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Old 05.07.2012, 22:20
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Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

Hi all

I have a question in regards to the type of support a parent living in Switzerland, owes towards their children.

A (19y old) teenage friend of mine wishes to move in with someone else. They have no conflicts with their parents (this family consists of B and C permit holders), but as this person attends a full time university course and has no income, they rely entirely on the income of their parents to sustain them.

As far as I understand, parents have some obligation towards their children until a certain age, such as providing them with the mandatory health coverage, food and clothing (perhaps even transportation needs).

But if this person was to leave the household, will they still be able to claim some support from their parents, or can the parents refuse to pay for bare necessities. If the latter, is there any recourse for this person to claim a minimum benefit package in some form or another.

I'm not sure if there are rules which differ between foreigners and Swiss citizens, thus I've decided to turn over to the EF for more advice.

Any clarification on the matter is welcome, thanks all
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Old 05.07.2012, 22:47
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

Children in Switzerland are entitled to full support from their parents until they have completed (pass or fail) their professional training, i.e around 21 to 24 years of age.

If the parents fail to do this, the children can go to social security and then the parents can be sued for a minimum standard of living, which is around SFr 1'700 per month, depending on the home address.

Many payments are tax deductible.
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Old 05.07.2012, 22:57
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

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Hi all

I have a question in regards to the type of support a parent living in Switzerland, owes towards their children.

A (19y old) teenage friend of mine wishes to move in with someone else. They have no conflicts with their parents (this family consists of B and C permit holders), but as this person attends a full time university course and has no income, they rely entirely on the income of their parents to sustain them.

As far as I understand, parents have some obligation towards their children until a certain age, such as providing them with the mandatory health coverage, food and clothing (perhaps even transportation needs).

But if this person was to leave the household, will they still be able to claim some support from their parents, or can the parents refuse to pay for bare necessities. If the latter, is there any recourse for this person to claim a minimum benefit package in some form or another.

I'm not sure if there are rules which differ between foreigners and Swiss citizens, thus I've decided to turn over to the EF for more advice.

Any clarification on the matter is welcome, thanks all
Surely the parents can dictate that their child lives in the family home and they can be supported there rather than have to fork out for the rent of a flat?

If the kids want to start dictating their living arrangements they can bloody fund them.

Bit scared now...
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Old 05.07.2012, 23:03
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

Yeah, I'm a bit scared now, too.
I was a bad teenager, so I'm sure I have some bad karma coming my way, once my little boy grows up. My mom jokes that there is probably STILL a boy hiding in the closet of my old room.

But this legal obligation may help explain why you don't see more homeless teenagers/young people here.
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Old 05.07.2012, 23:09
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

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Yeah, I'm a bit scared now, too.
I was a bad teenager, so I'm sure I have some bad karma coming my way, once my little boy grows up. My mom jokes that there is probably STILL a boy hiding in the closet of my old room.

But this legal obligation may help explain why you don't see more homeless teenagers/young people here.
That's why I never had kids!




As to the OP... Wow. Regardless of what the legal obligations are why doesn't he talk to his family. If they can't or won't pay for him to live away from home he should grow up and pay his own way. But that's not a legal opinion.

I moved out when I was 17 and have paid my own way ever since*. Of course she wasn't in a position to be paying my expenses though.

*except I still let my mommy buy me lots of presents when I visit her.
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Old 05.07.2012, 23:12
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

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Surely the parents can dictate that their child lives in the family home and they can be supported there rather than have to fork out for the rent of a flat? If the kids want to start dictating their living arrangements they can bloody fund them.
Thee was a case, I think within the last 5 years, where a son sued the father. Father argued there was a large comfortable family home, but the father lost and had to pay up.

Be happy, if they fail their first course you are off the hook. In Germany parents pay until the child is 27 years old, even after failing 3 degree courses!

Maybe you should take out a subscription to "Beobachter" magazine. Lots of useful articles, and free legal help over the telephone. http://beratung.beobachter.ch/main
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Old 06.07.2012, 00:38
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

If kids sue their parents then something is wrong.

Personally if my kid goes to university in another city and its not very viable to commute every day then yes i would pay for rent and other expenses (but not for every day partying!)

If they can live at home while studying then thats were they are staying unless they get a job to pay the rent in another place. Plus i would still expect some housework done!
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Old 06.07.2012, 02:04
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

Wow! Cant believe Im reading this. My parents prepared my sister and I both for when we turned 18. It was well communicated that when we turn 18 we would be out of the house. My folks walked us through the money we would need and how many hours we would need to work while away at University. Luckily I got a basketball scholarship that paid for school, but not for rent and food

I worked two jobs in highschool and saved up one year worth of rent by the time I was 18. When I got to college I worked every evening despite a full load of studying and 2 basketball practices per day.

