English Forum Switzerland

English Forum Switzerland (https://www.englishforum.ch/forum.php)
-   Other/general (https://www.englishforum.ch/other-general/)
-   -   Deafness and masks - help via information cards (https://www.englishforum.ch/other-general/300623-deafness-masks-help-via-information-cards.html)

EastEnders 11.10.2020 18:57

Deafness and masks - help via information cards
 
Mandatory masks/face coverings currently make a Deafies (deaf person) life much more difficult, than generally it already is.

Regardless, if someone is 'only' hard of hearing or completely deaf or suffers from any variety of hearing loss inbetween.

Those masks (which are a good thing per se!!) separate us even more from the general public, since we need to be able to see the face of the person opposite to us, to discern that they talk to us.

And especially for those of us who rely 100% on lipreading as I do.

Countless are the times, that I tried via gestures and asking the shop assistant/bank teller/post office clerk etc, that they should kindly lower their mask to make it possible for me to understand them...sadly quite often to no avail. :(

Since almost 40 years I carry this set of cards with me in my purse and they got used at last and now help a lot in daily life outside of my home!!

I recently enquired about them on behalf of a friend who's hard of hearing and would like a set too and learnt that those cards are still available.

For free at PRO AUDITO (and associated organisations) https://www.pro-audito.ch/, page is sadly only available in German.

Nowadays they've a slightly different design to mine on the photo, but mine were issued almost 40yrs ago......

They are still printed front and back (german /french and italian/ english), are the same size as a credit card and are made of a sturdy material.

Nowadays, when I need to talk to someone, I 'flash' my card (imagine a police officer on telly who identifies himself ;) ) and communication is a tad easier with normal hearing people,yet there are still some who think it a joke and don't comply......

I have been known to then take out one of my hearing aids, point to it and amuse thusly the entire post office......:msnsarcastic:...but in the end it did the trick.

The ignorance of some people , sometimes really beggars belief!!!






https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...b6e2c3da_c.jpg

curley 11.10.2020 23:02

Re: Mandatory masks/face coverings -> Deafies -> help via information cards
 
It's easy to see that life has become even more difficult for the deaf and hard of hearing in corona-times. Once we're told, that is. :msnblush: As I don't know anybody with this handicap I must admit I didn't think about it before today.

There is a lady in Germany who partly solves the problem with a special mask and a vest with the same print on it. Here is an article about it (German).

https://www.wz.de/imgs/39/8/4/5/6/7/...af4e8cc746.jpg

Also there seem to be apps now that translate speech to written text. Here is info about the one by google that seems to have been updated recently. Have you heard about those? (Probably, I guess).

EastEnders 12.10.2020 15:12

Re: Mandatory masks/face coverings -> Deafies -> help via information cards
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by curley (Post 3225568)
It's easy to see that life has become even more difficult for the deaf and hard of hearing in corona-times. Once we're told, that is. :msnblush: As I don't know anybody with this handicap I must admit I didn't think about it before today.

There is a lady in Germany who partly solves the problem with a special mask and a vest with the same print on it.

Also there seem to be apps now that translate speech to written text. Here is info about the one by google that seems to have been updated recently. Have you heard about those? (Probably, I guess).

Yep I knew about this, I am fairly well informed about most things 'deaf' ;) since it it concerns my daily life, I like to know what's around to be of help to me to keep on leading as independent a life as possible.

I for one wouldn't want to wear a mask or T-shirt like that. For me it is a bit too much 'in your face' (but I don't deny that it is a good idea all the same), perhaps it is the Swiss in me, that I wants to be in general a bit more discreet and only when desperate use blatant measures to get the opposite person to behave according to my needs.


The voice to text apps are a good invention, but curley imagine; you're at check out in Lidl.....where they scan your items at lightining speed, behind you is a queue and due to the cashiers unwillingness to lower their mask and enable you to lipread, you then would have to fiddle with such an app to get what the cashier says.......cue nasty remarks and evil looks and the like.

And those evil looks happen/ed also in non-COVID times, when you dare to hold up a queue or so. My kids were many a time witness (they all have impeccable hearing) of nasty remarks, when I needed to ask:" Can you repeat that,please?" for the 3rd/4th/5th time.....

EastEnders 12.10.2020 15:37

Re: Mandatory masks/face coverings -> Deafies -> help via information cards
 
I got an email today from pro audito, telling me that the stock of ENGLISH as well as Italinan printed cards is quite low. So if any of you want one on those languages, go ahead and order, the lady told me that if there's enough requests, they get reprinted!

German/French printed cards are sufficiently in stock

meloncollie 12.10.2020 16:02

Re: Mandatory masks/face coverings -> Deafies -> help via information cards
 
EE, I'd be interested to know if you have any experience with the clear plastic masks or those with a clear plastic window over the mouth area. Do you know if one can really/easily lip read through these?

