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  #61  
Old 10.08.2017, 10:07
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Re: Barcelona protests against tourists

four times more before tax, I take it.
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  #62  
Old 10.08.2017, 10:23
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Re: Barcelona protests against tourists

Joan Antoni Hermo says he is fed up of mass tourism and the bad behaviour that often accompanies it. “Fridays, Saturdays and Sundays are awful, with incidents of noise and public urination.”

Yes, these are the famous weekend city breaks. Guess people don't plan to see Sagrada Familia..


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People and capitalism then...
...this might interest you-> http://www.euronews.com/2017/08/08/b...tourism-battle

Renting an apartment to tourists visiting Barcelona can be lucrative. Jordi Mallafré, a property owner who advertises his flat on platforms like Airbnb says he can earn four times more from visitors than he would from a long-term tenant.
Probably even more and he pays taxes for only a part of this amount....I mean I wouldn't put fiscal evasion past property owners.

Last edited by greenmount; 10.08.2017 at 10:37.
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  #63  
Old 10.08.2017, 11:37
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Re: Barcelona protests against tourists

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I mean I wouldn't put fiscal evasion past property owners.
Yes, you could be on to something there
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  #64  
Old 10.08.2017, 12:00
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Re: Barcelona protests against tourists

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Got young friends from Berlin arriving soon. They are spending 7 weeks touring Europe with the kids, staying with friends and family all over - whilst they are renting their flat in Prenzlauerberg to holiday makers - very lucrative and positive for them.
Yeah, I wonder why we not all just make seven week holidays instead of annoying the Spanish by spending short trips to their cities....?
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  #65  
Old 10.08.2017, 12:10
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Re: Barcelona protests against tourists

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Yes, you could be on to something there
From the buzz I've been picking up on the Spanish forum I'm also on, the government is doing a massive clampdown on illegal holiday rentals. Basically the government is saying all properties used for commercial rentals must be inspected and receive a certificate of suitability. Landlords continuing to rent out without that certificate (once a certain grace period has expired) are acting illegally. This should help weed out some of the very nasty stuff at the bottom of the market that is giving Spain a bad name. Also owners will be required to provide data on occupancy. I guess this will help clamp down on tax evasion.

A lot of people are furious about the clampdown and are screaming murder. I guess too many have had it too easy for too long.
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  #66  
Old 10.08.2017, 12:42
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Re: Barcelona protests against tourists

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From the buzz I've been picking up on the Spanish forum I'm also on, the government is doing a massive clampdown on illegal holiday rentals. Basically the government is saying all properties used for commercial rentals must be inspected and receive a certificate of suitability. Landlords continuing to rent out without that certificate (once a certain grace period has expired) are acting illegally. This should help weed out some of the very nasty stuff at the bottom of the market that is giving Spain a bad name. Also owners will be required to provide data on occupancy. I guess this will help clamp down on tax evasion.

A lot of people are furious about the clampdown and are screaming murder. I guess too many have had it too easy for too long.
It's not just the very bottom of the market. The wife went with a bunch of girls to Barcelona for some hens night and they rented a pretty nice villa together over AirBNB. I just cannot imagine the landlord to pay proper taxes on that income... which wasn't peanuts.

I am all for the "sharing economy", but there is just some wild growth of illegal businesses going on that stay under the radar as they are small enough to not matter that much individually. Combined they do have an impact on an economy, let alone the rental market of pretty much any larger city in Europe right now. A lot of the best rental areas are not just expensive anymore - they are sucked completely dry. Nothing available not matter the costs. Because running a hotel without paying taxes will beat any rent.

Last edited by Treverus; 10.08.2017 at 14:21.
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  #67  
Old 10.08.2017, 14:14
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Re: Barcelona protests against tourists

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Tourism is bad for the planet whether it's educated old duffers with guidebooks or drunken louts on a stag weekend. It's a shame that all the "travellers" on EF can't see that.
No good ranting. Aren't we all, in a very real sense, merely tourists? We shall all return whence we came: Denn alles fleisch es ist wie gras.
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  #68  
Old 10.08.2017, 15:22
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Re: Barcelona protests against tourists

Join the Brits and call it #SpanExit!

and then build a wall



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  #69  
Old 10.08.2017, 15:33
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Re: Barcelona protests against tourists

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Because running a hotel without paying taxes will beat any rent.
This leads into something that concerns me about AirBnB in general. Many countries, particularly Italy that I know of, require you to be registered with the police within 3 days of arrival. This is carried out as part of the check-in process when you arrive at a hotel.

