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  #221  
Old 16.06.2014, 18:26
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

They have already compromised on 10 years. The other things they still need to reach a compromise on..
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  #222  
Old 16.06.2014, 18:28
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

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A battle between the left and the right. The right wants to lime naturalisation to those with 'C' permit only- and stick to 12 years. The left wants to not limit to 'C' permit and go down to 8 years. The right also wants only years between 5 and 15 to count double. A compromise will have to be found, somehow. Perhaps 10 years instead of 12 or 8- the 'C' permit question will be hard fought over.
Is the C permit thing really such a big deal? Surely the vast majority of people who qualify for the residence requirements ( for normal not facilitated naturalisation) will already have a C permit anyway?
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  #223  
Old 17.06.2014, 15:16
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

The conférence de conciliation has arrived at a decision.
10 years residence, as per CN and CE
C permit required, as per CN and CE
The time spent in Switzerland between ages 8 and 18 will be doubled.

NZZ article: http://www.nzz.ch/schweiz/sessionen/...enz-1.18323927
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  #224  
Old 18.06.2014, 19:14
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

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The conférence de conciliation has arrived at a decision.
10 years residence, as per CN and CE
C permit required, as per CN and CE
The time spent in Switzerland between ages 8 and 18 will be doubled.

NZZ article: http://www.nzz.ch/schweiz/sessionen/...enz-1.18323927
So what happens now - a simultaneous vote in both houses, or does each house need to consider the proposal of the commission to indicate whether they agree with it? Will it happen during this session or the next?
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  #225  
Old 18.06.2014, 19:55
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

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So what happens now - a simultaneous vote in both houses, or does each house need to consider the proposal of the commission to indicate whether they agree with it? Will it happen during this session or the next?
The both side just made the 'suggestion' for the next debate, not the final solution.

According to the NZZ article, the both Rats should discuss and vote that suggestion on Thursday, if the majority is happy with that, then it becomes the law after 100 days.

During that 100 days, any party could collect 50,000 signatures and turnover it. That's why the article hints those of possibilites.
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  #226  
Old 18.06.2014, 21:01
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

May a minor ask for citizenship on his own? Otherwise why the double-counting of years below 13?
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  #227  
Old 19.06.2014, 02:57
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

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So what happens now - a simultaneous vote in both houses, or does each house need to consider the proposal of the commission to indicate whether they agree with it? Will it happen during this session or the next?
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The both side just made the 'suggestion' for the next debate, not the final solution.

According to the NZZ article, the both Rats should discuss and vote that suggestion on Thursday, if the majority is happy with that, then it becomes the law after 100 days.

During that 100 days, any party could collect 50,000 signatures and turnover it. That's why the article hints those of possibilites.
It is my understanding that the text that the conférence de conciliation agrees on is voted on during the final vote (this Friday). If either chamber refuses to pass the law, the projet de loi is binned.

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May a minor ask for citizenship on his own? Otherwise why the double-counting of years below 13?
Anyone who fulfils the criteria for naturalisation may submit an application, however, the applications of minors must be signed by their legal guardians.
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  #228  
Old 19.06.2014, 11:59
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

It seems that Nationalrat approved the new differences. See http://www.parlament.ch/ab/frameset/...850_441851.htm .
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  #229  
Old 19.06.2014, 17:21
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

Ständerat approved as well the differences
http://www.parlament.ch/ab/frameset/...092_442093.htm
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  #230  
Old 19.06.2014, 18:14
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

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The conférence de conciliation has arrived at a decision.
10 years residence, as per CN and CE
C permit required, as per CN and CE
The time spent in Switzerland between ages 8 and 18 will be doubled.

