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Old 17.07.2019, 20:59
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Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

what exactly are my options if i have a friend whos a resident in Switzerland. im not planning on getting a job. i cant cause of my spine and i work online anyways for my self. im not rich
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Old 17.07.2019, 22:36
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

You should do some googling first to see that's quite difficult to move to Switzerland. You should have some reason to be here. like have a job here, spouse here, go to school here.. something along those lines otherwise you can only visit for 90 days year.
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Old 17.07.2019, 22:38
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

then i guess ill have to marry her. im going to look into it.
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Old 17.07.2019, 22:43
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

Short answer is impossible since you're not rich enough.

Long answer what do you expect to get out of moving? Nice attitude of "I guess I'll have to marry her". If you think you'll escape the US by moving forget it, Americans carry their taint with them as far as banks are concerned and you'd still be obliged to file US tax returns no matter where you live in the world.
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Old 17.07.2019, 22:53
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

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Short answer is impossible since you're not rich enough.

Long answer what do you expect to get out of moving? Nice attitude of "I guess I'll have to marry her". If you think you'll escape the US by moving forget it, Americans carry their taint with them as far as banks are concerned and you'd still be obliged to file US tax returns no matter where you live in the world.
i dont expect anything but i know i hate the usa and i know no one here but i do have a good friend there. could care less about money really, not everyone lives their lives based around greed. sorry if i come across as mean
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Old 17.07.2019, 23:09
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

This is what any employer would have to do to be able to hire you.

https://www.sem.admin.ch/sem/en/home...zulassung.html

As for marriage, she would have to show the place she lives in is big enough for both of you and that she can support you financially since the Swiss will consider you her dependent. Also, not sure if this applies to people marrying Swiss nationals (I assume that's what she is), but you may need to have some language proficiency in a Swiss language. This was part of the new family reunification rules brought in this year for non-Swiss spouses, i.e. EU or non-EU nationals living here and wanting to bring family/get married.
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Old 17.07.2019, 23:13
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

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This is what any employer would have to do to be able to hire you.

https://www.sem.admin.ch/sem/en/home...zulassung.html

As for marriage, she would have to show the place she lives in is big enough for both of you and that she can support you financially since the Swiss will consider you her dependent. Also, not sure if this applies to people marrying Swiss nationals (I assume that's what she is), but you may need to have some language proficiency in a Swiss language. This was part of the new family reunification rules brought in this year for non-Swiss spouses, i.e. EU or non-EU nationals living here and wanting to bring family/get married.
that doesnt sound too bad, all i know she was born in japan but moved to Switzerland maybe around 10 years ago. ill have to talk to her about it. i appreciate the help
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Old 17.07.2019, 23:29
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

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You should do some googling first to see that's quite difficult to move to Switzerland. You should have some reason to be here. like have a job here, spouse here, go to school here.. something along those lines otherwise you can only visit for 90 days year.
Or just drink beer ,this is what I tell the US border guard
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Old 17.07.2019, 23:34
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

Well, there's some info here

https://www.ch.ch/en/marriage/

https://www.ch.ch/en/family-reunification/

The second assumes she hasn't acquired Swiss nationality in the meantime.
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Old 17.07.2019, 23:38
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

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i dont expect anything but i know i hate the usa and i know no one here but i do have a good friend there. could care less about money really, not everyone lives their lives based around greed. sorry if i come across as mean
It not a question of your attitude to money... it is a question of weather or not you have sufficient funds to cover your costs now and in the future. And those cost levels are set by the authorities not by you.
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Old 18.07.2019, 12:23
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

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that doesnt sound too bad, all i know she was born in japan but moved to Switzerland maybe around 10 years ago. ill have to talk to her about it. i appreciate the help
Are you for real? Just because she's a "good friend" doesn't mean she's willing to marry you and take financial responsibility for you. Plus the authorities are always watching out for sham marriages, which is exactly what this would be.

What makes you think Switzerland is the place you want to be? Have you been here on vacation? I can assure you daily life isn't the same as a nice holiday. Do you speak any of the local languages (French, German, Italian)?
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Old 18.07.2019, 17:34
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

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Are you for real? Just because she's a "good friend" doesn't mean she's willing to marry you and take financial responsibility for you. Plus the authorities are always watching out for sham marriages, which is exactly what this would be.

What makes you think Switzerland is the place you want to be? Have you been here on vacation? I can assure you daily life isn't the same as a nice holiday. Do you speak any of the local languages (French, German, Italian)?
you wouldnt understand it if i tried explaining it. to say very little ive hardly lived much. i havent been there. ive suffered most my life and grew up in flint, mi. anywhere is better than here trust me. i only speak english for now.
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Old 18.07.2019, 18:01
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

Like I said originally, moving to Switzerland is truly quite difficult. It may appear to one when reading about it, seeing pictures of it, that it looks great on the surface. To live here day to day is different though. It is one of the most difficult places in the world to move to and live long-term, become a citizen of, etc...

