 4,016
Groaned at 18 Times in 17 Posts
Thanked 6,832 Times in 2,058 Posts
Oldhand has a reputation beyond reputeOldhand has a reputation beyond reputeOldhand has a reputation beyond reputeOldhand has a reputation beyond reputeOldhand has a reputation beyond reputeOldhand has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Greets to Everyone

Hiya Matika, I cant answer any of your questions about sign language but a very good member "Eastenders" possibly could.
However I'd like to welcome you to the Forum.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 21.07.2008, 10:10
Nathu's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Zürich
Posts: 4,674
Groaned at 18 Times in 16 Posts
Thanked 2,208 Times in 1,248 Posts
Nathu has a reputation beyond reputeNathu has a reputation beyond reputeNathu has a reputation beyond reputeNathu has a reputation beyond reputeNathu has a reputation beyond reputeNathu has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Greets to Everyone

Hi Kate, welcome to the forum!

The Swiss hearing impaired seem to agree that Swiss German is a bit difficult to learn and that it can be challenging to read speakers with other dialects.

If you go for Swiss German, my advice is to learn the local dialect because you will need every oportunity you get to exercise, like everybody else. Also, in the case of Aargau, it's a dialect that will be well understood among the non-local Swiss. I'd only chose another dialect if there are more learning ressources for a neighboring one.

I wouldn't worry too much about the language requirements for naturalisation. Canton Aargau simply describes its requirement as "ability to communicate in either dialect or High German" (source).

I recommend that you have a look at the Swiss Deafzone forums which are available in English and German (not the some forums will be displayed, depending on your choice of language). Dialects are discussed here and here, for example.
__________________
Need help on how to post in the forum? Try the Frequently Asked Questions.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Nathu for this useful post:
  #4  
Old 21.07.2008, 10:27
Polorise's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: about there
Posts: 2,738
Groaned at 26 Times in 26 Posts
Thanked 2,325 Times in 1,259 Posts
Polorise has a reputation beyond reputePolorise has a reputation beyond reputePolorise has a reputation beyond reputePolorise has a reputation beyond reputePolorise has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Greets to Everyone [Hearing impairment and Dialect]

¨
welcome to the forum & good luck with your search.

further to Nathus post, here is a list of all the Naturalisation Offices, listed by Kanton.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 21.07.2008, 10:27
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Tessin
Posts: 6,193
Groaned at 124 Times in 91 Posts
Thanked 7,325 Times in 3,453 Posts
Mrs. Doolittle has a reputation beyond reputeMrs. Doolittle has a reputation beyond reputeMrs. Doolittle has a reputation beyond reputeMrs. Doolittle has a reputation beyond reputeMrs. Doolittle has a reputation beyond reputeMrs. Doolittle has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Greets to Everyone [Hearing impairment and Dialect]

Quote:
View Post
My name's Kate, and I'm a writer and linguist (specialties in college, what was I thinking??) I'm divorced from a Swiss and we share custody of our kids. Though we've actually been divorced for some time, he requested that I consider moving to either Switzerland or perhaps southern Germany (lives in Aargau).

On the various considerations, I have come across a couple of issues that I would like some feedback on from some of the seasoned residents of Switzerland. The permit is not an issue--but rather language. I speak some Standard German, but my real problem lies in the fact that I am severely hearing-impaired.

For this reason, it may behoove me to ask some readers' opinions of which dialects of Swiss German may be more understandable to deaf ears (so to speak). Are there some dialects that are considered "clearer" than others?

Also as a matter of merely curiosity (for, at this stage at least, I have no reason to get Swiss citizenship), is knowledge of Swiss German sign language considered eligible for linguistic capabilities on citizenship?

Anyway, saying hi to everyone and looking forward to reading your responses!
Hi Kate and welcome. There is a member here who is an audiologist - I will forward your post to her and perhaps she can give you some information.

There is a woman in our village who I often see in the local coffee shop and she uses sign language to communicate with her mother in law and kids. They speak Swiss German so I wil try and find out if there is a significant difference.

Not sure where in Kanton Aargau you are considering moving to but if you do take the plunge, good luck! As for the dialect, most everyone here speaks high German when requested so I wouldn't worry too much.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 21.07.2008, 10:57
EastEnders's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: former Biennoise, now in Belp
Posts: 2,148
Groaned at 11 Times in 10 Posts
Thanked 3,212 Times in 1,178 Posts
EastEnders has a reputation beyond reputeEastEnders has a reputation beyond reputeEastEnders has a reputation beyond reputeEastEnders has a reputation beyond reputeEastEnders has a reputation beyond reputeEastEnders has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Greets to Everyone

Quote:
View Post
Hiya Matika, I cant answer any of your questions about sign language but a very good member "Eastenders" possibly could.
However I'd like to welcome you to the Forum.