NZZ article: http://www.nzz.ch/schweiz/sessionen/...enz-1.18323927
I don't see the point of doubling the 8-18 years bit, so in theory a 13 year old could apply even through his parents are not eligible for another 5 years....I don't believe that is really a possibility.
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  #231  
Old 19.06.2014, 18:35
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

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I don't see the point of doubling the 8-18 years bit, so in theory a 13 year old could apply even through his parents are not eligible for another 5 years....I don't believe that is really a possibility.
Under the current federal law, a child of 11 (10x1 + 1x2) can apply for naturalisation. The new law will allow children aged 9 to naturalise (8x1 + 1x2 = 10). I think the doubling makes a lot of sense. A child who lives in Switzerland from age 8 will inevitably attain a better degree of social integration than an adult of 20 over the course of 5 years. The only silly element I see is that a child could be born here, naturalise at the earliest occasion (i.e. 9) then leave Switzerland. Integration and language skills learnt so early are likely to be lost following a long period of time spent abroad.
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  #232  
Old 19.06.2014, 19:09
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

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I don't see the point of doubling the 8-18 years bit, so in theory a 13 year old could apply even through his parents are not eligible for another 5 years....I don't believe that is really a possibility.
It really is. The parents or legal guardians have to sign the application forms but it really is possible for a minor to become Swiss before the parents.
Our son is eligible to apply next year if he so wishes whereas we will have a least another 5 years to wait if we decide we want to.
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  #233  
Old 19.06.2014, 23:23
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

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Our son is eligible to apply next year if he so wishes whereas we will have a least another 5 years to wait if we decide we want to.
What if it's the opposite?

For example, if the parents have been in the country for twelve years and they have (say) an 8-year-old child, does he have to wait or can he be included in his parents' naturalization request?
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  #234  
Old 20.06.2014, 01:18
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

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What if it's the opposite?

For example, if the parents have been in the country for twelve years and they have (say) an 8-year-old child, does he have to wait or can he be included in his parents' naturalization request?
He can be included in the parents application.
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  #235  
Old 20.06.2014, 01:23
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

Assuming a kid is minor and his parents are not Swiss, then such a kid could not support himself so I doubt such an application would be approved.
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  #236  
Old 20.06.2014, 02:44
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

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Assuming a kid is minor and his parents are not Swiss, then such a kid could not support himself so I doubt such an application would be approved.
Yes it would. One does not have to support oneself, rather one must not depend on the State/charity to support oneself.
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  #237  
Old 20.06.2014, 09:09
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

So now hat the law has passed, we are into the three month waiting cycle before it comes into effect, correct?

Is there any word on how cases of people who are already eligible to apply under the old law but will be disqualified under the new law will be handled? Call me an optimist, but I rather want to think that they would make some provisions for such cases.
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  #238  
Old 20.06.2014, 10:51
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

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So now hat the law has passed, we are into the three month waiting cycle before it comes into effect, correct?

Is there any word on how cases of people who are already eligible to apply under the old law but will be disqualified under the new law will be handled? Call me an optimist, but I rather want to think that they would make some provisions for such cases.
It was said as much during the final debate by Ueli Leuenberger:

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Il ne me reste plus aujourd'hui que de lancer un appel à toutes celles et tout ceux dans notre pays qui remplissent les conditions de la loi actuelle pour le dépôt d'une demande de naturalisation. Qu'ils se dépêchent, qu'ils aillent chercher les formulaires et qu'ils commencent la procédure dès maintenant et déposent leurs demandes pour être traités selon les conditions actuelles, qui sont un peu plus justes que celles qui figureront dans la nouvelle loi.
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  #239  
Old 20.06.2014, 11:22
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

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Assuming a kid is minor and his parents are not Swiss, then such a kid could not support himself so I doubt such an application would be approved.
It would and it has. We know a couple on cases where this has happened.
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  #240  
Old 20.06.2014, 11:59
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Re: Swiss Citizenship after 8 years?

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It was said as much during the final debate by Ueli Leuenberger:
Thank you! That addresses my case perfectly, but I cannot help wondering what's going to happen to people who are basically 1-2 years away from being eligible for citizenship and who now find themselves in quite a pickle, to say the least. It would have been good to have a clause grandfathering the old law, in the sense that it would only apply to foreigners entering the country for the first time after the law came into effect.
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