I'm curious as to what you mean by the highlit phrase. Do you mean a Swiss citizen, a Swiss national, a proper Swiss, or wot?


Personally, having a Swiss passport would change me from "a Scottish Brit with a UK passport" to "a Scottish Brit with a UK and a Swiss passport".

It was just shorthand, really, for attaining Swiss nationality.

Obviously, neither of us will ever be properly Swiss, but if we can secure the position of our children (should we have any) by becoming Swiss citizens - and passing that citizenship on to them - then we will do so. With a bit of luck, being born here and having Swiss citizenship, they will be 'proper' Swiss. Or at least as 'proper' Swiss as any other Swiss kids with Migrationshintergrund.

Of course, if we do end up spending the rest of our lives here, we'll end up being kind-of-Swiss anyway, just like anyone else who spends a very long time living somewhere.

I'll find out on Monday whether I'll have to join the local fire brigade...

If one only looks at the tax revenue and value of their work, yes it doesn't seem much different. I can only make soft arguments. Personally, I feel Switzerland suffers from having a permanently high percentage of foreigners. This only fosters nativism and an "us vs them" mentality. The Swiss then become victims to scaremongering and the immigrants return the favour by judging the Swiss to be intolerant. If the foreigners were integrated and they feel that they have a stake in this country, then a lot of tensions would be reduced.

I just thought of one financial benefit. No more of these costly anti-foreigner initiatives!

It sounds very nice, and you're an optimist. But I do wonder... do the "real" Swiss perceive the naturalized people as Swiss? I guess it varies from place to place, and depends on circumstances of each particular case, but having a Swiss passport doesn't make one automatically Swiss in all ways that matter.

On a different note, what I find really confusing here is that there are people who are in their twenties or older, born here, but not Swiss. Having lived in the US I find it really strange - kids born there are American, no question. That's the identity they will have growing up there, and that's the passport they have (no matter that the reason the US law has that provision is as a fallout of slavery). What are the secondos here if not Swiss, and yet many of them are not, in the most important of ways.

I do think that the degree of integration and, to a lesser extent, language ability should be important when deciding to grant someone a passport. It seems that the new law is going in the right direction - I hope the measure passes.

Well, I mentioned previously in this thread one potential reason why second generation immigrants do not take Swiss nationality which is to avoid military service. There may be other reasons. But most second generations that I know became totally Swiss and no longer associate themselves with their parents' heritage. Many can't even speak their parents' language.

In my experience there will be some Swiss that will readily accept a naturalised citizen, others less readily. And yes reactions will vary throughout the country. Your accent or your race may lead people to initially think that you are a foreigner. By the way, this initial reaction is not limited to just Switzerland; in my opinion most Europeans would react in the same way. But most Swiss are not trying to exclude you. On the contrary, once they get to know you, then you will be considered Swiss.

I can give an example of both type of reactions. I am of Asian origin; I clearly do not look like a "standard" Swiss. I regularly attended our local church for several years. One day, a lady who rarely attends (just Easter and Christmas) came up to me, introduced herself and said, "Where are you from?" I was conversing with an 80-year old parishioner and he glanced at me with a twinkle in his eye. "Why, he is from here of course!" he responded with a broad smile.

How can I not be optimistic?

Indeed, my girlfriend speaks neither German nor Swiss-German, despite having had a Swiss-German father (and Italian mother), but he did spend half of his childhood and virtually all of his adult life in Ticino and never spoke German at home.

Tom

If you're Swiss you pay less car insurance (about 15% cheaper).

Nonsense. I paid the same before/after, only reason I pay less now is because I am at 35%, but I was there before I became Swiss in any case.

Tom

I started to pay less premium once the insurance registered me as being Swiss ! Oui, oui, here it's Fribourg lol

Are you sure that you were in the same bracket before/after?

Tom

Yes, 100% sure !

I changed car and they sent me a quote and I saw that they had me registered as a C permit holder. I rang them and said that I am Swiss (it was just to update my personal details) I wasn't expecting a 15% discount just cause I'm Swiss !!!! I was very surprised and they confirmed that Swiss people pay less premiums !

Have you informed them about your Swiss citizenship ?? If no, try you'll see what they say.

It is true. Some companies do adjust their premiums based on citizenship. Even worse, it depends on which country! Never mind that someone was born here, learned to drive here (or maybe in a "safe" country), never had an accident, etc. That person's premium may be raised if he/she happens to have a citizenship from a "dangerous" country.

For proof, go on an insurance company website and ask for a online quote. Somewhere in the questionnaire they will ask you what is your nationality. Try different countries and you will see the premiums jump up and down.