Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Permits/visas/government  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 09.10.2011, 13:39
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lausanne
Posts: 36
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 17 Times in 5 Posts
Laphoraig has no particular reputation at present
Urgent: Permit B runs out this week! Advice Please

I am a UK Citizen and have been living in Lausanne doing a PhD at EPFL for nearly 5 years. I finished my PhD in May (but I think my official contract finished in March and I worked the rest of the time unpaid).

During May and June I sorted out my CV and sent off about 20 job applications mostly in the US but some in CH. Then in July, August and September I went to the US for vacation (I wasn't allowed any time off in the last 2 years of my PhD!) but spent 40% of my time researching careers, looking for jobs and preparing for 2 interviews. 1 interview went well and I was offered a job in the US which I accepted. So now I am back in Switzerland awaiting the Visa process before I can work in the US. I expect to be able to go to the US at the end of December.

However, I just realized a few days ago that my Permit B runs out on the 14th! While away I received a letter from the "control des habitants" about paying 65CHF to extend my permit. It listed a set of required documents including a work contract and a "40 OASA" attestation issued by EPFL which I have no idea about. I went to the office on Thursday to explain the situation and pay the 65CHF and they said without the "40 OASA" they cannot process the application and I cannot stay in Switzerland. I think there was some mis-communication here, and control des habitants believe I have a new job and I need to extend my permit this way, which is false. I think possibly the "40 OASA" is a attestation that I did a PhD at EPFL in a technical subject and hence I am beneficial to the Swiss economy if I stay in CH. Very hard to find out what this is

I tried to explain that I will leave CH in December and since I am from the EU that perhaps I can stay as a tourist for 90 days, but he suggested that was illegal. I have tried to research my options but everything is contradictory so I was hoping for some good information here.


Some friends suggested if I get unemployment benefit then they will extend my permit. Is this true? Am I eligible considering that I do have a job lined up and my permit expires in a few days? What is the process?
Of curse getting unemployment payout would be nice but I was happy enough just to reside in CH while I wait for my US visa.

Alternatively I could keep quite for the 2.5 months until I leave. Some friends suggested as an EU citizen I have a legal right to live in Switzerland as long as I am not using Swiss resources. Besides which there is no real control and due to Schengen agreement in theory I could be traveling around half of Europe.

Someone else said that if I officially leave by going to the control des habitants and filling out the leaving form then I will then basically be living in CH as a tourist. I don't like this option because I am lying by stating I am leaving when I don't.

I don't want to do anything illegal as I do intend to return to Switzerland.

Thank you very much for any help and advice. I am searching the internet for help but I need quick help.

Cheers,
Tim
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 09.10.2011, 13:54
Kosti's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Oranje County
Posts: 488
Groaned at 27 Times in 17 Posts
Thanked 871 Times in 364 Posts
Kosti has a reputation beyond reputeKosti has a reputation beyond reputeKosti has a reputation beyond reputeKosti has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Urgent: Permit B runs out this week! Advice Please

If you want to stay in Switzerland, you could simply apply for a job seeker visa. As a EU citizen, and a graduate from a Swiss university, this should be quite straightforward for you. There will be a control if you go outside the Schengen zone to the UK, or when you leave for the US

AFAIK, the minimum documents needed are proof of housing, your degree certificate, and bank statements. As an EU citizen you may not even need all these. Just apply before your permit runs out, the authorities will send you a letter asking for additional documents if needed.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 09.10.2011, 14:10
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lausanne
Posts: 36
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 17 Times in 5 Posts
Laphoraig has no particular reputation at present
Re: Urgent: Permit B runs out this week! Advice Please

Quote:
View Post
If you want to stay in Switzerland, you could simply apply for a job seeker visa. As a EU citizen, and a graduate from a Swiss university, this should be quite straightforward for you. There will be a control if you go outside the Schengen zone to the UK, or when you leave for the US

AFAIK, the minimum documents needed are proof of housing, your degree certificate, and bank statements. As an EU citizen you may not even need all these. Just apply before your permit runs out, the authorities will send you a letter asking for additional documents if needed.
Thank you for the quick reply.

