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Old 25.03.2010, 13:14
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Use of the apostrophe and other linguistic pitfalls

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I am a journalist/author for both Swiss and Irish aviation magazine's and I am available to provide you with ... a proof reading service


Proof reading, you say?
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Old 25.03.2010, 13:19
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Re: English Proof Reader/Author Available

DB - if it's the apostrophe you mean, its usage in plurals is becoming so 'universal' that very soon it will be considered correct...
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Old 25.03.2010, 13:22
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Re: English Proof Reader/Author Available

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DB if it's the apostrophe you mean, its usage in plurals is becoming so 'universal' that very soon it will be considered correct...
For greengrocers, perhaps.

But proof readers?
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Old 25.03.2010, 13:38
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Re: English Proof Reader/Author Available

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DB - if it's the apostrophe you mean, its usage in plurals is becoming so 'universal' that very soon it will be considered correct...
I was speaking to an official translator for the Swiss guvment a few weeks ago and she (English) confirmed to my horror that it is also now perfectly acceptable to end a sentence with a preposition (I owe my wife a Coke on that one ), PLUS, it's OK to answer the phone thus (thusly?):

"Hello, may I speak to Doagalies Barkfest?"

"Yes, this is him".....


In fact, the above is apparently preferable now. Bloo'y 'ell.
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Old 25.03.2010, 13:45
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Re: English Proof Reader/Author Available

Never! Not on my watch!!
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Old 25.03.2010, 13:46
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Re: English Proof Reader/Author Available

But you do not really believe that Mr. Barkfest would deign to answer the telephone himself by any chance? What is the world coming to?


We are being very naughty and very Off-Topic.
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Old 25.03.2010, 13:49
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Re: English Proof Reader/Author Available

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(I owe my wife a Coke on that one )
You such a cheap bastid...

Actually, it is a positive thing that the language is evolving, adjusting to the users' needs. I come from a place that has a number of committees and special books on codified versions of things, every year there must be a decision made in terms of what gets accepted as proper and every one has to buy a new book of codifications. Try to teach the language with this mess going on, it is difficult enough as it is.

Language purists irk me to death. It's a bloody painful bollox. I hate text speak, media carelessness and so on but do not want to sound bookish and obsolete either, (sorry DB, we love the fact you do). So I applaud the flexibility of English, I do not always contribute this progress to ignorance of speakers, it's more a question of economy of the language, simplifying the rules that do not have much reason anymore, relation to other languages and process in them, etc.
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Old 25.03.2010, 13:55
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Re: English Proof Reader/Author Available

Hi guys,

Take a look at a book called 'Eats Shoots & Leaves' by Lynne Truss - this gives a great insight into the English language and how to use punctuation etc. I have to say, as a native English speaker I do not envy anyone trying to learn the language. There are so many rules and so many of these rules have been altered over the years that even us native English speakers find it difficult to keep up. Have a great day. Shirls.
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Old 25.03.2010, 13:58
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Re: English Proof Reader/Author Available

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Hi guy's,

Take a look at a book called 'Eat's Shoot's & Leave's' by Lynne Trus's - this give's a great insight into the English language and how to use punctuation etc. I have to say, as a native English speaker I do not envy anyone trying to learn the language. There are so many rule's and so many of these rule's have been altered over the year's that even us native English speaker's find it difficult to keep up. Have a great day. Shirls.
Fixed that for you.
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Old 25.03.2010, 13:59
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Re: English Proof Reader/Author Available

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Hi guys,

Take a look at a book called 'Eats Shoots & Leaves' by Lynne Truss - this gives a great insight into the English language and how to use punctuation, etc. I have to say, as a native English speaker I do not envy anyone trying to learn the language. There are so many rules and so many of these rules have been altered over the years that even us native English speakers find it difficult to keep up. Have a great day. Shirls.
Here, fixed that punctuation for you...

Sorry, I am just taking a pish. Good luck with your business and welcome.
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Old 25.03.2010, 14:00
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Re: English Proof Reader/Author Available

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You such a cheap bastid...

Actually, it is a positive thing that the language is evolving, adjusting to the users' needs. I come from a place that has a number of committees and special books on codified versions of things, every year there must be a decision made in terms of what gets accepted as proper and every one has to buy a new book of codifications. Try to teach the language with this mess going on, it is difficult enough as it is.

Language purists irk me to death. It's a bloody painful bollox. I hate text speak, media carlessness and so on but do not want to sound bookish and obsolete either, (sorry DB, we love the fact you do). So I applaud the flexibility of English, I do not always contribute this progress to ignorance of speakers, it's more a question of economy of the language, simplifying the rules that do not have much reason anymore, relation to other languages and process in them, etc.
Then why have proofreaders

Sloppy writing irks me to death, but what gets me more are people who claim to have English as their core competence and yet write carelessly. What's with magazine's? I could point out a few other mistakes.

