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  #21  
Old 12.10.2020, 17:04
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Re: Zürich to Munich

The problem in Munich is not only the flat-rents but the availability. 2018 (no more recent numbers available it seems) the "Wohnungsleerstand" in Munich was 0.2%. I bet those few were not the cheap ones either.

As to retirement: Imo one can't live their life due to the retirement plan. Unless of course the retirement is more important than life. Not a good idea, I've known people (several!) who had all these plans for the time of retirement and never got there! Not to mention that all this sh** keeps changing and what I was promised when I started it all already is outdated (and guess to who's disadvantage) and might be inexistent by the time I need it.

So go for what ever your heart desires. You can research the "best" retirement plans if you like and install them. And do.not.lose. your AHV card ever - it might grant you the best part of your pension. No need to stay here though if it doesn't feel right. Just look after it better than you look after your passport.
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  #22  
Old 13.10.2020, 00:06
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Re: Zürich to Munich

Hey, I have been commuting between CH and Munich for a few months now.


Some thoughts:
The housing market is no joke. I have not yet found a flat, even 1.5h outside of the city center, which I could afford long-term without using up what I have set aside.
I heard of a guy who was taking a night train out, and back into the city, every night, in order to have a place to sleep, and it was still cheaper than a room.
Also, according to German law, you are not allowed to live in hotels for longer than 3 months. And you have something like 2 weeks to register with an address where they can reach you and send you bills.


Most days I end up working until 23h-midnight because there is just nothing to do outside of work. All food shops but a gas station close before I'd normally leave work. Going into the city centre takes about an hour by metro, and there's not much more to do there. Everything is closed in the evening. My first evening there I was looking for a pharmacy after work, no luck. In the whole city. Found some food at the main train station which had one shop which was open until 22h. It might be a big city but Zurich feels so much more cosmopolitan to me in that aspect!



They have some nice food and friendly people


If you have a car, don't forget that you need a TÜV sticker to drive around the city centre.



The way of communicating is... quite different from the places I've lived in so far. Not sure if I'll get used to it.


And they have many more restaurant options than we have here, which is quite nice!
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  #23  
Old 13.10.2020, 07:11
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Re: Zürich to Munich

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The way of communicating is... quite different from the places I've lived in so far. Not sure if I'll get used to it.
care to elaborate on that?
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  #24  
Old 13.10.2020, 12:35
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Re: Zürich to Munich

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care to elaborate on that?

Very upfront and direct, at least business-related (please keep in mind that this is only from one person, with a mere few months of experience).
I had a few e-mails, from clients and from colleagues, which went:
"Hello Squeeeez,
You need to do this, this, this and this.
Bye,
Name"


and for someone who is more used to a latin way of communication, or even US/international/whatever international really means, it can be a slight shock. No reasons mentioned, no polite fluffiness, no nothing.
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  #25  
Old 13.10.2020, 13:26
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Re: Zürich to Munich

I know that there are a lot of things to consider... but supermarket opening times? Really? The Edeka at the main station opens from 07.00 to 23.00... except of Sundays where it opens from 08.00 to 23.00. How much longer would you need? How is that worse than Switzerland?
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  #26  
Old 13.10.2020, 13:47
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Re: Zürich to Munich

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Very upfront and direct, at least business-related (please keep in mind that this is only from one person, with a mere few months of experience).
I had a few e-mails, from clients and from colleagues, which went:
"Hello Squeeeez,
You need to do this, this, this and this.
Bye,
Name"


and for someone who is more used to a latin way of communication, or even US/international/whatever international really means, it can be a slight shock. No reasons mentioned, no polite fluffiness, no nothing.
LOL. That could have been an email from me.
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  #27  
Old 14.10.2020, 11:55
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Re: Zürich to Munich

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I know that there are a lot of things to consider... but supermarket opening times? Really? The Edeka at the main station opens from 07.00 to 23.00... except of Sundays where it opens from 08.00 to 23.00. How much longer would you need? How is that worse than Switzerland?

Maybe it is just the size of the city maybe I am biased. Those are my first impressions after a few months, and I thought they might be useful for Ato.