*BLUSH* ta muchly Oldhand you just made for a wonderful start into the new week for me ! Feels good to be appreciated

Matika, welcome to the forum i am indeed deafened ( spätertaubt as it is called ) and I have advised several members on the forum about this and the issues that come with it ( invalids insurance,hearing aids etcetc)

So as not to bore others with tech speak about our handicap, can I ask you to either PM me or send an email to syuv_ch_1999 *AT* yahoo *com


Cheerio
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 21.07.2008, 11:11
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Greets to Everyone [Hearing impairment and Dialect]

Hi Kate

Welcome! I see that your location is Pittsburgh, which is where I'm from originally. I don't know anything about your issue, however. But the forum is full of really interesting and knowledgeable people....and Switzerland is really lovely. I lived in the southern US before we came here, and I really missed the sort of vistas that you get in places like Pittsburgh, standing on top of the hills - here, it's even better, of course. Hope you will get all the info you need...

Best
e.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 22.07.2008, 11:43
Longbyt's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: ZH
Posts: 8,130
Groaned at 57 Times in 53 Posts
Thanked 12,980 Times in 4,732 Posts
Longbyt has a reputation beyond reputeLongbyt has a reputation beyond reputeLongbyt has a reputation beyond reputeLongbyt has a reputation beyond reputeLongbyt has a reputation beyond reputeLongbyt has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Greets to Everyone [Hearing impairment and Dialect]

As you probably get all the Info you need from EastEnders, I'll keep it short.
Quote:
View Post
but my real problem lies in the fact that I am severely hearing-impaired.
For this reason, it may behoove me to ask some readers' opinions of which dialects of Swiss German may be more understandable to deaf ears (so to speak).
I have worked here with a couple of deaf swimmers (hearing aids in and out), know a couple of people deaf from birth (with cochlear implant), and had contact with quite a few people going deaf as they get older.
Particularly when it is really important that the conversation is correctly understood, all of them seem to get on better with High German. Understanding depends on more than just hearing. We all guess, to a certain extent, what the other person 'probably' said. And the more we can 'delete' what they probably didn't say, the easier it is.
It would be fine if you could pick up some dialect but I would definitely try to get your High German as good as possible first. You will need it for all written information and if you are with a group of people, you won't get far saying that the Aargauers can speak their own dialect and everyone else should speak High German.
__________________
Longbyt
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 22.07.2008, 12:48
BHBT's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: was Züri
Posts: 957
Groaned at 19 Times in 16 Posts
Thanked 901 Times in 415 Posts
BHBT has a reputation beyond reputeBHBT has a reputation beyond reputeBHBT has a reputation beyond reputeBHBT has a reputation beyond reputeBHBT has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Greets to Everyone [Hearing impairment and Dialect]

Hi Kate,
Not sure if you use sign language now, but if you do, I'd recommend learning German sign language, and then progress to Swiss-German (Deutschschweizerische Gebärdensprache). There are some differences.

Similarly if you rely on oral language, then concentrate on improving your Standard German before your Swiss German as it is the accepted 'general' German and, more importantly, you already have a foundation there.

If you have any questions, feel free to PM me. I don't sign myself, but can help you with resources etc.

Barbra.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 22.07.2008, 13:40
boyInterrupted's Avatar
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 68
Groaned at 3 Times in 1 Post
Thanked 21 Times in 18 Posts
boyInterrupted has no particular reputation at present
Re: Greets to Everyone [Hearing impairment and Dialect]

Quote:
View Post

For this reason, it may behoove me to ask some readers' opinions of which dialects of Swiss German may be more understandable to deaf ears (so to speak). Are there some dialects that are considered "clearer" than others?
Maybe Bern .. Bernese swiss-german is said to be very slow. It might help in picking the words more easily.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 22.07.2008, 19:10
matika's Avatar
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Pittsburgh, PA, US
Posts: 9
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
matika has no particular reputation at present
Re: Greets to Everyone

Thanks for the information. Very helpful!
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 22.07.2008, 19:13
matika's Avatar
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Pittsburgh, PA, US
Posts: 9
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
matika has no particular reputation at present
Re: Greets to Everyone [Hearing impairment and Dialect]

Okay, I will bear that in mind. Yes, I'm definitely not one of those Americans who thinks everyone should bow to my whims (lol, there are more than a few of them, I think everyone has encountered them, sooner or later! I believe that when one settles in a country, they should do their best to learn the language, if they don't already know it. Thanks for your input.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 22.07.2008, 19:15
matika's Avatar
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Pittsburgh, PA, US
Posts: 9
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
matika has no particular reputation at present
Re: Greets to Everyone [Hearing impairment and Dialect]

Ah, a fellow Pittsburgher...I've seen the mountains in Switzerland lots of times, though alas, I have not been able to actually take in some views from one. I do plan on it, though.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 22.07.2008, 19:15
matika's Avatar
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Pittsburgh, PA, US
Posts: 9
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
matika has no particular reputation at present
Re: Greets to Everyone [Hearing impairment and Dialect]