It's nearly impossible to find a job here as Non-EU foreigner unless you have some highly regarded education and specialized skills and the cost of living is similar to say New York city or L.A. if you live frugally.

Flint, Michigan has been a rough place to live for years, I think anyone who has been there could relate to what you are saying. Maybe a better option would be to consider moving from there to a location in the USA that is better for yourself.

Last edited by Sonnenbrand; 18.07.2019 at 18:14.
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Old 18.07.2019, 20:48
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

I think Sonnenbrand makes some good points.

As a citizen of the USA, you can visit Switzerland on holiday.

To settle here, however, you will need to have your own permit. Here's an overview, for EU/EFTA citizens, and for others:
https://www.ch.ch/en/renewal-overvie...idence-permit/

and here's information on staying in Switzerland while not working:
https://www.ch.ch/en/retirement-or-study-switzerland/ (scroll down to "Third-country nationals).
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Old 23.07.2019, 05:14
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

im not getting anywhere, the info people shared hasnt helped. i dont know who to email to figure this out. shes a citizen in Switzerland, is it possible to marry her and move there permanently? not just that how exactly. and again theres not a chance i can get a job with this body.
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Old 23.07.2019, 06:34
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

Although your questions sound a bit odd, I'm just going to assume you are completely genuine. You live in a place you really dislike, and you are not well enough to earn your own living. You have a friend in Switzerland and you and she might have enough of a relationship to get married. And you would like to understand the steps that that would involve.

First of all, as 3Wishes wrote in post 11 above, the authorities are hypersensitive to fake marriages. They investigate how long you and she have had contact, ask how you met, and want to see proof of the relationship having endured over time.

As proof, one can present evidence such as mails, text messages, letters, tickets of planes or shows or concerts you attended together, registrations for any courses you attended simultaneouly, stamps in passports from visits to each other, photos of times shared together, letters or photos showing how you each met the family or friends of the other, in either country or in a third country. The authorities may decide to test whether each partner can explain the work, health, education, hobbies, interests, preferences and home situation of the other, and talk about gifts given and received, and activities that the couple has shared, and current life-planning discussions.

For legal, ethical and financial reasons, it is highly unadvisable to construct this body of evidence as a sham.

If, however, your relationship with the Swiss woman is genuinely developing, such that there is a real chance of your and her marrying and building a shared life together, then by all means, it can become possible for you to live here with her, as her spouse.

For this to become possible, you and she will have to prove a number of things (besides, of course, that the relationship has been developed and sustained for a significant period of time, with a real connection, as explained above).
  1. Your friend will have to show that she is either independently wealthy, or that she currently earns enough every month, in a steady job that is likely to continue, to provide for her own needs, and to fully support you, on a permanent basis. The reason for that requirement is that the Swiss government (like any other) seeks to try to avoid allowing people to come and settle here who might later need support from any kind of Social Security. The amount that will count as sufficient is defined by the Government, I think it is that of the Canton in which the Swiss person lives.

  2. Your friend will have to own or rent (most people in Switzerland rent) a home which is large enough for both of you to live in. How large is enough? That, too, is defined by the Government, so that it is not allowed for two people to claim to be super-modest and ready to live together in a shoe-box. The reason for this is similar to point 1. above: a new couple who lives together in tiny premises is more likely to get on each other's nerves, and split up, than those who have at least a second room and more space to breathe, and remember, what they're looking for is the likelihood that you will be staying together and will not become at risk of needing Government funding, especially since divorce would mean the extra expense of two households, which your wife might not be able to sustain. Therefore, she will be required to prove that she lives in a large enough space into which you could move and live with her.

  3. You will have to demonstrate that you have already started learning the local language of the region in which she lives (German, French, Italian or Rätoromanisch). The reason for this, too, is that you are more likely to integrate with the local language than without it, and the higher the level of your integration the greater the chance that your marriage would not come under strain by your being, say, wholly dependent on your spouse for everyday matters like shopping and visits to the doctor. Also, it is polite towards the locals to be able to communicate with them in their own language. And you will be stronger and more settled for being able to read and understand your own correspondence from the Government, your landlord and the medical insurance company, and so on.

When you and your fiancée have got all the papers and proof assembled, then she can apply to her local authority for permission to have you come and live with her, since you envisage marriage. If, after the immigration authorities have scrutinies all the documentation, they believe that you and she will be entering a real marriage, in which you and she will not be in financial danger, you will be issued with a Visa D. This is the paper that allows you to enter Switzerland for more than 90 days, to stay with her (or elsewhere in Switzerland at her expense) for the purpose of your and her preparing for the marriage. Then, once you are actually here and things are moving ahead for real, you will be issed with a Permit B, which allows you to settle in and marry and live with your wife.