Its not the end of the world to make your kids work. They will likely stay out of trouble and will also be more likely to meet other ambitious, hard working kids their age, at work than at parties.

My advice would be to ween them off of assistance and encourage them to work atleast part time. But maybe I grew up poor and just view this kind of support for a perfectly healthy individual as a symptom of a spoiled society? Whats the matter with weening kids into reality?
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Old 06.07.2012, 03:51
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

Have you tried living on SFr 1'700 in Switzerland? I can tell you it is very hard, and you cannot afford meat every day, especially if you have some tax payments outstanding.

When my ex-wife refused to work and I was no longer receiving unemployment money, the Social were asking my teenaged son to sue me for payments, which I could not afford. I avoided this by showing the Social all my statements, obligations etc, and they agreed, I was too poor, and we didn't need to go to court. However they continued to pay my wife SFr 3'500 per month support, and flagged us both for repayment. I ended up owing the social SFr 35'000, which has still not been repaid, and my ex-wife left Switzerland with half my pension fund.

It pays to keep your teenage children sweet and happy at home! When my son turned 19 he left home and went to a flat share with 4 student doctors. I now had a job & I could afford to pay him SFr 800 a month, and with his apprenticeship wages, he could manage to live. But after a year he came back home, he claims the doctors weren't clean enough, but maybe he could see there would be more money available if he lived with me. That was 3 years ago, and he is still here, with a well paid job, so it isn't too bad at home.
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Old 08.07.2012, 16:14
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

Thank you all!

This person has no intention to sue anyone. Like I said, they're on good terms with the parents.

The question just mostly centered around the fact that whilst they would be able to live in a shared flat with others, this person would have no way to pay for some food and health insurance.

The health insurance as we all know, can be several thousand chf a yet for a person living in this country, and an obligatory one too. The food procurements can usually be organized in return for doing house chores for others etc...

Anyway, the more you know as they say

And I agree going down the suing route is kinda poor karma, people should revert to serious talks with their family and friends first. There's gotta be a better way than getting the authorities involved.

Cheers
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Old 08.07.2012, 16:44
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

Shinigami, I am sure this does not apply in the case you mention- but I do think the Swiss system as described by Sbrinz is crazy. If a 'child' (over 21) behaves very badly towards his parents, moves out by choice and goes and study far from home (by choice, not because s/he can't study a specialised subject from home), perhaps drinks to excess, takes drugs, spends a lot of money on designer goods, etc, etc - why should parents have NO say whatsoever, or choice? We have friends who were put in that situation and it is hell on earth. Once 21 - payments and support should be by mutual agreement ad not 'forced'.

Last edited by Odile; 08.07.2012 at 19:44.
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Old 08.07.2012, 17:32
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

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Hi all

I have a question in regards to the type of support a parent living in Switzerland, owes towards their children.

A (19y old) teenage friend of mine wishes to move in with someone else. They have no conflicts with their parents (this family consists of B and C permit holders), but as this person attends a full time university course and has no income, they rely entirely on the income of their parents to sustain them.

As far as I understand, parents have some obligation towards their children until a certain age, such as providing them with the mandatory health coverage, food and clothing (perhaps even transportation needs).

But if this person was to leave the household, will they still be able to claim some support from their parents, or can the parents refuse to pay for bare necessities. If the latter, is there any recourse for this person to claim a minimum benefit package in some form or another.

I'm not sure if there are rules which differ between foreigners and Swiss citizens, thus I've decided to turn over to the EF for more advice.

Any clarification on the matter is welcome, thanks all
It's sad to even think one could force his or her own parents to pay "a minimum benefit package" in case the parents wouldn't agree with the moving out from home..They want an adult life they should be able to fund it themselves...is this a ridiculous idea only non-teenagers could have?
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Old 08.07.2012, 17:33
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

You will find that for low income families there is additional social support and also subsidised 'youth' transport and health insurance...

