Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Other/general
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #41  
Old 05.02.2015, 15:10
Today only's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Europe
Posts: 4,855
Groaned at 582 Times in 380 Posts
Thanked 5,630 Times in 2,697 Posts
Today only has a reputation beyond reputeToday only has a reputation beyond reputeToday only has a reputation beyond reputeToday only has a reputation beyond reputeToday only has a reputation beyond reputeToday only has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World?

Is this the modern definition of a threesome ?
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 05.02.2015, 15:18
pilatus1's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: directly above center of earth
Posts: 1,089
Groaned at 119 Times in 77 Posts
Thanked 2,776 Times in 1,092 Posts
pilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World?

Quote:
View Post
Some mutations are positive and useful to the advancement of mankind.
Who gets to decide? How can we expect to forsee the future of our evolution? I argue that all mutations are in the end positive and useful to the advancement of mankind.

Quote:
View Post
In what way is a reduced IQ and reliance on others for many tasks an advancement for both the individual or mankind?
I don't believe that the life of someone with Down's syndrome is worth less than that of a 'normal' person. Everyone is different and unique in their own way, and each contributes to society in their own way.
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 05.02.2015, 15:41
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Zurich Unterland
Posts: 3,318
Groaned at 145 Times in 99 Posts
Thanked 4,850 Times in 1,930 Posts
smoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World?

Quote:
View Post
Actually, the thing that people with a handicapped child do mention more than anything else is that basically the child's siblings have to take second place with everything as the child in question can take over their lives and all their time.

The fact that the child isn't going to win a violin competition is really neither here nor there.
Maybe other types of handicaps, but not Down Syndrome children. They are perfectly natural people, with a child-like nature. More helpful than most children. And of course, they look different, all having pretty much the same sort of features, so are distinctive. And too trusting to survive alone in the world as it is now. Sad that they have no value as a human.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank smoky for this useful post:
This user groans at smoky for this post:
  #44  
Old 05.02.2015, 15:47
Tom1234's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Kanton Luzern
Posts: 10,714
Groaned at 280 Times in 223 Posts
Thanked 15,055 Times in 6,118 Posts
Tom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond repute
Quote:
View Post
Who gets to decide? How can we expect to forsee the future of our evolution? I argue that all mutations are in the end positive and useful to the advancement of mankind.
.
I disagree. Isn't this the point of evolution? (with a few hiccups along the way).

Quote:
View Post

I don't believe that the life of someone with Down's syndrome is worth less than that of a 'normal' person. Everyone is different and unique in their own way, and each contributes to society in their own way.
I never said it was. You may be pro-life or whatever but personally I think the laws that allow prospective parents choice are fine as they are.

Quote:
View Post
Maybe other types of handicaps, but not Down Syndrome children. They are perfectly natural people, with a child-like nature. More helpful than most children. And of course, they look different, all having pretty much the same sort of features, so are distinctive. And too trusting to survive alone in the world as it is now. Sad that they have no value as a human.
You know I'm not referring to Down's Syndrome here so don't you dare pretend that I am in your own twisted way.

Last edited by 3Wishes; 05.02.2015 at 16:41. Reason: merging successive posts
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 05.02.2015, 15:53
pilatus1's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: directly above center of earth
Posts: 1,089
Groaned at 119 Times in 77 Posts
Thanked 2,776 Times in 1,092 Posts
pilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World?

Quote:
View Post
I disagree. Isn't this the point of evolution? (with a few hiccups along the way).



I never said it was. You may be pro-life or whatever but personally I think the laws that allow prospective parents choice are fine as they are.
Mutations need countless generations to be played out, in any species. How can we expect to forsee the future of a certain species with a certain mutation, in an ever-changing environment?


I'm fine with the laws also, but I prefer not to put any pro-this or pro-that label on myself.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank pilatus1 for this useful post:
  #46  
Old 05.02.2015, 15:57
Phil_MCR's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Basel
Posts: 11,905
Groaned at 255 Times in 166 Posts
Thanked 14,059 Times in 5,954 Posts
Phil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World? [3-parent babies]

If mutations are weeded out by our own hand, then by definition, they are not useful adaptations to the current environment.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Phil_MCR for this useful post:
  #47  
Old 05.02.2015, 16:01
Phos's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: ZRH
Posts: 7,245
Groaned at 494 Times in 376 Posts
Thanked 9,815 Times in 5,202 Posts
Phos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World?

People like to think they are smarter than they should, yet are so prone to tragedies because of it.

Its stupid to make value judgements for the future based on current values of today when one does not even know what values the future demands. For example, lets filter out all babies unlikely to grow over 6" foot tall, because tall people tend to earn higher salaries. Then in the future, survival depends on riding spaceships that can only accommodate people under 5" tall. Tall people consume more resources.