I'm thinking of getting some of these for my mother and her friends, who all depend on lip reading/reading facial expressions to some extent. Wouldn't solve the problem of dealing with cashiers and others one runs into on the street, but my hope is that these would at least allow the ladies to enjoy a (socially distanced) gossip together.

Any thoughts much appreciated...

bowlie 12.10.2020 16:12

Re: Mandatory masks/face coverings -> Deafies -> help via information cards
 
And then there are these.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/va...xemption-card/

EastEnders 12.10.2020 16:14

Re: Mandatory masks/face coverings -> Deafies -> help via information cards
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by meloncollie (Post 3225781)
EE, I'd be interested to know if you have any experience with the clear plastic masks or those with a clear plastic window over the mouth area. Do you know if one can really/easily lip read through these?

I'm thinking of getting some of these for my mother and her friends, who all depend on lip reading/reading facial expressions to some extent. Wouldn't solve the problem of dealing with cashiers and others one runs into on the street, but my hope is that these would at least allow the ladies to enjoy a (socially distanced) gossip together.

Any thoughts much appreciated...



I haven't come across yet the the paper ones with the clear plastic window. But from the deafie fora & news I regularly read; I get that they are the smaller of two evils, they help but you need to be 'fluent' in lipreading to get what the other person says, because a still too big portion of the face is hidden.

In particular those who haven't learnt to lipread, but do so instinctively, need to see the entire face, as they are also very focussed on mimics etc.

However, the clear plastic shileds don't pose a problem at all in regards to lipreading, but I gathered that they are much less safe than a proper mask.

Signed,

between a rock and a hard place ;) ;)

Landers 12.10.2020 16:42

Re: Mandatory masks/face coverings -> Deafies -> help via information cards
 
Is it possible to get these cards in German but with them starting "Ich bin Englander..."? :)


I need something similar for when I'm in the hospital - the doctors and nurses there always talk so loudly they think everyone who is sick is deaf.

curley 12.10.2020 17:47

Re: Mandatory masks/face coverings -> Deafies -> help via information cards
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by EastEnders (Post 3225767)
...... I for one wouldn't want to wear a mask or T-shirt like that. For me it is a bit too much 'in your face' (but I don't deny that it is a good idea all the same), perhaps it is the Swiss in me, that I wants to be in general a bit more discreet and only when desperate use blatant measures to get the opposite person to behave according to my needs.


The voice to text apps are a good invention, but curley imagine; you're at check out in Lidl.....where they scan your items at lightining speed, behind you is a queue and due to the cashiers unwillingness to lower their mask and enable you to lipread, you then would have to fiddle with such an app to get what the cashier says.......cue nasty remarks and evil looks and the like.

And those evil looks happen/ed also in non-COVID times, when you dare to hold up a queue or so. My kids were many a time witness (they all have impeccable hearing) of nasty remarks, when I needed to ask:" Can you repeat that,please?" for the 3rd/4th/5th time.....

I agree, it crossed my mind as well. As one usually tells private things only when it is necessary. The vest she wears seems not corona-specific to me, more like the brassard blind people wear in case she worries to get run over by cyclists etc.

Cashiers in Lidl talk to you? Are you sure? :) They don't to me really. Maybe she's just mumbling to herself about the bad labour conditions. :D

Traubert 19.10.2020 10:58

I can't read you! - Deafness and Masks
 
I'm quite deaf and although I have hearing aids that help me tremendously, I am reliant on lip reading.

I'm having a hard time with people wearing masks, and especially with all the perspex screens going up between me and many services, which makes it even more difficult to hear - I find it really stressful.

Are any other hard-of-hearing people having a difficult time not being able to read lips under face masks?

John_H 19.10.2020 11:18

Re: I can't read you! - Deafness and Masks
 
I can see how that must be really difficult for people who rely on that visual contact.

I actually find it much harder with screens and masks, but for me it's just language.. I'm decent at FR, especially understanding it but I never realised before how much I need to listen properly, and probably I sort of face read too. Now I don't get most of the face and the voice is muffled.

So I feel for you guys who are affected more than me!

Ace1 19.10.2020 11:39

Re: I can't read you! - Deafness and Masks
 
See this thread from last week (I'll merge them now).

Ace1 19.10.2020 11:47

Re: I can't read you! - Deafness and Masks
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by John_H (Post 3228417)
I actually find it much harder with screens and masks, but for me it's just language.. I'm decent at FR, especially understanding it but I never realised before how much I need to listen properly, and probably I sort of face read too. Now I don't get most of the face and the voice is muffled.

I think most people, including native speakers of any given language, rely much more on non-verbal clues than they probably would think, but yes, it makes it harder still if it's a second or third language, I think that for me it's actually more due to the muffled voice and lack of facial expressions than any actual lip-reading.

