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  #21  
Old 06.07.2017, 15:46
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

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I thank you all for taking time to write to me, we are hard working family, I am a structural designer and computer programmer, I think I can easily find a good job, the only barrier will be the language( German or French or Italian ), the reason we like to live in Switzerland is because when my family traveled to CH 2 years ago and in a few weeks we go again, my younger Son cried, he did not want to go back to Australia, He loved the country and every few days telling me to live there.

I'd venture a guess and say that neither job is likely to be particularly sought after, and you will not "easily" find a job in either field. You need to not just find something, you need to compete with about 400m Swiss and Europeans as every employer needs to prove that this particular job cannot be done by any Swiss, EU citizen or non-EU resident with open permit.

The language barrier you seem to consider minor is not actually minor. As usual, think in reverse - how many jobs would one find in Australia in either of these fields without speaking any English whatsoever?

You might get away with English-only in some jobs around here, but certainly not the majority.

Lastly, basing a decision like this on a one-time visit for a couple of weeks and a kid crying because he enjoyed his vacation, well... I would suggest to spend much more time here and - quite clearly - do much more research before seriously contemplating a move. This may be a nice place for many and it may well be for you, but it's not always and only the glorious Heidiland you experience while on vacation.
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  #22  
Old 06.07.2017, 15:47
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

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things are bit more informal in ticino i suppose. i rented privately from the owner who is a local 'aristocrat' (her family 'founded' lugano is how she once described it to me). i shared my financial position with her (might have showed my tax return or bank letter or something), paid deposit into an account and paid rent each month. i also didn't have a permit at the time.
.
True that my first apartment here was with a lady who owned it, she was very nice and was happy with similar facts, only foreign money and no permit. However, it wasn't a proper lease, it was something that went for shorter terms - it was formal, we had paperwork.
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  #23  
Old 06.07.2017, 15:52
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

what's a proper lease? mine was on the standard (CAFT or something?) form and was registered with the commune.
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  #24  
Old 06.07.2017, 16:01
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

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what's a proper lease? mine was on the standard (CAFT or something?) form and was registered with the commune.
Sorry I can't recall all the detail, but something like if you rent (not sublet, rent from the owner) furnished places, leases change a lot. You don't get the same sort of security that pertains to unfurnished, I think because being asked to leave will cause less hardship than if you have to leave with your furniture. Or perhaps the owner could give you more security but doesn't have to?

We paid no bond, simply our rent, it was entirely furnished down to teaspoons, towels, the lot and there was nothing extra to pay for anything, wifi etc included. There was a nice element of trust on the landlady's part. At some point we signed something that was for 6 months, after we'd been there for maybe six months. And at the end of that she needed the place back for her son who had decided to return to Geneva. She gave us six months warning and we could leave whenever we found something suitable within that period, didn't have to give any notice etc. She didn't have to give us 6 months, but since she knew it was happening, she did.

It was all very civilised. But obviously also uncertain.
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Old 06.07.2017, 16:02
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

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Lastly, basing a decision like this on a one-time visit for a couple of weeks and a kid crying because he enjoyed his vacation, well... I would suggest to spend much more time here and - quite clearly - do much more research before seriously contemplating a move. This may be a nice place for many and it may well be for you, but it's not always and only the glorious Heidiland you experience while on vacation.
Exactly. I dont like coming back from holidays, but thats not a good reason to quit everything and go to Iceland with no research.
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  #26  
Old 06.07.2017, 16:07
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

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If you are not from Brunei, Japan, Malaysia, New Zealand, or Singapore your chances are, as said, slim. Those are the only non-European countries which citizens easily can get long term permits.
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Annex 1, List 1 of the Visa Provisions FOM
https://www.sem.admin.ch/sem/en/home...oerigkeit.html
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Any sport actually


That IS interesting. Thanks for the link.
Again folks, you are confusing the words "visa" and "permit". Yes, it's true that citizens of Brunei, Japan, Malaysian, New Zealand and Singapore don't need any kind of entry visa when coming to Switzerland, but they do need a pre-approved permit if they plan to be a resident here.