Also, our older apprentices get paid higher than our younger ones - it is marginally possible for them to live independently from age 21 on the higher apprentice wage plus some support from family or additional social security, and there are also subsidised housing schemes for these young people - share houses with much lower rent - our neighbours upstairs is a share house of 4 university students - they pay maybe 400-500 a month for their rent...and I can't say they seem to party much at all...
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Old 08.07.2012, 19:38
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

It certainly used to be possible to support oneself to some extent while studying, but things are not as easy as they used to be. With the new Bachelor/Masters system the amount of free time a student has to earn money has reduced. Moreover for various reasons the amount of student type jobs has also diminished.
Yes you are supposed to support your children until they have finished studying or apprenticeship and are capable of supporting themselves and they are able to take you to court if you don't. However the good news is that children are supposed to help financially if their aged parents fall on hard times.
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Old 08.07.2012, 19:46
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

Well it is a fact that in some C/Kantons in Switzerland, 'children' have to pick up the bill for elderly parents fees when their money runs out! Even if that means having to sell your own home! Not the case in Neuchatel, but it is in Bern. No idea which other K/C that applies to.
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Old 23.04.2018, 15:02
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

I'd like to revive this thread. Does anyone have a link to the laws? The general consensus here seems to be that some type of support is required until work training or school is complete. But exactly what, how much, and for how long?

If your adult child (let's say 20 years old) gets married and has a baby but is still in school, who pays for what? Not my situation, just curious.

Seems like a slippery slope, which is why I'm interested in a link to the laws that spell it out.
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Old 23.04.2018, 15:12
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

Swiss Civil Code Starting at Art. 276 https://www.admin.ch/opc/en/classifi...ndex.html#a276

May take some time to fully load and jump to the correct place.
Admin.ch is the official website of the Swiss government. The English version of the law is for information only. Official languages are Italian, French, and German. To switch language either change the /en/ in the URL to /it/, /fr/ or /de/ respectively or scroll all the way to the top to use the menu in the top right hand corner.
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Old 23.04.2018, 15:17
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

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I'd like to revive this thread. Does anyone have a link to the laws? The general consensus here seems to be that some type of support is required until work training or school is complete. But exactly what, how much, and for how long?

If your adult child (let's say 20 years old) gets married and has a baby but is still in school, who pays for what? Not my situation, just curious.

Seems like a slippery slope, which is why I'm interested in a link to the laws that spell it out.
If you understand German, here is a start.

https://richtlinien.skos.ch/f-finanz...rhaltspflicht/
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Old 23.04.2018, 17:22
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

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Swiss Civil Code Starting at Art. 276 https://www.admin.ch/opc/en/classifi...ndex.html#a276

May take some time to fully load and jump to the correct place.
Admin.ch is the official website of the Swiss government. The English version of the law is for information only. Official languages are Italian, French, and German. To switch language either change the /en/ in the URL to /it/, /fr/ or /de/ respectively or scroll all the way to the top to use the menu in the top right hand corner.
Thank you! this answered my question.
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Old 23.04.2018, 19:28
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Re: Parents 'support' obligations towards their children

Currently, I'm involved with just such a case. The young man is doing his apprenticeship, and earns Fr. 950 a month, before deductions. His marks at school are good, and his superiors commend him for his good work. He's polite and well-liked.

He lives with his parents, who receive "Kindergeld" for him each month.

His parents require of him to pay that part of his medical insurance premiums which is not covered by the Kindergeld, his transport, his clothing and toiletries, and also to pay them rent each month. They supply his food. He ends up with a very small amount of pocket-money.

Both parents work full-time, and they spend their income on socialising, holidays abroad whenever they have leave from work, and on refurbishing their holiday home abroad.

The young apprentice, in addition to his working hours, school hours and study-time, does an inordinate amount of housework at home: shopping, cooking, cleaning, laundry, ironing, not only his own things.

At least one parent is verbally very abusive and aggressive.

Since the young man is under a huge amount of pressure in this situation, his superiors at work advise him to move out, as does a counsellor at the apprenticeship advice centre.

He plainly cannot afford to support himself. In any application for any kind of financial help, he has had to supply details of his parents' income. Because they really do earn enough to support him, he has not been able to qualify for any kind of financial support from anywhere.

He has now been told that his only options are to continue to
a) break off his apprenticeship, get a job and move out
b) continue to live with his parents and endure the hell, or
c) sue his parents for support, which latter course would lead to new dimensions of hell through the family, for years to come.

I keep hoping that we will find a kind soul who would (perhaps out of a genuine wish to do something worthwhile on the planet and to rescue one good young man before he cracks completely) be able and willing to provide him with rent-free or nearly-free accommodation, for the next 16 months, in an abuse-free, civil environment.

Just in case there are any takers here (and bless you if you'd even consider this!).... because of the transport between his work, his school and his other family obligations, it'd ideally need to be within quick access of Bahnhof Stettbach or Bahnhof Oerlikon. Otherwise near Bahnhof Stadelhofen or Winterthur.
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