Arrogance meeting tragedy can also be a comedy.

Last edited by Phos; 05.02.2015 at 17:38.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Phos for this useful post:
  #48  
Old 05.02.2015, 16:28
Phil_MCR's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Basel
Posts: 11,905
Groaned at 255 Times in 166 Posts
Thanked 14,059 Times in 5,954 Posts
Phil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World?

Quote:
View Post
People like to think they are smarter than they should, yet are so prone to tragedies because of it.

Its stupid to make value judgements for the future based on current values of today when one those not even know what values the future demands. For example, lets filter out all babies unlikely to grow over 6" foot tall, because tall people tend to earn higher salaries. Then in the future, survival depends on riding spaceships that can only accommodate people under 5" tall. Tall people consume more resources.

Arrogance meeting tragedy can also be a comedy.
sure, or maybe something else happens which means that we need more 6" tall people. who knows?
Reply With Quote
  #49  
Old 05.02.2015, 16:43
Chemmie's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Zurich
Posts: 3,798
Groaned at 28 Times in 24 Posts
Thanked 4,424 Times in 2,010 Posts
Chemmie has a reputation beyond reputeChemmie has a reputation beyond reputeChemmie has a reputation beyond reputeChemmie has a reputation beyond reputeChemmie has a reputation beyond reputeChemmie has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World? [3-parent babies]

The concept of not following through on scientific research strictly on the premise of speculation by some that "something might go wrong" is absolutely ridiculous!

Yes there are risks, and yes things will go wrong and we will learn from trial and error, but halting all attempts at furthering our understanding of the natural world we are apart of, just because of hunches of doomsday is pretty ignorant.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank Chemmie for this useful post:
  #50  
Old 05.02.2015, 16:50
amogles's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Zurich
Posts: 8,704
Groaned at 155 Times in 134 Posts
Thanked 15,825 Times in 6,712 Posts
amogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World? [3-parent babies]

Quote:
View Post
The concept of not following through on scientific research strictly on the premise of speculation by some that "something might go wrong" is absolutely ridiculous!

Yes there are risks, and yes things will go wrong and we will learn from trial and error, but halting all attempts at furthering our understanding of the natural world we are apart of, just because of hunches of doomsday is pretty ignorant.
I think there are big differences between not doing theoretical research for fuzzy reasons, and opposing the commercialization of the results of that research.

Research is motivated by the will to understand things, not the will to re-order things. The will to re-order and change things is not scientific curiosity but myopic fools on a power trip using science as a fig leaf.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank amogles for this useful post:
  #51  
Old 05.02.2015, 17:12
Phos's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: ZRH
Posts: 7,245
Groaned at 494 Times in 376 Posts
Thanked 9,815 Times in 5,202 Posts
Phos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World? [3-parent babies]

v
Quote:
View Post
The concept of not following through on scientific research strictly on the premise of speculation by some that "something might go wrong" is absolutely ridiculous!

Yes there are risks, and yes things will go wrong and we will learn from trial and error, but halting all attempts at furthering our understanding of the natural world we are apart of, just because of hunches of doomsday is pretty ignorant.
Research and gathering knowledge are all good. But manipulating the course of nature based on a partial understanding of what it impacts, or because someone deemed a "scientist" seems to think it is okay, is kind of risky, don't you think? If the risk is unavoidable, fine, you make a judgement call. But what if it isn't really necessary?


Quote:
View Post
Research is motivated by the will to understand things, not the will to re-order things.
Here, I was thinking Purchase Order when I read that.
Reply With Quote
  #52  
Old 05.02.2015, 17:40
Tom1234's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Kanton Luzern
Posts: 10,714
Groaned at 280 Times in 223 Posts
Thanked 15,055 Times in 6,118 Posts
Tom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World? [3-parent babies]

Quote:
View Post

Research and gathering knowledge are all good. But manipulating the course of nature based on a partial understanding of what it impacts, or because someone deemed a "scientist" seems to think it is okay, is kind of risky, don't you think? If the risk is unavoidable, fine, you make a judgement call. But what if it isn't really necessary?
Do you mean like building a sea wall to stop coastal erosion and stuff like that?