"2.1.1.5 Comment regarding prior authorisation of a residence permit
Nationals of the following states do not require a visa to enter Switzerland under any circumstances: Brunei, Japan, Malaysia, New Zealand and Singapore.

However, the competent Swiss authority will issue a prior authorisation of a residence permit in the following cases:

a) for a stay of more than 90 days, or
b) a stay involving gainful employment:
 lasting more than eight days, or
 from the first day of work in the primary or auxiliary construction sectors, the hospitality sector, industrial or private cleaning services, surveillance and security services, itinerant sales and services or erotic services.

This prior authorisation of a residence permit is issued directly to the foreign national, or to a third party (employer), by the cantonal migration authority. The Swiss diplomatic or consular mission is not involved in this procedure."

https://www.eda.admin.ch/content/dam...witzerland.pdf

And once here they will still need to meet residency, language, integration requirements to obtain permanent residency - just like other foreigner does.
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  #27  
Old 06.07.2017, 16:12
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

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things are bit more informal in ticino i suppose. i rented privately from the owner who is a local 'aristocrat' (her family 'founded' lugano is how she once described it to me). i shared my financial position with her (might have showed my tax return or bank letter or something), paid deposit into an account and paid rent each month. i also didn't have a permit at the time.
It is up to the landlord what they accept and what kind of proof of income is needed. If at all
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  #28  
Old 06.07.2017, 16:30
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

Thank you very much Medea for the details.
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And once here they will still need to meet residency, language, integration requirements to obtain permanent residency - just like other foreigner does.
I think there is an other explanation and clarification needed: Permanent Residency.

It think that is commonly understood to be Permit C. I do not think that is what OP is initially referring to when he speaks about "permanent residency".

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[W]e would like to permanently move there, is it possible, what are the rules, I know this is big question, but we are looking for an answer, if there are Migration agents, we can contact them.
The route to Permit C is normally a long one (except certain rare exceptions) and goes most of the cases through Permit B which can be seen "permanent residency light" or "long term residency", in contrast to Permit L which is "short term residency" (There are other kind of permits, but those are for diplomats, refugees etc.).
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  #29  
Old 06.07.2017, 17:07
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

Indeed and as we know even the permanent residency C permit may not guarantee "permanent" in the future if the proposed changes come into effect. If you're not integrated enough then a C could be downgraded to a B and if you still don't integrate enough the B could be revoked.

The only permanent residency guarantee is Swiss citizenship, but that's getting harder to obtain from next year.
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  #30  
Old 06.07.2017, 19:49
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

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The only permanent residency guarantee is Swiss citizenship, but that's getting harder to obtain from next year.
Indeed.

Hazargary, even if you do managed to find a job capable of sponsoring a permit for you, be aware that life here may become increasingly insecure for non-EU foreigners You cannot count on putting down roots here. A non-EU resident should have plans in his back pocket, and sufficient financial wherewithal, to move back home at any time.

We've been here 19 years. We will never qualify for citizenship, but had felt relatively secure in our C permits.

As of next year, though... based on conversations around the village, let's just say I'll be keeping the suitcases packed and the dogs' travel permits valid.

Another thing you should factor into your plans: How old are you?

If you are over 40, your chances at finding a job decrease, if over 50 your chances decrease dramatically. Increasingly companies, especially in the tech fields, are getting rid of employees over 50, and there seems to be no end to that trend in sight.

There isn't much job security in Switzerland as it is, an employee can be fired for no reason as long as the notice period is met. But for those over 50 these are indeed uncertain times.


Not wanting to frighten you - but you do need to be aware that living and working in Switzerland is not the paradise you experienced on your holidays. Make sure those rose colored glasses are put away, or better yet broken and tossed in the garbage. Try your luck, you only live once, blah blah blah... but keep a PlanB in your back pocket.