How do I apply for a job seeker visa? At the control des Habitants?

EDIT: also, what is the conditions of the job seeker visa. I am trying to read up on it and it seems to be valid for 6 months. But is that 6 months from the end of your last contract, or 6 months form when you apply. My contract finished in March so i am not sure I an apply for such a visa.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 09.10.2011, 14:46
Kosti's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Oranje County
Posts: 488
Groaned at 27 Times in 17 Posts
Thanked 871 Times in 364 Posts
Kosti has a reputation beyond reputeKosti has a reputation beyond reputeKosti has a reputation beyond reputeKosti has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Urgent: Permit B runs out this week! Advice Please

You apply for it as you would for any permit renewal.

For non-EU students, the time for the job seeker visa starts from the day they have been notified that they have passed the final exam by the EPFL service academique.

Being EU, in your case it might be the date till which your current permit is valid. The control des habitants will give you the correct information once you show up to apply.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 09.10.2011, 20:08
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lausanne
Posts: 36
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 17 Times in 5 Posts
Laphoraig has no particular reputation at present
Re: Urgent: Permit B runs out this week! Advice Please

Ok, thanks for that.


From the reading and research I have done, as an EU citizen I am entitled to 3 months in CH without doing anything, e.g. as a tourist or to look for a job. To make this 6 months to look for work I would have to officially register to get a residency permit.

This is basically what I asked at the control des habitants but he said no because I had a B Permit. I can't find information to support this claim. Secondly, what is to stop me officially de-registering and handing in my almost out of date Permit and then just staying as a tourist for less than 90 days, or going to say the UK for a few days and coming back to CH as a true tourist, which is really what I am to be. I don't need the social security or anything, I just need to stay here a few months until I get my US visa and sort out my apartment etc.

Tomorrow I will go to the Service du travail and see what they have to say. I have read in several places that my residence permit can be extended if I am receiving Unemployment benefits/Chomage. Whether this applies to me since I never contacted them on the 1st day of unemployment and I already have a job lined up. To make matters worse I think I did a terrible mistake and left a folder full of my work cntracts and salary statements at my old office which have subsequently been thrown out.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 09.10.2011, 22:08
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Geneva
Posts: 5,514
Groaned at 123 Times in 108 Posts
Thanked 3,297 Times in 1,737 Posts
Shorrick Mk2 has a reputation beyond reputeShorrick Mk2 has a reputation beyond reputeShorrick Mk2 has a reputation beyond reputeShorrick Mk2 has a reputation beyond reputeShorrick Mk2 has a reputation beyond reputeShorrick Mk2 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Urgent: Permit B runs out this week! Advice Please

Amazing how I have to pay unemployment insurance so people can use it as a holiday benefit just because they can be arsed to arrange their paperwork in due time.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users groan at Shorrick Mk2 for this post:
  #7  
Old 09.10.2011, 22:19
adrianlondon's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Basel
Posts: 9,131
Groaned at 170 Times in 153 Posts
Thanked 25,643 Times in 6,892 Posts
adrianlondon has a reputation beyond reputeadrianlondon has a reputation beyond reputeadrianlondon has a reputation beyond reputeadrianlondon has a reputation beyond reputeadrianlondon has a reputation beyond reputeadrianlondon has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Urgent: Permit B runs out this week! Advice Please

Quote:
View Post
Amazing how I have to pay unemployment insurance so people can use it as a holiday benefit just because they can be arsed to arrange their paperwork in due time.
If it pays out, it pays out. You should never rely on a random individual's morals to protect your money. Lobby to get the rules changed.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 09.10.2011, 22:28
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lausanne
Posts: 36
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 17 Times in 5 Posts
Laphoraig has no particular reputation at present
Re: Urgent: Permit B runs out this week! Advice Please

Quote:
View Post
Amazing how I have to pay unemployment insurance so people can use it as a holiday benefit just because they can be arsed to arrange their paperwork in due time.
err, this is entirely uncalled for and totally incorrect, as well as very rude.