But on topic - scientists discover things. The law makers decide whether these things get put into action.
Reply With Quote
  #53  
Old 05.02.2015, 17:46
Dougal's Breakfast's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: GL
Posts: 15,999
Groaned at 1,017 Times in 784 Posts
Thanked 41,331 Times in 12,886 Posts
Dougal's Breakfast has a reputation beyond reputeDougal's Breakfast has a reputation beyond reputeDougal's Breakfast has a reputation beyond reputeDougal's Breakfast has a reputation beyond reputeDougal's Breakfast has a reputation beyond reputeDougal's Breakfast has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World? [3-parent babies]

Well I'm rather glad that people had the arrogance to tamper with the natural course of things, because I'm not an enormous fan of running after mountain goats and eating them raw.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Dougal's Breakfast for this useful post:
  #54  
Old 05.02.2015, 17:50
Phil_MCR's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Basel
Posts: 11,905
Groaned at 255 Times in 166 Posts
Thanked 14,059 Times in 5,954 Posts
Phil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World? [3-parent babies]

Quote:
View Post
v

Research and gathering knowledge are all good. But manipulating the course of nature based on a partial understanding of what it impacts, or because someone deemed a "scientist" seems to think it is okay, is kind of risky, don't you think? If the risk is unavoidable, fine, you make a judgement call. But what if it isn't really necessary?
well if the risk is lower than not doing it...
Reply With Quote
  #55  
Old 05.02.2015, 17:58
Phos's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: ZRH
Posts: 7,245
Groaned at 494 Times in 376 Posts
Thanked 9,815 Times in 5,202 Posts
Phos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World? [3-parent babies]

Quote:
View Post
Do you mean like building a sea wall to stop coastal erosion and stuff like that?

But on topic - scientists discover things. The law makers decide whether these things get put into action.
That is more like engineering, isn't it? Scientists discover the mechanics of phenomenon. Inventors, technologists and engineers apply it. I'm not so sure the discoverers are necessarily the best people to judge when and how to apply it.

I was thinking of Aspergers. To some people, in social contexts, it could be seen as a debilitation. But often, they are geniuses. I heard of one we used for quickly finding systemic defects. He was hands down better at it than anybody. Some even think we need more people with Aspergers. Couldn't trying to eliminate Aspergers from the gene pool cause us to lose out on a much needed talent?
Reply With Quote
  #56  
Old 05.02.2015, 18:03
Phil_MCR's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Basel
Posts: 11,905
Groaned at 255 Times in 166 Posts
Thanked 14,059 Times in 5,954 Posts
Phil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World? [3-parent babies]

Quote:
View Post
That is more like engineering, isn't it? Scientists discover the mechanics of phenomenon. Inventors, technologists and engineers apply it. I'm not so sure the discoverers are necessarily the best people to judge when and how to apply it.

I was thinking of Aspergers. To some people, in social contexts, it could be seen as a debilitation. But often, they are geniuses. I heard of one we used for quickly finding systemic defects. He was hands down better at it than anybody. Some even think we need more people with Aspergers. Couldn't trying to eliminate Aspergers from the gene pool cause us to lose out on a much needed talent?
what if there were no people with aspergers and we used genetic engineering to create them?
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Phil_MCR for this useful post:
  #57  
Old 05.02.2015, 18:06
Phos's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: ZRH
Posts: 7,245
Groaned at 494 Times in 376 Posts
Thanked 9,815 Times in 5,202 Posts
Phos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond reputePhos has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World? [3-parent babies]

Quote:
View Post
what if there were no people with aspergers and we used genetic engineering to create them?
That sounds cruel, but what if they use it to dominate and enslave humanity, or use us for protein?
Reply With Quote
  #58  
Old 05.02.2015, 18:11
pilatus1's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: directly above center of earth
Posts: 1,089
Groaned at 119 Times in 77 Posts
Thanked 2,776 Times in 1,092 Posts
pilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World? [3-parent babies]

Quote:
View Post
That sounds cruel, but what if they use it to dominate and enslave humanity, or use us for protein?
It's people. Soylent green is people.... now take some soma and get over it.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank pilatus1 for this useful post:
  #59  
Old 05.02.2015, 18:12
Tom1234's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Kanton Luzern
Posts: 10,714
Groaned at 280 Times in 223 Posts
Thanked 15,055 Times in 6,118 Posts
Tom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World? [3-parent babies]

Quote:
View Post
That sounds cruel, but what if they use it to dominate and enslave humanity, or use us for protein?
You don't need genetic engineering to dominate and enslave people.

We seem quite capable of doing that without science.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Tom1234 for this useful post:
  #60  
Old 23.04.2015, 21:13
pilatus1's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: directly above center of earth
Posts: 1,089
Groaned at 119 Times in 77 Posts
Thanked 2,776 Times in 1,092 Posts
pilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Brave New World? [3-parent babies]

and so it continues...

engineering the perfect baby
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Tesco's Brave New World! ratbag General off-topic 1 27.09.2014 14:13
New Babies passport OZ banadol Permits/visas/government 8 30.06.2014 09:57
Mum-To-Be and New Parent Morning (Dads & Babies welcome too!) Ginag Commercial events 0 06.03.2014 12:07
New English Speaking Parent & Todder Group, Zurich Shona Family matters/health 3 06.12.2012 13:37
World's first GM babies born Puhutes International affairs/politics 26 11.10.2012 18:16


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 15:51.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0