All the best...
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  #31  
Old 06.07.2017, 19:52
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

Why will you never qualify for citizenship?
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  #32  
Old 06.07.2017, 19:57
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

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Why will you never qualify for citizenship?
I planted the wrong color geraniums.
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  #33  
Old 06.07.2017, 19:58
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

Haha. Decamp to the next village.
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  #34  
Old 06.07.2017, 19:58
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

I hope it isn't too hard, since we are thinking of going down the citizen track.
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  #35  
Old 06.07.2017, 20:08
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

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I planted the wrong color geraniums.
We have never had geraniums.

Tom
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  #36  
Old 06.07.2017, 20:13
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

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We have never had geraniums.

Tom
indeed.

Oh you free and easy Ticinese...
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  #37  
Old 06.07.2017, 20:42
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

No geraniums here either, though I've planted a few pansies in my time.

Salad Days better start working on your French language then. It'll be needed for citizenship.
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  #38  
Old 06.07.2017, 20:46
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

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I thank you all for taking time to write to me, we are hard working family, I am a structural designer and computer programmer, I think I can easily find a good job, the only barrier will be the language( German or French or Italian ), the reason we like to live in Switzerland is because when my family traveled to CH 2 years ago and in a few weeks we go again, my younger Son cried, he did not want to go back to Australia, He loved the country and every few days telling me to live there.
Your best bet then is to have your son plan to come to Switzerland for the university. Start looking into that and plan with your son what he needs to do to make his dream come true.

Sounds like it's his goal, not a family goal.
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  #39  
Old 07.07.2017, 00:23
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I thank you again for all your kind advises, the reason I came to this forum is to gather more information, it looks like it is not easy but not impossible either. We don't rush to it, we look at it, study it carefully. We already live in a lucky, proud and beautiful country.

Dear meloncollie, Thank you so so much, we will this study this plan very carefully.

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Your best bet then is to have your son plan to come to Switzerland for the university. Start looking into that and plan with your son what he needs to do to make his dream come true.

Sounds like it's his goal, not a family goal.
Very good idea I never thought about it, but it is our goal too.

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My husband and I are Australian and no other passports and we were able to fill 'niche' jobs in Zurich...

It *is* possible. It really depends on what qualifications you have and whether you can find an employer who needs you and cannot fill the position locally or from the EU.
Thank you , very encouraging.

Last edited by 3Wishes; 07.07.2017 at 19:15. Reason: merging consecutive replies and fixed quote (please take care not to remove or change HTML tags)
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Old 07.07.2017, 00:51
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Re: An Australian would like to get permanent residency in Switzerland

Hazargary, I just peeked at your profile. If the DOB you have listed is your actual age...


...not to drone on about the age hurdle, but please do not even think of trying to coming here without not only a confirmed job offer but also return costs negotiated into the package.*

In your 50s, in your field, the chance of losing your job after a short time is high. I cannot stress enough how frequently one finds negative attitudes towards people over 50 in the Swiss workplace. Your challenge does not stop at finding a job but continues to holding onto that job for any length of time.

Do remember that as a non-EU your permit might be tied to your employer. If so, and if you fall victim to the next round of redundancy cuts you and your dependents could lose the right to stay.

Again, not to discourage you but to try to open your eyes to just how high the barriers you face might be.

Would your wife also be looking to work? If so, what field is she in? Given the children's ages I'll hazard a guess she might be younger... Perhaps look into her employment possibilities here.

On the other hand, if you could get one of the gazillionaire 'in the public interest' permits, you'd be golden. There isn't much info on these, as they are negotiated on an individual basis. Rumors abound, but hard facts are thin on the ground.

Again, good luck.


* That is, if companies are still paying relo costs. In many companies the gilded packages of yore are not so common, nor so gilded, today.
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