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  #21  
Old 09.11.2018, 11:39
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

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This baseless comment is hard evidence that you are a guy with a petty character, and I would be embarrassed to have written it.
Nope, it's not a baseless comment, it's based on the photos you have on your flickr account which are both technically and conceptually flawed. Of course, everyone has the right to produce boring photos, it's just a bit funny when I read the self-confidence and arrogance you exhibit and then look at the photos you post.
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  #22  
Old 09.11.2018, 11:42
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

Today the large sensor cameras only raison d'Ítre is dark venues (church etc) or indoor sports (not so bright, and need to freeze motion).
However, to take benefit of a large sensor one needs a matching fast (bright, large aperture) lens.
E.g. an apc-c / dx camera with a f/2.8 is same as a full frame with a f/4 lens.

To use that one-stop advantage of a full frame camera one needs a super heavy f/2.8 zoom. A full frame DSLR camera is about 750g plus a 24-70 f/2.8 zoom is about 1000g, that makes about 1.75kg.

A aps-c/dx DSLR camera weight is about 650g and a dx standard f/2.8 zoom is about 650g, so about 1.3kg for a one stop slower system.

And then aps-c/dx mirrorless, where the top of the line weight about 400-550g. The problem is however that only Fuji has a fx f/2.8 standard zoom weighting about 650g, while sony doesn't have any DX f/2.8 standard zoom, but only a f/4 one. One can use a heavy full-frame f/2.8 std zoom with an adapter, but that missed the point.

Unfortunately for sony, they also don't have much of a choice of good fast sharp prime lenses (and reasonably priced) dedicated to DX.

If one gets a aps-c with a f/4 zoom then one could as well get a Micro four thirds with an f/2.8 zoom, and a bit of weight on a camera and a lens.

And again one ends with one f-stop above rx100v because the micro four-thirds sensor surface is about twice of the rx100v.
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  #23  
Old 09.11.2018, 11:51
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

What about an iPhone ?
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  #24  
Old 09.11.2018, 11:51
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

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The problem is however that only Fuji has a fx f/2.8 standard zoom weighting about 650g, while sony doesn't have any DX f/2.8 standard zoom, but only a f/4 one. One can use a heavy full-frame f/2.8 std zoom with an adapter, but that missed the point.
The 16-55mm f/2.8 is optically a great lens, but it somehow goes against everything that a Fuji X camera is I rented it for a weekend and then returned it, didn't feel right on the X-T2.
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Old 09.11.2018, 12:07
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

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Nope, it's not a baseless comment, it's based on the photos you have on your flickr account which are both technically and conceptually flawed. Of course, everyone has the right to produce boring photos, it's just a bit funny when I read the self-confidence and arrogance you exhibit and then look at the photos you post.
The vast majority of photos on my Flickr account are literally years old, I don't regularly use or update it and for you to say they are 'technically and conceptually flawed', considering the majority are street or candid photography, is highly amusing and shows you are full of hot air and really, really don't know what you are talking about. And as I said, the fact you even make such a comment shows beyond doubt that you are one petty and classless guy. Link me to your Flickr account and put your money where your mouth is, or stfu and stop being an asshole.

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Today the large sensor cameras only raison d'Ítre is dark venues (church etc) or indoor sports (not so bright, and need to freeze motion).
However, to take benefit of a large sensor one needs a matching fast (bright, large aperture) lens.
E.g. an apc-c / dx camera with a f/2.8 is same as a full frame with a f/4 lens.

To use that one-stop advantage of a full frame camera one needs a super heavy f/2.8 zoom. A full frame DSLR camera is about 750g plus a 24-70 f/2.8 zoom is about 1000g, that makes about 1.75kg.

A aps-c/dx DSLR camera weight is about 650g and a dx standard f/2.8 zoom is about 650g, so about 1.3kg for a one stop slower system.

And then aps-c/dx mirrorless, where the top of the line weight about 400-550g. The problem is however that only Fuji has a fx f/2.8 standard zoom weighting about 650g, while sony doesn't have any DX f/2.8 standard zoom, but only a f/4 one. One can use a heavy full-frame f/2.8 std zoom with an adapter, but that missed the point.

Unfortunately for sony, they also don't have much of a choice of good fast sharp prime lenses (and reasonably priced) dedicated to DX.

If one gets a aps-c with a f/4 zoom then one could as well get a Micro four thirds with an f/2.8 zoom, and a bit of weight on a camera and a lens.

And again one ends with one f-stop above rx100v because the micro four-thirds sensor surface is about twice of the rx100v.
A Tamron 28-75mm f2.8 weighs 550g and is almost as good as the premium 24-70mm f2.8 lenses that are double the price and weight. In combination with a Sony A7III it is only 1.1KG. There are also some very good and lightweight full frame prime lenses.

But yeah, most people do not need full frame... though if you can afford it I would say it does provide the best image quality and the low light capability is almost always useful at some point, especially for candid and family photography.

Last edited by Richdog; 09.11.2018 at 12:34.
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  #26  
Old 09.11.2018, 12:14
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

Handbags at dawn darlings ?
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  #27  
Old 09.11.2018, 16:54
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

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ANY modern point-and-shoot camera today will produce decent pictures, technically they're all very capable devices. It's you that will make the difference and the fanboys will steer you in one direction or the other, but the fact is: the camera brand won't matter nearly as much as you. My only advice would be avoid Leica, no need to pay the brand premium. Can't go wrong with Sony (and I'm a Fuji user)
Took a Leica over the equivalent Lumix as being made in Japan rather than China the warranty was 5 years and not 1. Also came with a copy of Lightroom. The LX100 has a reputation for collecting dust inside the optics which is a warranty repair. The Leica not so much.
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  #28  
Old 09.11.2018, 17:03
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

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ANY modern point-and-shoot camera today will produce decent pictures, technically they're all very capable devices. It's you that will make the difference and the fanboys will steer you in one direction or the other, but the fact is: the camera brand won't matter nearly as much as you.
I actually agree with you. Not sure why anyone would be in disagreement - I thought that was common knowledge.

