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  #61  
Old 20.02.2021, 12:23
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Re: How does Switzerland manage four national languages?

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Isn't the issue that Lombard is evidently comparatively close to standard Italian, and Arpitan to standard French compared to how close Rumantsch is to Italian (presuming one accepts it is closer to Italian than French?). Can you understand Rumantsch as an Italian and French speaker Tom?
Depends on WHICH Rumantsch, Surselvian has a lot of similarities with railroad-dialect.

Also, Rumantsch is one of the three Swiss languages that I actually studied (Italian is the one that I have never studied).

Tom
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Old 20.02.2021, 12:27
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Re: How does Switzerland manage four national languages?

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Agreed, Lombard dialects in Italy are much closer to standard Italian than Arpitan is to Parisian French, yet the Italians regard Lombard as a separate language. And Lombard in Switzerland is quite far removed from Lombard in Italy, in fact it's considered much "purer" than its Italian cousin(s).
All the Lombardians that I know basically either speak Italian, or something close to Ticinese (as do most Ticinese).

I was once at a motoraduno in Mandello d.L., and a German guy I knew came to me and asked why I could understand the old dude who ran the bar in the park and they all couldn't, despite having a good handle on Italian.

"He's not speaking Italian" was my response, "it's dialekt"!

Tom
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  #63  
Old 20.02.2021, 12:30
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Re: How does Switzerland manage four national languages?

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Parisian French speakers do indeed have a lot of trouble understanding spoken Arpitan dialects, hence my contention that Arpitan should be regarded as a separate language.
TBF most Parisians struggle with almost anything from South of the Loire.

But yes, there are very many alternative 'French' languages, some of which may be recognised, even if only locally, as such, like the Savoyard that's spoken in areas of both France and Italy not a million miles from here.

FWIW I had no trouble understanding your written Arpitan quote, just as I don't with Savoyard, but then I do know more than a sprinkling of Italian and some Spanish, so that probably helps somewhat. Spoken forms are another thing altogether, often with pronunciations so far from standard French (or Italian, Spanish, whatever) that most non-locals have no chance of understanding it.
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Old 20.02.2021, 12:42
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Re: How does Switzerland manage four national languages?

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Also, Rumantsch is one of the four Swiss languages that I actually studied (Italian is the one that I have never studied).
FTFY, Tom. If you're including Rumantsch, it has to be four.
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  #65  
Old 20.02.2021, 13:01
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Re: How does Switzerland manage four national languages?

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FTFY, Tom. If you're including Rumantsch, it has to be four.
Please re-read my post, I said of the three that I have STUDIED!

I have never studied Italian.

Tom
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Old 20.02.2021, 13:54
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Re: How does Switzerland manage four national languages?

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Depends on WHICH Rumantsch, Surselvian has a lot of similarities with railroad-dialect.

Also, Rumantsch is one of the three Swiss languages that I actually studied (Italian is the one that I have never studied).

Tom
Earlier you said Ladin is nearly the same Rumantsch - which dialect of Rumantsch?
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  #67  
Old 20.02.2021, 14:34
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Re: How does Switzerland manage four national languages?

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Earlier you said Ladin is nearly the same Rumantsch - which dialect of Rumantsch?
It is similar to all of them to varying degrees.

Tom
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