I paid unemployment insurance for nearly 5 years and as such would normally be perfectly entitled to claim benefits as such. Secondly, I did not laze around doing nothing and hoped to get benefits - I spent several months purposely not receiving unemployment benefits while I was actively searching for employment, successfully I might add since I have a job lined up I am simply waiting for a US visa application!

No where in my thread have I stated that I want to claim benefits. My plan was simply to quietly reside in Switzerland until I can legally work in the US. It was an error on my part not to notice the deadline of my permit, but by no means have I tried to exploit the social security system, quite the opposite. I was entitled to claim 5 months of unemployment to this date but I didn't because I am financially responsible and took care of myself, and I can still take care of myself financially until the end of year when I hope to leave. I am applying for chomage as a means of prolonging my legal residence, not to get money. Heck I don't care if every cent goes to charity.
Reply With Quote
The following 9 users would like to thank Laphoraig for this useful post:
  #9  
Old 09.10.2011, 22:34
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lausanne
Posts: 36
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 17 Times in 5 Posts
Laphoraig has no particular reputation at present
Re: Urgent: Permit B runs out this week! Advice Please

Quote:
View Post
If it pays out, it pays out. You should never rely on a random individual's morals to protect your money. Lobby to get the rules changed.
I have not done and do not plan to do anything immoral. I have paid taxes and unemployment insurance for nearly 5 years, then searched for employment and found it on my own accord without costing Swiss tax payers a single cent. It is not my fault that Swiss red tape possibly allows one to extend their permit through social security benefits yet makes it complex to legally reside on their own finances!
Reply With Quote
The following 5 users would like to thank Laphoraig for this useful post:
  #10  
Old 10.10.2011, 11:09
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lausanne
Posts: 36
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 17 Times in 5 Posts
Laphoraig has no particular reputation at present
Re: Urgent: Permit B runs out this week! Advice Please

Quick update.

I went to the ORP who confirmed that if I am on chomage and seeking a job then in theory my permit is extended. Of course they thought it was stupid since I only have a few days left of the permit and I agreed but they understood my point of view and agreed that it was silly swiss red tape stopping me prolonging my permit without unemployment benefits. However, the earliest appointment is not for several weeks after my permit expires...

After that I went to the control des habitants who initially said that the evidence from ORP was not sufficient and I need to get a letter from ORP guaranteeing a load of things which I knew I couldn't get before my appointment with them. Was looking hopeless at this point so I started pleading stating that I only need to stay about 3 months, I have a job lined up etc... Before I gave up I showed the person my bank balance, bam, just like that he agreed that I had sufficient means of supporting myself until I receive unemployment benefits. 2 minutes and 65chf later I should have a permit on the way.

I don't know if I will receive any chomage given the time line but that I don't really care.


Just goes to show, if you flash a little money around then swiss politics changes for the better....
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Laphoraig for this useful post:
  #11  
Old 10.10.2011, 11:16
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Urgent: Permit B runs out this week! Advice Please

Quote:
View Post
e- I spent several months purposely not receiving unemployment benefits while I was actively searching for employment, successfully I might add since I have a job lined up I am simply waiting for a US visa application!
.
Bad Move, any unemployment benefit is based on the last 12 months income, NOT the last 12 months income when you were working, when you open a rahemnfrist with the RAV
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 10.10.2011, 11:20
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lausanne
Posts: 36
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 17 Times in 5 Posts
Laphoraig has no particular reputation at present
Re: Urgent: Permit B runs out this week! Advice Please

Quote:
View Post
Bad Move, any unemployment benefit is based on the last 12 months income, NOT the last 12 months income when you were working, when you open a rahemnfrist with the RAV
That would seem daft, and I had to work several months unpaid anyway.
But as I said, I don't care about the money.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 10.10.2011, 11:21
porsch1909
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Urgent: Permit B runs out this week! Advice Please

So just to confirm. Despite you having a job offer, Switzerland will pay you chomage until you leave the country?

What do you have to do to earn the chomage? Usually people have to send 10 applications per month...but you will get it without going to meetings or anything?

Questions from an intrigued PhD student
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 10.10.2011, 11:38
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lausanne
Posts: 36
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 17 Times in 5 Posts
Laphoraig has no particular reputation at present
Re: Urgent: Permit B runs out this week! Advice Please

Quote:
View Post
So just to confirm. Despite you having a job offer, Switzerland will pay you chomage until you leave the country?