But I've also noticed that shop workers are much more tolerant of misunderstandings now, so they've clearly realised that masks make it more difficult for everyone.

Traubert 19.10.2020 12:11

Re: Deafness and masks - help via information cards
 
Dear Eastenders,

I have been searching the Pro-Audito site for the yellow cards, alas I can't find them. Have you a direct page link or a keyword I could search on?

Many thanks.

EastEnders 19.10.2020 18:15

Re: Deafness and masks - help via information cards
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Traubert (Post 3228449)
Dear Eastenders,

I have been searching the Pro-Audito site for the yellow cards, alas I can't find them. Have you a direct page link or a keyword I could search on?

Many thanks.



Hei Traubert

You can just email them, via their official email address and order the cards. When I was corresponding with them, I told the lady that I advertised those cards and that there might be an influx of demand :) However, hurry up, in case you want the english one too, they are low on stock , German and French ones, are no problem.


Although, the cards are free, you'll get a letter with a pink slip accompnying them, asking for a donation.

I donated 20.- for mine, you never know, there might be a time when you are glad of the help of the organisation.

The yellow ones are my old ones, they don't exist like that anymore!!


I got them about 40yrs ago ;) and have often used them.

I'll post a pic of the new cards from pro audito.

EastEnders 19.10.2020 18:35

Re: Deafness and masks - help via information cards
 
OK

here goes;

Below in the collage are the cards, from pro audito,how they look nowadays!

German and French is one card each, the Italian and English one is printed on both sides (1 card)

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...e97764ee_c.jpg


This beauty below, is issued by SONOS Schweiz, Verband für Gehörlosen- und Hörgeschädigten-Organisationen, Zürich ,https://hoerbehindert.ch/,

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...b33c10f5_c.jpg

I got mine from the bfsug BERN.....and use it when in Austria, as I can't make head nor tail of the dialect there and need them to speak high-german.

Traubert, you could also get in touch with them for cards, they are the ones responsible for ZUG too. All the means of how to get in touch with them are in the link.

https://www.bfsug.ch/beratungsstelle...entralschweiz/



I hope this additional info helps

EastEnders 19.10.2020 18:51

Re: I can't read you! - Deafness and Masks
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Traubert (Post 3228406)
I'm quite deaf and although I have hearing aids that help me tremendously, I am reliant on lip reading.

I'm having a hard time with people wearing masks, and especially with all the perspex screens going up between me and many services, which makes it even more difficult to hear - I find it really stressful.

Are any other hard-of-hearing people having a difficult time not being able to read lips under face masks?

I am with you there, it is awful for me too!!
95% I need to lipread, the rest I make up with noises I get via the hearing aids.


Yesterday, we celebrated our one year wedding anniversary and booked the same restaurant, where we had the reception a year ago. We know the landlords of the place quite well and always had a good natter when we went there for a meal.

Yesterday, however both the maitre d' and the chef wore masks and I needed hubby to tell me what was said.

Somehow jokes etc lose their fun when relayed by a 2nd or 3rd party and the evening sort of wasn't the same as it always was like before for me and I felt partly properly uncomfortable.

I do comply of course and wear my mask when I go out, but I also feel I am thrown back in my independence.

We will keep on cultivating or social life, but instead of going out, where it is more stressful than enjoyable for me now, we will invite friends 2 to 4 at one go, for a meal to our place.

EastEnders 03.11.2020 14:30

Re: Deafness and masks - help via information cards
 
For those who are interested and/or need such a card. I have been informed from BFSUG*** Bern , that they are in the process of re-printing such info cards and I will be informed as soon as they are available again. I'll post the info in here then.



****BFSUG = Beratung für Schwerhörige und Gehörlose , they have offices/help desks/social workers all over Switzerland and are kind of the branches from SONOS Switzerland (NOT the US audio entertainment tech giant) and are different from pro audito too............

EastEnders 17.11.2020 16:51

Re: Deafness and masks - help via information cards
 
Well, as promised, here's the info...alas only available in GERMAN at the moment.

I already wrote to them about making those cards available in more languages (French, Italian and German)

https://www.bfsug.ch/informationen/d...k0JK1OhGAf2f1I


You can send and email to the 'bfsug'** in your region to pre-order the card. This version comes with an official text from the BAG (Swiss federal office for health) on the back, explainning that it legally IS ALLOWED to lower the mask to enable lipreading.


*** You'll find the closest branch (to you) of the bfsug on the main page by clicking on BERATUNGSSTELLEN

Cherub 17.11.2020 21:42

Re: Deafness and masks - help via information cards
 
With the mask requirement I've been finding I don't pick up on German so easily when I'm in shops, the PO etc. It makes me feel like a complete dork, since this pandemic situation started my German has been slipping backwards a bit despite the fact I've been trying to keep up by doing short online courses. I seriously hope 2021 will be better for everyone.


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 20:03.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0