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Old 20.09.2018, 19:47
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Law regarding walking on grass fields

Today I was walking on a grass field with my kids and the owner turned up and told me I wasn’t alllowed to. I told her that I thought Swiss Civil law said that all people should have reasonable access to pastures and meadows, but she said that access is restricted between April and November.

So I was wondering if there are any legal buffs here that could confirm this. I would really appreciate a link to some info on this. I find that when dealing with the Privat Polizei that knowledge is power, and printed knowledge is like a nuke

In case this is a Kantonal issue, this was in Kanton Argau.

Before I moved on, I asked if I could come back in November and she looked annoyed and told me it didn’t matter to her, so a positive end to the encounter
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Old 20.09.2018, 19:55
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

according to Civil Code (Art. 699 ZGB) ...

"Entering the forest and pasture and the acquisition of wild berries, mushrooms u. Likewise, to the extent customary in the local area, everyone is permitted unless the competent authority decrees that certain clearly defined prohibitions will be imposed. "
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Old 20.09.2018, 19:55
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

If it is a private field, then no you cannot just walk across when you fancy, the landowner has every right to tell you to clear off
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Old 20.09.2018, 20:33
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

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If it is a private field, then no you cannot just walk across when you fancy, the landowner has every right to tell you to clear off
I was looking for facts rather than opinions. As omstat posted, and also the field owner herself acknowledged (other than the time limit), Swiss civil law says that certain types of land are accessible by everyone within a reasonable extent.

However if you know something factual in relation to my question I would like to hear it.
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Old 20.09.2018, 20:47
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

Private lands are private, the exception being if there is a right of way, which will be a PATH, not general access!

Public lands are not always open to the public if a farmer is working them, thus the April-November thing.

Tom
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Old 20.09.2018, 21:00
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

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Today I was walking on a grass field with my kids and the owner turned up and told me I wasn’t alllowed to.
Irrespective of the law, grass is cut and fed to animals as silage or hay in winter.

(Is that factual enough for you?)

You're effectively trampling her animals' winter food supply. No wonder she was annoyed.
I would be too.
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Old 20.09.2018, 21:00
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

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Private lands are private, the exception being if there is a right of way, which will be a PATH, not general access!
And also with the exception of forests and pastures. Pastures are areas of grass, sometimes with some fruit trees on them. This is an important exception as it is explicitly stated in the Civil code. Please read Omstats post above.

No offence intended, but I'm not interested in debating the Swiss civil code with you. It's been around for a very long time and is quite clear. However it doesn't mention a time limited period. So this time limited period may be something for the Kanton of Argau. If you have some knowledge of Argau Kantonal law then I would be keen to learn more.

Last edited by DanLF; 20.09.2018 at 21:14.
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Old 20.09.2018, 21:05
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

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Irrespective of the law, grass is cut and fed to animals as silage or hay in winter.

(Is that factual enough for you?)

You're effectively trampling her animals' winter food supply. No wonder she was annoyed.
I would be too.
Lots of people with an opinion, which is great. I will need to wait patiently for some evidence based facts.

But thank you for your input nevertheless.

edit: Grass was short. Swiss civil code has allowed access for a very long time and I haven't heard of any cows starving in Switzerland. So I hope this will ease your concern.
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Old 20.09.2018, 21:20
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

Clearly, we need to adopt the US attitude of shoot first, ask questions later.

Tom
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Old 20.09.2018, 21:29
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

I would dress up as a sheep. Nobody expects sheet to know the law.
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Old 20.09.2018, 21:35
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

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Clearly, we need to adopt the US attitude of shoot first, ask questions later.

Tom
I'm going to stop feeding your trolling Tom. I've given far more amusement than you deserve.

I'll monitor the thread in case someone can answer my question, but otherwise I've had my fill of this "friendly" forum for now.
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Old 20.09.2018, 21:38
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

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I'm going to stop feeding your trolling Tom.
Alas, I'm not the one doing the trolling.