I'd appreciate anything you could do to find out and pass along to me!
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 22.07.2008, 19:46
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Greets to Everyone [Hearing impairment and Dialect]

Quote:
View Post
Maybe Bern .. Bernese swiss-german is said to be very slow. It might help in picking the words more easily.
I've also heard that Bernese Swiss German is one of the most difficult dialects to learn. Whether this is true or not I don't know (the people who told me this are Bernese) but Bernese Swiss German does have a lot of guttural g sounds, and has some sounds and words similar to Dutch.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 22.07.2008, 19:49
Lob's Avatar
Lob Lob is offline
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: -
Posts: 7,814
Groaned at 45 Times in 40 Posts
Thanked 1,973 Times in 1,060 Posts
Lob has a reputation beyond reputeLob has a reputation beyond reputeLob has a reputation beyond reputeLob has a reputation beyond reputeLob has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Greets to Everyone [Hearing impairment and Dialect]

by the way, just to mention that, as you're divorced, you have no simplified rights to Swiss citizenship.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 22.07.2008, 20:09
matika's Avatar
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Pittsburgh, PA, US
Posts: 9
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
matika has no particular reputation at present
Re: Greets to Everyone [Hearing impairment and Dialect]

Yep, I'm aware of that. Too bad really, it would have been quite handy. But as I don't anticipate actually trying to get citizenship, I guess it doesn't really impact my situation. Fortunately I wasn't banking on trying to get a permit based on him, either. That would have been a sore disappointment as well, I suppose!
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 22.07.2008, 20:22
marmoset's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: ZH Oberland
Posts: 431
Groaned at 4 Times in 4 Posts
Thanked 209 Times in 125 Posts
marmoset is considered knowledgeablemarmoset is considered knowledgeablemarmoset is considered knowledgeable
Re: Greets to Everyone [Hearing impairment and Dialect]

Quote:
I've also heard that Bernese Swiss German is one of the most difficult dialects to learn. Whether this is true or not I don't know (the people who told me this are Bernese) but Bernese Swiss German does have a lot of guttural g sounds, and has some sounds and words similar to Dutch.
Plus they swallow half of it and have some "funny" pronunciations, like turning the double L into a W: teller (plate) being pronounced tewwer.

FWIW, according to my ex-GF (hearing deaf, hörend taub), Basel dialect is easiest, as they draw out the vowels and articulate properly, also it's closest to High South German. Züridüütsch? Too fast!
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 22.07.2008, 20:23
AbFab's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Zürich
Posts: 7,939
Groaned at 337 Times in 228 Posts
Thanked 11,185 Times in 3,876 Posts
AbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Greets to Everyone [Hearing impairment and Dialect]

Hi Kate,

The few Swiss people I have met with your disability have been taught to speak high German, not dialect. Though, we have no idea of the severity of disability.

However, you will realise that though your children will be able to speak high German once they go to school, they, like many Swiss, may find high German a barrier and the only dialect they will know is their local one.

You may well find yourselves communicating in English...
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 22.07.2008, 20:47
EastEnders's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: former Biennoise, now in Belp
Posts: 2,148
Groaned at 11 Times in 10 Posts
Thanked 3,212 Times in 1,178 Posts
EastEnders has a reputation beyond reputeEastEnders has a reputation beyond reputeEastEnders has a reputation beyond reputeEastEnders has a reputation beyond reputeEastEnders has a reputation beyond reputeEastEnders has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Greets to Everyone [Hearing impairment and Dialect]

Quote:
View Post
Plus they swallow half of it and have some "funny" pronunciations, like turning the double L into a W: teller (plate) being pronounced tewwer.

FWIW, according to my ex-GF (hearing deaf, hörend taub), Basel dialect is easiest, as they draw out the vowels and articulate properly, also it's closest to High South German. Züridüütsch? Too fast!

Whilst i agree about the Züridütsch with you as being to quick and often like a staccato , I am a Bernese, I rely on lipreading mostly and I find my dialect not particularly difficult, I am lipreading in H Ger ,English and French as well and don't think them either as difficult at all, thus I conclude that it has a lot to do with personal adaptibility and ability.

For some it may help to book a course with the local Schwerhörigenverein,whereas for others who really struggle it may be easier to switch to High German alltogether.

I am one of these persons who never had trouble learning or understanding a new language ,but I can not calculate well nor am I any good with numbers in general...... and I know the opposite to this exists as well I think it has to do with the brain which half of it is your stronger one.
__________________
Voluntary SWISS shoe -horn to Expats since 1999, do I get a medal now?

Last edited by EastEnders; 22.07.2008 at 21:56.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank EastEnders for this useful post:
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Greets from Baden Hsiang Introductions 4 06.06.2008 23:52
echt luschtig (swiss dialect jokes) bubbles4352 Jokes/funnies 6 07.11.2007 13:34
Insurance for people with hearing disabilities eireann Insurance 11 23.03.2007 20:21
Greets! incognito Introductions 3 05.03.2007 00:16


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 18:52.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0