I hope that explanation helps you understand a bit more about how the system works here.

Here is another recent thread about someone moving from South Africa.
https://www.englishforum.ch/permits-...-b-holder.html
As far as Visa D goes, and marriage to someone living in Switzerland, the USA and South Africa are in the same category, i.e. non-Swiss, non-EU, non-EFTA, so-called "third country nationals". So that thread might give you an idea of some of what such an application involves.

Last edited by doropfiz; 23.07.2019 at 06:48.
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Old 23.07.2019, 06:46
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

whats a significant period of time? how hard is it to just get a visa in the meantime while the relationship builds?
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Old 23.07.2019, 06:54
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

I think the period of time is significant if there is copious evidence of interactions in many different areas of life, ongoing. Not just a month or three. The point is that the relationship must be well-rounded, encompassing all aspects of life together, and knowing each other's single lives well, and showing how the two lives are converging to become permanently shared. In the other thread to which I linked, the woman knows her fiancé's son, for example, and speaks to him in German.

I think that getting a D Visa for the purpose of building the relationship is probably impossible. This is because a D Visa is for a specific longer-than-90-days purpose, such as coming here to get married.

However, entering Switzerland for less than 3 months is very easy for a citizen of the USA who can simply come here as a tourist on holiday. In that case, it is clear from the start that you'd just be visiting, and returning to your home in the USA when your holiday here is over. I'm not sure whether or not USA citizens are required to prove that they have enough money to support themselves during their holiday.

EDIT: here's a link about the documents for entering Switzerland as a USA citizen.
https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/switzerland-visa/us/
and here about the financial requirements:
https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/sch...s-subsistence/

Last edited by doropfiz; 23.07.2019 at 07:30. Reason: grammar
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Old 23.07.2019, 08:42
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

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whats a significant period of time? how hard is it to just get a visa in the meantime while the relationship builds?
The authorities will be looking for a long term relationship of several years standing before they consider a visa/permit for marriage.

As said you don't need a visa to visit - which is all you could do. You won't be able to get anything for a longer period than 3 months unless she meets the same requirements as for marriage to apply for a concubine permit for you. However, not all cantons issue this type of permit.

Also note that the 3 month rule is 90 days in, then 90 days out. So you could visit from say September to December, assuming you can support yourself financially, then you couldn't return until April of the next year at the earliest. There is a calculator here to help you work out when you'd have to leave and when you could come back.

https://www.sem.admin.ch/sem/en/home...tsrechner.html

More on requirements for short stay visits.

https://www.sem.admin.ch/sem/en/home...ttstaaten.html

As for supporting yourself while you're here, you'd probably need to show you have at least CHF9,000 (CHF100 per day) available for a 90 day stay.

Edit: Another thing to consider is that if the marriage breaks down, it's unlikely you'd be able to stay here.

https://www.ch.ch/en/right-to-reside...th-or-divorce/

Also bear in mind that banking here isn't easy for Americans, a basic checking account is probably the most you'll get. So if you're thinking of running a business here then you're unlikely to be able to get a business account. Plus your continuing US tax filing obligations.

https://www.irs.gov/individuals/inte...-living-abroad

Last edited by Medea Fleecestealer; 23.07.2019 at 09:45. Reason: Added more info and links
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Old 23.07.2019, 10:55
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Re: Moving to Switzerland from USA, without working

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im not getting anywhere, the info people shared hasnt helped. i dont know who to email to figure this out. shes a citizen in Switzerland, is it possible to marry her and move there permanently? not just that how exactly. and again theres not a chance i can get a job with this body.
People are trying to help you see that what you want might not be possible, or at the very least will be difficult.

You didn't answer my question about your language skills. Switzerland sounds great on the surface, but if you don't have a job, don't speak the local language, and physically have trouble getting around, it can be very difficult to get your start here.

It can be hard to make friends. It can be a challenge to navigate the bureaucracy of paperwork. It can be frustrating to try and find doctors and nurses that speak enough English to where you understand what is going on.

We've seen many people join our Forum who came here with stars in their eyes. Some found it amazing and settled right in. Others soon found it isolating, lonely, depressing, overwhelming, etc. It can put a strain on the relationship, as the one who does speak the language has to translate everything and handle all the paperwork. The one who is already here is often the only social "circle" for some time until the new one gets out and about.

Be aware that even if your friend is Swiss (which I doubt is the case given your timeline above), marrying her does not grant you Swiss citizenship. At best, you receive a B permit that is renewable each year for up to 5 years. Each year, both of you must sign that you're still married, still living together, and in a stable relationship with no plans to separate or divorce.

What I'm saying is, don't rush into a marriage proposal thinking it's going to fix everything in your life. Marriage, moving countries, learning a new language, that's all stressful stuff.
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