Tom
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Old 20.09.2018, 21:47
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

Stick to the Wanderweg. Then there is no argument.
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Old 20.09.2018, 21:52
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

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and I haven't heard of any cows starving in Switzerland.
Actually:

https://www.tagblatt.ch/ostschweiz/n...uhe-ld.1041807
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Old 20.09.2018, 21:55
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

Nobody's trolling you Dan, but the entitled attitude will irritate some people,, so you should be prepared for the sorts of replies you've got so far.

Seeking to establish a legal right to tramp across a farmer's property seems somewhat... unreasonable, at best, so it's hardly surprising some people aren't finding you endearing.
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Old 20.09.2018, 22:32
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

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Nobody's trolling you Dan, but the entitled attitude will irritate some people,, so you should be prepared for the sorts of replies you've got so far.

Seeking to establish a legal right to tramp across a farmer's property seems somewhat... unreasonable, at best, so it's hardly surprising some people aren't finding you endearing.
As you are a moderator I will reply, but otherwise I'm not getting involved in this any further.

The statement of "Clearly, we need to adopt the US attitude of shoot first, ask questions later. " is in my opinion trolling. I'm asking a question about walking across some grass with my 2 young daughters. This kind of response is entirely unreasonable.

My entitled attitude comes from an actual entitlement. It seems, nowadays, that lots of people treat the word "entitlement" as some sort of bad word you can accuse some one of. It's often forgotten that there are actual entitlements and that these are good things, not bad things.

The Swiss civil code is a list of such entitlements that we are all afforded as residents of this country:

https://www.admin.ch/opc/en/classifi...042/index.html

I'm sorry that I sound like I'm the bad version of "entitled", but by matter of fact I am entitled to what is stated in the Swiss civil code. There may be regional exceptions to these entitlements and that is what I seek to understand, hence this thread.

I've posted this thread on this forum to ask this question in good faith. I'd appreciate some good faith in return from those posting replies. (Thanks Omstat ).
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Old 20.09.2018, 23:07
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

I suggest this be tested empirically by having the OP repeatedly walking on the fields until the land owner gets the police involved. Then they can hopefully quote the relevant law and this can be tested in court to firmly settle the matter.
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Old 20.09.2018, 23:08
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

Have you actually looked up this law that you seem so sure about.'

It took me less than 10 minutes to find.

it says clearly EN SAISON MORTE which I imagine is December to March.

Art. 157 Passage du public
1 Tout piéton a le droit d'utiliser les chemins frayés dans les terres et forêts privées non clôturées, si aucune interdiction n'est affichée par un ayant droit. Le droit fédéral touchant à l'accès aux forêts est, au surplus, réservé.
2 Chacun peut traverser, en saison morte, à pied, et conformément à l'usage des lieux, les champs non labourés et les prés en friche, à condition qu'il n'en résulte aucun dommage pour les cultures.
3 Le même droit est accordé pour le passage à ski, à luge ou traîneau, à condition que la neige soit suffisante et que les clôtures ne dépassent pas le niveau de celle-ci.



Art. 157 Passage of the public
1 Any pedestrian has the right to use the paths pawned in the lands and private forests not fenced, if no prohibition is displayed by a rightful person. Federal law on forest access is, moreover, reserved.
2 In the off season, each person may cross, on foot, and in accordance with the use of the site, unplowed fields and uncultivated meadows, provided that no damage is caused to the crops.
3 The same right is granted for skiing, sledging or sledding, provided that the snow is sufficient and that the fences do not exceed the level of the latter.


EDIT: sorry. my obsession with reading the internet on my phone has caused me to make a mistake. the text quoted is for Valais. NOT federal. Damn cantons!!
It is from the Loi d'application du code civil suisse on the LexFind.ch website. A very useful site. if difficult to navigate on the phone.
http://www.lexfind.ch/dtah/42823/3/211.1.pdf
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Last edited by miniMia; 21.09.2018 at 12:38.
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Old 20.09.2018, 23:44
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

EF at their worst.

So sad
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Old 20.09.2018, 23:55
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Re: Law regarding walking on grass fields

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If it is a private field, then no you cannot just walk across when you fancy, the landowner has every right to tell you to clear off
That.




Is.Entirely.Wrong.
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