Basically if I wanted to travel from Frauenfeld to Zurich main station to go shopping there, it would still be faster, and only slightly more expensive, than going from my workplace in the Munich suburbs to the edeka at the main station. But clearly a few million people live like this and have no problem whatsoever I did notice that all my coworkers are married, though, and their wife will do the shopping during the day, while they are at work.
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  #28  
Old 14.10.2020, 12:12
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Re: Zürich to Munich

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Maybe it is just the size of the city maybe I am biased. Those are my first impressions after a few months, and I thought they might be useful for Ato.


Basically if I wanted to travel from Frauenfeld to Zurich main station to go shopping there, it would still be faster, and only slightly more expensive, than going from my workplace in the Munich suburbs to the edeka at the main station. But clearly a few million people live like this and have no problem whatsoever I did notice that all my coworkers are married, though, and their wife will do the shopping during the day, while they are at work.
I assumed you work in the center... I live in a village across the Luxembourg border into Germany and the local Kaufland opens from 6.30 to 22.00. Compared to Switzerland is that an absolute luxury.
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  #29  
Old 14.10.2020, 12:44
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Re: Zürich to Munich

Thanks for all the information people.

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The problem in Munich is not only the flat-rents but the availability. 2018 (no more recent numbers available it seems) the "Wohnungsleerstand" in Munich was 0.2%. I bet those few were not the cheap ones either.
From talking to a few different people I've come to the same conclusion, I'll need to spend a while looking. The company has offerred 2 months accommodation at the start which gives a bit of a buffer.

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Hey, I have been commuting between CH and Munich for a few months now.

Most days I end up working until 23h-midnight because there is just nothing to do outside of work. All food shops but a gas station close before I'd normally leave work. Going into the city centre takes about an hour by metro, and there's not much more to do there. Everything is closed in the evening. My first evening there I was looking for a pharmacy after work, no luck. In the whole city. Found some food at the main train station which had one shop which was open until 22h. It might be a big city but Zurich feels so much more cosmopolitan to me in that aspect!

They have some nice food and friendly people

If you have a car, don't forget that you need a TÜV sticker to drive around the city centre.

The way of communicating is... quite different from the places I've lived in so far. Not sure if I'll get used to it.

And they have many more restaurant options than we have here, which is quite nice!
I'm not sure is there less to do in the evenings, for my interests there appears to be things planned to be on, but of course at the moment covid is disrupting a lot of things.
Didn't know about the TüV sticker, car is a 2016 so it should be at least a euro 5.
As far as direct communication goes, I think having lived in the Netherlands I think the Germans appear a little more polite.
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Maybe it is just the size of the city maybe I am biased. Those are my first impressions after a few months, and I thought they might be useful for Ato.


Basically if I wanted to travel from Frauenfeld to Zurich main station to go shopping there, it would still be faster, and only slightly more expensive, than going from my workplace in the Munich suburbs to the edeka at the main station. But clearly a few million people live like this and have no problem whatsoever I did notice that all my coworkers are married, though, and their wife will do the shopping during the day, while they are at work.
There's a supermarket beside work so it shouldn't be an issue to acquire the relevant sustenance on a regular timely basis!
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  #30  
Old 14.10.2020, 13:19
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Re: Zürich to Munich

I really think there are a lot of factors to consider from job outlook to taxes to pay to real estate. But are we really discussing the nightlife of any European city compared to Switzerland?!

As the people of Vienna tend to say “Zurich is bigger than our central cemetery but definitely less lively”...
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  #31  
Old 14.10.2020, 13:24
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Re: Zürich to Munich

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Very upfront and direct, at least business-related (please keep in mind that this is only from one person, with a mere few months of experience).
I had a few e-mails, from clients and from colleagues, which went:
"Hello Squeeeez,
You need to do this, this, this and this.
Bye,
Name"


and for someone who is more used to a latin way of communication, or even US/international/whatever international really means, it can be a slight shock. No reasons mentioned, no polite fluffiness, no nothing.
Well.....if someone wrote an email to me saying 'Hello Squeeeez', I would be putty in their hands...... :-).
As they say, you had me at Squeeez.....
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  #32  
Old 03.12.2020, 18:15
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Re: Zürich to Munich

So, Munich it is?
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  #33  
Old 03.12.2020, 23:09
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Re: Zürich to Munich

(I've apparently lost the ability to "thank"...)