Let's have links to photos taken by all the people giving advice in this thread - of course with the cameras they are using stated.
I'm sure the OP would prefer advice from people who are competent enough to give that advice.
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  #29  
Old 09.11.2018, 18:35
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

The Sony Alpha 6300 is worth the extra over the 6000 at normal prices. It has a higher resolution viewfinder and a lot more focussing points. The 6000 could well be heavily discounted soon in Black Friday deals however...
The kit lens for both doesn't have a great reputation.

I'd be looking at the 16-70 F4 or 18-135 F4...
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  #30  
Old 09.11.2018, 20:55
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

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A Tamron 28-75mm f2.8 weighs 550g and is almost as good as the premium 24-70mm f2.8 lenses that are double the price and weight. In combination with a Sony A7III it is only 1.1KG. There are also some very good and lightweight full frame prime lenses.
In times of mirrorless I agree because the AF is done in a closed loop where the actual image sensor is used. But for a dslr - I tried twice - a tamron and a sigma (an expensive, "art", 35mm prime lens) and they focused ok with the center AF sensor but could not focus correctly with side AF sensors. Maybe using some USB cable and software one could calibrate them but that was too much of a headache; I bought a used brand lens instead.

BTW: older mirrorless had terribly slow autofocus - Sony nex5, Fujifilm x-e1; x-e2 was slightly better in good light but still could hunt a lot.

I recommend testing the camera in actual action before buying as probably for todays cameras it would be the biggest difference, as otherwise their image quality is very similar for a typical user.

Last edited by yacek; 09.11.2018 at 21:51.
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  #31  
Old 09.11.2018, 22:36
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

I agree with everyone who's saying Sony. We'd had a huge SLR camera for years, but I had less and less patience for it the more kids we had (we now have three). Two years ago we switched to a compact Sony (I can't remember exactly which one) and I was thrilled with it. Sadly it was stolen in the spring, so we now have a Sony Alpha a6000 and I'm still really happy with the simplicity and picture quality.
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  #32  
Old 13.11.2018, 20:23
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

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I agree with everyone who's saying Sony. We'd had a huge SLR camera for years, but I had less and less patience for it the more kids we had (we now have three). Two years ago we switched to a compact Sony (I can't remember exactly which one) and I was thrilled with it. Sadly it was stolen in the spring, so we now have a Sony Alpha a6000 and I'm still really happy with the simplicity and picture quality.
There is yet another all-in-one premium compact contender - Panasonic LX100II which has a sensor size close to micro four thirds (m43) and a fixed standard zoom with aperture f1.7-f2.8, and thus is about one f stop more sensitive than Sony RX100IV and V, and is similar, sensitivity-wise, to a DX camera with an f4 standard zoom. And this little compact camera lens (and of Sony RX100 as well) are very decent, i.e. one needs a premium zoom or prime lens to noticeably outperform it; forget the so called kit lenses sold with most cameras - they're slow (little light getting to the sensor)but also aren't as sharp. Except for Fuji, which "kit" zoom lens, 18-55mm f/2.8-4 is very sharp compared with typical kit lenses and one f/stop faster.
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  #33  
Old 13.11.2018, 20:39
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

Thanks all for your helpful input.

Camera is ordered and ready to be picked up.
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  #34  
Old 14.11.2018, 07:26
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

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Thanks all for your helpful input.

Camera is ordered and ready to be picked up.
Is there really any need not to say which camera you bought? Seems a bit bizarre after people gave you advice.
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Old 14.11.2018, 09:43
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

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Is there really any need not to say which camera you bought? Seems a bit bizarre after people gave you advice.



Unfortunately it sounds eminently sensible not to mention which one he bought as it would only result in getting slagged off here by one of you as to what a useless choice it was
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  #36  
Old 14.11.2018, 09:56
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

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Unfortunately it sounds eminently sensible not to mention which one he bought as it would only result in getting slagged off here by one of you as to what a useless choice it was

I don't agree. He made a good choice but just paid too much for the camera
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  #37  
Old 14.11.2018, 10:32
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

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I don't agree. He made a good choice but just paid too much for the camera
No, he didn't pay too much for the camera, but he got the wrong lens.
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  #38  
Old 14.11.2018, 10:39
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

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Unfortunately it sounds eminently sensible not to mention which one he bought as it would only result in getting slagged off here by one of you as to what a useless choice it was
Weird... maybe you should pay a little less heed to criticism from people on internet forums, in the end who gives a crap what anyone else thinks about your buying choices?
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  #39  
Old 19.11.2018, 01:21
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Re: Looking for good quality compact camera

Yet another remark on compacts with small vs large sensor cameras.
When sensor area halves (focal lens factor is 1.5) then the depth-of-field increases by one aperture stop if the field of view is kept constant.
I.e. the depth of field is the same for these three cameras and settings:
full-frame sensor, 50mm focal length, f/5.6
aps-c sensor, 35mmm focal length, f/4
m4/3 sensor, 25mm focal length, f/2.8

Certainly, a shallow depth-of-field can be used to an artistic advantage, but even more frequently one would like to keep things sharp, and then in low-light conditions a large sensor camera becomes no better than a smaller sensor one because the aperture has to be closed down on the large-sensor camera to keep background sharp.

http://www.dofmaster.com/dofjs.html
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