Problem is, as we keep reading sloppy writing over and over, the mind gets used to it, and such things gain acceptance over time. I am all for language evolving, new words entering dictionary, and all that stuff, but not sloppy writing.
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Old 25.03.2010, 14:01
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Re: English Proof Reader/Author Available

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Hi guys,

Take a look at a book called 'Eats Shoots & Leaves' by Lynne Truss - this gives a great insight into the English language and how to use punctuation etc.
You're leaving yourself WIDE open here.

I would NEVER dare to question DB on English or grammar or suggest that he check his own text unless I had spent the the entire previous night checking through what I intended to say. I think he has grammar books for breakfast and eats dictionaries (always the newest edition) for lunch.
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Old 25.03.2010, 14:03
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Re: English Proof Reader/Author Available

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I would NEVER dare to question DB on English or grammar or suggest that he check his own text
You'd be more than welcome! I'm as sloppy as any other writer, although I sometimes shock myself at my ability to write coherently when I'm horribly drunk.

But I'm not advertising my services as a proof reader...
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Old 25.03.2010, 14:04
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Re: English Proof Reader/Author Available

I can see language evolving, of course it does. And on prepositions, the big no-no still is to never use them when they are simply redundant "Where are you going to?", but OK like this "Where is that from?" instead of the awkward "From where is that?".

But, with all due respect to the OP (sorry for messing up your thread... maybe Longbyt can move the discussion to a new thread?), an apostrophe has a very specific purpose and accepting its use it to make plurals just seems silly to me. It's confusing enough in this language! Notice proper use of its and it's, thank you Mrs. Langois 1986
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Old 25.03.2010, 14:05
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Re: English Proof Reader/Author Available

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Hi guys,

Take a look at a book called 'Eats Shoots & Leaves' by Lynne Truss - this gives a great insight into the English language and how to use punctuation etc. I have to say, as a native English speaker I do not envy anyone trying to learn the language. There are so many rules and so many of these rules have been altered over the years that even us native English speakers find it difficult to keep up. Have a great day. Shirls.
As a non-native English speaker who's learned the language the hard way, I don't see what's so difficult to keep up with But I have to say it annoys me no end seeing natives molest their own mother-tongue and then trying to preach.
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Old 25.03.2010, 14:09
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Re: English Proof Reader/Author Available

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I can see language evolving, of course it does. And on prepositions, the big no-no still is to never use them when they are simply redundant "Where are you going to?", but OK like this "Where is that from?" instead of the awkward "From where is that?".

But, with all due respect to the OP (sorry for messing up your thread... maybe Longbyt can move the discussion to a new thread?), an apostrophe has a very specific purpose and accepting its use it to make plurals just seems silly to me. It's confusing enough in this language! Notice proper use of its and it's, thank you Mrs. Langois 1986
I wonder if "Where are you going to" could actually be acceptable when one is, for example, talking about holidays, etc. So, to go TO a specific place, ykwim?

I have heard it so many times..Is that an Americanism? Or just a language slobbism?
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Old 25.03.2010, 14:11
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Re: English Proof Reader/Author Available

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But, with all due respect to the OP (sorry for messing up your thread... maybe Longbyt can move the discussion to a new thread?),
I think Longbyt's English knowledge is greater than her Modding knowledge and she doesn't know how to break up this Thread so that it is still logical (more or less).
Situation: The OP is looking for work - so her post must stay where it is - and the rest doesn't make sense without it. Maybe when I get back tonight I'll come up with a brilliant idea. Maybe MathNut will see it and she can do long division better than I can anyway.
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Old 25.03.2010, 14:14
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Re: English Proof Reader/Author Available

About prepositions at the end of a sentence, I am also a professional writer (though medical/scientific, so some rules are just ignored ) and you also have to consider the ease of reading. Often it is just easier on the eye if the preposition is at the end.
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Old 25.03.2010, 14:34
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Re: Use of the apostrophe and other linguistic pitfalls

Quite honestly, I'd rather see this deleted than made into its own thread. (EDIT @ 16.04: this is intended as a statement of humility, NOT a criticism of the moderator who split the thread).

The opening post, which now looks like a Pedant's Manifesto, was a response to a member's advertising herself as a proof reader, a role for which she was clearly unqualified.

Anyone can use apostrophes wheresoever he chooses, and it's no skin off my nose. If someone, however, wishes to advertise her services as a proof reader, yet is unable to see what is wrong with magazine's as a plural, then I feel quite entitled to take issue with it.

Everyone else, on the other hand, may make his plurals as he sees fit without censure from me.

Just so that's clear.

Last edited by Dougal's Breakfast; 25.03.2010 at 17:10. Reason: I used "they" for a singular third person! Oh, the shame! The shame!
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Old 25.03.2010, 14:41
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Re: Use of the apostrophe and other linguistic pitfalls

Sorry DB.
It obviously isn't my day.

As the quote you put in told the story, I thought it would be OK.
Another time I'll delete or ask first.

Last edited by Longbyt; 25.03.2010 at 19:40. Reason: Thought has a 't' at the end.
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