The link to https://www.brutto-netto-rechner.info/ was a huge help - thanks a lot Komsomolez...
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  #34  
Old 03.12.2020, 23:20
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Re: Zürich to Munich

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(I've apparently lost the ability to "thank"...)

The link to https://www.brutto-netto-rechner.info/ was a huge help - thanks a lot Komsomolez...
What is Steuerklasse 3? Or any number, what are the criteria?
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  #35  
Old 04.12.2020, 07:42
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Re: Zürich to Munich

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What is Steuerklasse 3? Or any number, what are the criteria?
Married, one person working

1 is single
2 is single with child (I think)
4 is 2 married persons both working and similar salaries
5 is 2 married persons both working and the lower earning person gets hit by huge taxes
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Old 04.12.2020, 07:44
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Re: Zürich to Munich

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What is Steuerklasse 3? Or any number, what are the criteria?
Steuerklasse 3 is if you are married and your spouse would then get 5. You will be in Steuerklasse 1. Here is an article explaining it:

https://www.expatrio.com/living-germ...man-tax-system

You need to really look into what you plan to do for health insurance. You are technically above the salary that allows you go to for private health insurance. It is a lot less expensive in your age but could get pretty bad in case you marry and have children or get older. I would do my research into it. I have 2 friends that managed (it is not easy and was a loophole that is probably closed now) to get back into the general health insurance because they got older, married and had children.
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  #37  
Old 04.12.2020, 08:43
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Re: Zürich to Munich

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So, Munich it is?
Offer fell apart at the contract stage. I'll be here for the foreseeable future. Not unhappy about it. All is well.
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  #38  
Old 04.12.2020, 10:29
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Re: Zürich to Munich

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What is Steuerklasse 3? Or any number, what are the criteria?
Look up “Steuerklassensplitting”. I’ve tried to explain that to Swiss folks before: Germany has high tax rates but nobody pays those. The system is silly complex, so you hire a specialist to sort it out for you. If you have two incomes but one is significantly higher than the other one can you save a lot by taxing the small income high but therefore the large one on a lower rate. That’s an incentive to make housewives go back to work even if they only work part time...
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  #39  
Old 16.08.2021, 20:00
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Considering moving from Zürich to München

Hi folks,

I'm a risk professional (30y) with almost 6y of experience into the financial services industry (Hold Master degree in RM & IT bachelor) - working in a major bank in Zürich earning around 120k per year.
My wife tried to find job here in CH without luck so now, for supporting her professional careers I am considering moving to Münich where she got an offer but to be honest I am a scared regarding salary & expenses topics - that of course needs to be taken into account for the final decision.

I will have 2 final interviews next week with 2 companies but so far we haven't discuss at all about salary expectations - not sure if that is the practice for all German company.

One company is a big tech/consultant active in the financial service where I could potentially work as a Business Analyst whereas the other is a well know German commercial bank where I could work as a Risk control analyst.

In my mind, I was considering to ask a salary between 80-90k but tbh I am not really sure if this range is accurate and if it could be sufficient for a couple of 2 with maybe 2 kids in the near future.

Including my wife's salary we should get between 135 -145 "if my proposal get accepted". So I have few questions for the forum - much appreciated all answers.

1) What calculation should i run for having the same standard of living that we have in Zurich? What is the equivalent of 8k net?

2) What are on average the monthly expenses and taxes for if we both work? Rent seems to be like in Zurich so not sure how to manage it with lower income..

3) Do you think I am asking too much for my role?

4) If we became parents what are pros/cons comparing to switzerland?

Ps. I was wondering if this website is reliable in term of net salary calculation:

https://www.brutto-netto-rechner.inf...or_germany.php

Thanks in advance for your help
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  #40  
Old 16.08.2021, 20:06
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Re: Considering moving from Zürich to München

The tax calculator is quite precise. Note the different "Steuerklassen" which you can choose to optimize - for higher earner choose 3, for lower 5, if close choose 4 for both (iirc).

Not an expert on Munich, but my gut feels is that a combined income of 145k EUR is better than 120k CHF in Zurich.
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