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Old 09.07.2019, 13:53
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Problem with the procedure of documents for marriage. Swiss-Non EU

Hello guys! I need your advice again. So, I am from a non EU country, my fiancé is swiss. I am sure you all know about the procedure and documents that they ask while applying for the marriage. So, obviously I had a «being not married» document from my country, whete it is clearly written that I am not married and under the legislatioon of my home country, there is no impediment to my marriage and that I have a right to get married.

After having examined our documents for a month and 10 days, (a friend of mine in zurich, non eu as well,had her answer in 1 week though, but I am in Vaud so we see once again how every canton is different :-) ) today we have received a letter from the Etat Civil, that my doccument about being not married is not sufficient, as it has to be mentioned “ single “ instead of “not married” . So obviously, my fiancé called them to ask, why the document was not okay. On which they answered, that as in Switzerland you can get in a registered relationship ( which doesn’t make you married) they need a document that says that I am single.

After that, I called to the house of justice of my country ( that’s where you get those documents) and explained the situation. The lady was shocked, as she told me, nobody has ever called them with such a problem after receiving the same document for the marriage with a foreign citizen. She said, that as the rehistered relation doesn’t exist in my country ( people get married, or not married, these are the only options:-) ), they can not change the form of the document.

So I am very lost now... the swiss say it’s not enough, while my country sais it’s the only form of the document that they give.

Could you please help me with this situation as I don’t know what to do..
Thank you so much!!!!!
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Old 09.07.2019, 13:57
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Re: Problem with the procedure of documents for marriage. Swiss-Non EU

I had a former problem with authorities asking for papers that could not be produced, in the end I paid a lawyer who intermitted between the party's and worked it out. As a private person there are moments where one just keeps running into a brick wall at the desk, a lawyer is seen as a more serious point of contact and gains easier access to the people that you can't reach.
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Old 09.07.2019, 14:20
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Re: Problem with the procedure of documents for marriage. Swiss-Non EU

If Edwin says you should get a lawyer get a lawyer, he has been there and done that. You can try for yourself but as he says; sometimes a lawyer's word has more gravitas than the one of a mere mortal. You can also thank Edwin and Edwin's country (plus New Zealand) for this nitpicking by the Swiss.

If you do it on your own stress on the following point:
Quote:
So, obviously I had a «being not married» document from my country, whete it is clearly written that I am not married and under the legislatioon of my home country, there is no impediment to my marriage and that I have a right to get married.
You might also get in contact with the Ambassador to Switzerland of your country and request an accompanying note which explains yours countries regulations and definitions in respect with the Swiss law.
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Old 09.07.2019, 14:44
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Re: Problem with the procedure of documents for marriage. Swiss-Non EU

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If Edwin says you should get a lawyer, get a lawyer
Definitely, as a newbie, OP might not know that Edwin is the walking bible of the forum.
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Old 09.07.2019, 15:05
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Re: Problem with the procedure of documents for marriage. Swiss-Non EU

My main problem I had was that I could not reach the people above those that are behind the desks or pick up the phones at first. In the end all you need is somebody with authority in your country saying this is proper and all is fine, and somebody with authority here who than says o.k. we allow an exception since all is proper. And you need to know in what form and from who in your country the Swiss will accept such, and who can grand such exception here. This in my opinion is something you simply can't do. I tried for over 1,5 years so solve such, after which I gave everything to a lawyer and the combined efforts/communication of the lawyer, 2 embassy's and a few diff ministries made it all happen, and I just got a letter a few months later that all was fine, would I have know it all upfront I would have gotten a lawyer the first day.

Surely you can try this yourself, but I found Switzerland very bureaucratic and incredible hard (impossible actually since I never managed) to reach a few levels higher in the hierarchy at the governmental offices. And the people behind the desk stick to the rules. If rule 324 says they need form 12C, and you can't provide 12C than it simply is end of case no matter what you try at the desk.

And to avoid an incredible bill, be certain that you hand a very clear order with all info you have and what exactly you want to achieve, and all info that is of great importance to the case like a link to the law that says that no registered partnership is possible in your country to name something, copy's of what you got with exact legal names of the documents. I did that, and the lawyer could just present a full and clear case to those that could decide, she kept the communication going between the party's and I had to pay her 5 hours which I found reasonable and worth it.