Spain is a little more relaxed in that, hotels have a legal duty to register their guests' passport details, but I don't know if the information transmitted in the same way as in Italy. If a landlord has multiple properties advertised via AirBnB, doesn't he also have the same legal duty to register guests's passport details, or advise them to register with the police in the case of Italy? I'd love to know where the tipping point is in the onus of responsibility.
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  #70  
Old 10.08.2017, 15:59
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Re: Barcelona protests against tourists

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This leads into something that concerns me about AirBnB in general. Many countries, particularly Italy that I know of, require you to be registered with the police within 3 days of arrival. This is carried out as part of the check-in process when you arrive at a hotel.

Spain is a little more relaxed in that, hotels have a legal duty to register their guests' passport details, but I don't know if the information transmitted in the same way as in Italy. If a landlord has multiple properties advertised via AirBnB, doesn't he also have the same legal duty to register guests's passport details, or advise them to register with the police in the case of Italy? I'd love to know where the tipping point is in the onus of responsibility.
Make an educated guess: If you are planning to not declare the income you are making to the tax authority, would you inform the police of all places about your guests?
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  #71  
Old 10.08.2017, 16:03
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Re: Barcelona protests against tourists

Exactly! It's just another legal avenue to use to screw these errant 'landlords'.
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  #72  
Old 10.08.2017, 16:08
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Re: Barcelona protests against tourists

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This leads into something that concerns me about AirBnB in general. Many countries, particularly Italy that I know of, require you to be registered with the police within 3 days of arrival. This is carried out as part of the check-in process when you arrive at a hotel.

Spain is a little more relaxed in that, hotels have a legal duty to register their guests' passport details, but I don't know if the information transmitted in the same way as in Italy. If a landlord has multiple properties advertised via AirBnB, doesn't he also have the same legal duty to register guests's passport details, or advise them to register with the police in the case of Italy? I'd love to know where the tipping point is in the onus of responsibility.
And this is not just a registration but in most resorts and touristy places anywhere in the world, a small tourist tax is levied that gets used, for example, to keep the beach clean or maintain tourist amenities that otherwise don't generate direct income. This charge should be itemized separately on your hotel bill.

Maybe the onus should be with companies such as AirB&B to collect these charges and pay them to the relevant authorities on the landlord's behalf.

Unless of course encouraging people to cheat on taxes is part of your busness model.
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  #73  
Old 10.08.2017, 16:19
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Re: Barcelona protests against tourists

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Many countries, particularly Italy that I know of, require you to be registered with the police within 3 days of arrival.
But not if you stay with friends, or own an apartment or house.

Tom
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  #74  
Old 10.08.2017, 16:25
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Re: Barcelona protests against tourists

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Maybe the onus should be with companies such as AirB&B to collect these charges and pay them to the relevant authorities on the landlord's behalf.

Unless of course encouraging people to cheat on taxes is part of your busness model.
As far as I know, Airbnb is rather dedicated to protect the owners' interests in the sense that all the potential damages made by various clients are covered by them.

I personally think it should be the owner's responsibility or the tax authorities should find a way to make tax evasion pretty difficult.
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  #75  
Old 11.08.2017, 14:57
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Re: Barcelona protests against tourists

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This leads into something that concerns me about AirBnB in general. Many countries, particularly Italy that I know of, require you to be registered with the police within 3 days of arrival. This is carried out as part of the check-in process when you arrive at a hotel.
.
It is hard to imagine that the authorities don't have access to their data...
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  #76  
Old 11.08.2017, 15:02
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Re: Barcelona protests against tourists

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It is hard to imagine that the authorities don't have access to their data...
The US tax authorities will... but the municipal authorities of Barcelona to charge tourist tax? I cannot imagine that... AirBnB would be busy working with thousands of cities and create reports for them... in countries the average American start-up could not find on a map, let alone speak the local language... do you really think so?
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  #77  
Old 14.08.2017, 11:25
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Re: Barcelona protests against tourists

There already is a tax for hotel stays in Barcelona. Logically, this tax should be paid by AirBNB also.
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