What do you have to do to earn the chomage? Usually people have to send 10 applications per month...but you will get it without going to meetings or anything?

Questions from an intrigued PhD student
It is true that you will get chomage even if you have a job starting in the future, I believe they pay until the day you start working again. There are similar threads on this forum.

I really don't know the rules but you must have paid your taxes/worked for 12 months in the previous 24. One would normally have to show proof of applying for jobs. If you have a job lined up then I think you are sometimes still required to look for temporary jobs but of course no one will really higher you for 2 to 3 months. Especially since you only have to prove you are applying for jobs that are suitable for your skill set, having a PhD obviously means you are not looking to work in McDonalds and this isn't required.

Saying that I know someone who had a post-doc at MIT lined up and couldn't star for 3-4 months, and she had to work part time at UBS installing windows on computers for a few weeks- seemed pretty daft.

Then I also know several people with a PhD and after the first meeting they basically never really needed to show up for meetings and only needed to show evidence of applying to a couple of jobs a month. The reason being that with a PhD you become somewhat specialised and they know there aren't that many suitable jobs out there, and they also trust that you are smart enough to look for work yourself without someone holding your hand. This depends on how well you get on with your contact at the unemployment office.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Laphoraig for this useful post:
  #15  
Old 10.10.2011, 11:50
porsch1909
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Urgent: Permit B runs out this week! Advice Please

Quote:
View Post
It is true that you will get chomage even if you have a job starting in the future, I believe they pay until the day you start working again. There are similar threads on this forum.

I really don't know the rules but you must have paid your taxes/worked for 12 months in the previous 24. One would normally have to show proof of applying for jobs. If you have a job lined up then I think you are sometimes still required to look for temporary jobs but of course no one will really higher you for 2 to 3 months. Especially since you only have to prove you are applying for jobs that are suitable for your skill set, having a PhD obviously means you are not looking to work in McDonalds and this isn't required.

Saying that I know someone who had a post-doc at MIT lined up and couldn't star for 3-4 months, and she had to work part time at UBS installing windows on computers for a few weeks- seemed pretty daft.

Then I also know several people with a PhD and after the first meeting they basically never really needed to show up for meetings and only needed to show evidence of applying to a couple of jobs a month. The reason being that with a PhD you become somewhat specialised and they know there aren't that many suitable jobs out there, and they also trust that you are smart enough to look for work yourself without someone holding your hand. This depends on how well you get on with your contact at the unemployment office.
They don't know fresh PhDs that well then
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 10.10.2011, 12:04
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Geneva
Posts: 5,514
Groaned at 123 Times in 108 Posts
Thanked 3,297 Times in 1,737 Posts
Shorrick Mk2 has a reputation beyond reputeShorrick Mk2 has a reputation beyond reputeShorrick Mk2 has a reputation beyond reputeShorrick Mk2 has a reputation beyond reputeShorrick Mk2 has a reputation beyond reputeShorrick Mk2 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Urgent: Permit B runs out this week! Advice Please

Quote:
View Post
Just goes to show, if you flash a little money around then swiss politics changes for the better....
Considering there is a provision for unemployed residence as long as you demonstrate can support yourself... i think it just goes to show something else.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 10.10.2011, 12:18
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lausanne
Posts: 36
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 17 Times in 5 Posts
Laphoraig has no particular reputation at present
Re: Urgent: Permit B runs out this week! Advice Please

That may be so, but the person's dismissive attitude did a U-turn once he saw my account information, despite previously stating that i am financially secure for 3 months, have applied to chomage, have a job lined up. He could ahve asked to see my bank balance when I stated I had sufficient funds but didn't
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Urgent - Dismissal, Legal Advice Please Nadja56 Employment 4 21.05.2009 09:41
URGENT Advice on Phone and DSL connection,please bluefish TV/internet/telephone 2 10.12.2008 10:38
Urgent Legal Advice, PLEASE Soul Food Employment 23 15.10.2008 16:59


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 10:24.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0