And no harm in trying some yourself first, you might have more luck than me. Maybe a ministry in your country is easier to reach and willing to reach out to the Swiss.
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Old 09.07.2019, 15:10
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Re: Problem with the procedure of documents for marriage. Swiss-Non EU

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Definitely, as a newbie, OP might not know that Edwin is the walking bible of the forum.
I am not a walking bible, nor do I know everything, sometimes I admit my mistakes, sometimes we just agree to disagree and yes I'm more stubborn than always is good for the topic. And often I think I have no clue and just don't post in a topic. However like all others here I had my own experiences in Switzerland, some things might have happened to you so you can help people with such, I had a situation where it took me 2 years to be able to recognise my own son. So yeah, no matter how much you dislike me. There are situations where I do know what I am talking about. I've talked about this before on the forum and some members might remember such.
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Old 09.07.2019, 18:02
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Re: Problem with the procedure of documents for marriage. Swiss-Non EU

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Could you please help me with this situation as I don’t know what to do..
Call your country's embassy in this country. It is unlikely that you are the first citizen from your country to get married here, so they rather than the justice department in your country will have more experience in dealing with this.
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Old 09.07.2019, 18:48
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Re: Problem with the procedure of documents for marriage. Swiss-Non EU

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) today we have received a letter from the Etat Civil, that my doccument about being not married is not sufficient, as it has to be mentioned “ single “ instead of “not married” .
A further issue is that "not married" has a certain special meaning in the Swiss civil register https://www.bfs.admin.ch/bfs/fr/home...nclatures.html. What they properly want is not just "single" but "célibataire" which actually means "never married" https://fr.wiktionary.org/wiki/c%C3%A9libataire (and also never in a registered partnership).

The French "célibataire" or German "ledig" does not exist in the English language and is often simply and erroneously translated as "single". More on that topic and also a bit of other background information can be found at:
https://www.englishforum.ch/complain...753-ledig.html
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Old 09.07.2019, 19:42
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Re: Problem with the procedure of documents for marriage. Swiss-Non EU

In Switzerland, religious leaders cannot have a licence to perform the actual, legal marriage transaction. This is always done in the civil government office. Of course, many churches do offer a religious ritual to celebrate and bless the marriage, but this is done only after the priest/minister has received proof of the marriage before the state authorities.

Whether or not you you intend to have a church ceremony, you might consider contacting the head of any religious community, here in Switzerland, of people from your country. They, after all, are the ones who would be invovled in the religious part of a marriage ceremony between two believers of your country's nationality, who were marrying here in Switzerland. As such, they may happen to know what kind of paperwork those newly-weds needed, from "back home", to qualify to get married in Switzerland.

Last edited by doropfiz; 09.07.2019 at 21:24. Reason: typo
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Old 09.07.2019, 20:03
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Re: Problem with the procedure of documents for marriage. Swiss-Non EU

My advices:
1. You can send an email to swiss embassy in your home country with attached scanned letter of État civil , asking them 'what should i do?' if this is the only civil status document available in your home country,
2. Some swiss embassies mentione in their marriage preparation instruction list that if someone can not provide civil status document from your home country, he/she may provide an Affidavit done by notary stating your civil status.
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Old 09.07.2019, 20:26
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Re: Problem with the procedure of documents for marriage. Swiss-Non EU

Thank you so much for all your replies!!!! 🙏🏻 So, this afternoon my fiancé called again to état civil to say what my country told us. And the girl said that she had a copy of our letter and was not very sure, if what they are asking for is not a document that I have never been married and I am not divorced or that I am not a widow. She said that her colleague, who has sent us the letter that we got, will call us tomorrow. So we are waiting for tomorrow...
Although, a document about not being divorced is not mentioned in the list of required documents, does it make sense?
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Old 09.07.2019, 21:16
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Re: Problem with the procedure of documents for marriage. Swiss-Non EU

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Thank you so much for all your replies!!!! 🙏🏻 So, this afternoon my fiancé called again to état civil to say what my country told us. And the girl said that she had a copy of our letter and was not very sure, if what they are asking for is not a document that I have never been married and I am not divorced or that I am not a widow. She said that her colleague, who has sent us the letter that we got, will call us tomorrow. So we are waiting for tomorrow...
Although, a document about not being divorced is not mentioned in the list of required documents, does it make sense?
They also want to know if you ever have been married/divorced, and if so they want to see papers that the divorce has happened in a way that the Swiss are happy with. Your country can say it is a valid divorce, if the Swiss disagree they will not recognise the divorce and treat that previous marriage as still being valid. (been there, done that)

You have never been married or in a registered partnership before, so should not really be a problem.
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Old 10.07.2019, 15:33
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Re: Problem with the procedure of documents for marriage. Swiss-Non EU

Thank you guys! I will let you know how it all goes :-) maybe will be helpful for someone else.
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Old 10.07.2019, 15:43
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Re: Problem with the procedure of documents for marriage. Swiss-Non EU

Hope your story will be a shorter and cheaper one than mine

All the best.
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Old 31.07.2019, 10:57
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Re: Problem with the procedure of documents for marriage. Swiss-Non EU

Hi guys! As I have promised, I am keeping you updated :-) so, we have tried to contact the authorities , explaining that in my home country there is not such a thing as registered relationship and etc. We were very lucky as we could talk to some people who work there ( so we didn’t need a lawyer) . After one month of waiting, they have accepted and called is for the meeting to fix details about our wedding ;-)

The conclusion ( once again the same) : 1.everything in Switzerland depends from the Canton.
2. Never give up on trying to reach and communicate with people who work on your case.

Have a beautiful day everyone and thanks to the creators of this forume! It helps me on everyday basis with thons of informations :-D
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