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Old 21.12.2019, 08:37
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Re: Trying again - can I get family reunification as the father of a swiss child

Possibly the below are relevant ideas:

1. US Citizens, who plan to become self-employed, have special preferences for Germany and the Netherlands:

a. Germany: a US Citizen can move to Germany without a visa and register within 90 days as self-employed. This is described at this link:

https://www.germany.info/blob/179460...ancer-data.pdf

b. Netherlands: under the Dutch American Friendship Treaty (DAFT), US Citizens can establish businesses/ become self-employed. See this link:

https://daftvisa.wordpress.com/step-by-step-guide/

2. Young Professionals Traineeships in Switzerland:

a. US Citizens can apply for "young professional" traineeships up to age 35. See this link:

https://www.sem.admin.ch/sem/en/home...praktikum.html

3. Austria Red-White-Red Card: according to a newspaper article several years ago, Americans have been one of the top users of the special Red-White-Red Card for permanent immigration to Austria. See this link:

https://www.migration.gv.at/en/types...t-immigration/

4. EU citizenship by heritage: a number of EU countries offer their citizenship to non-citizens through heritage. See this link but also search the internet for other links:

https://traveltips.usatoday.com/eu-p...ge-107398.html


Added:
This Swiss binational.ch website contains a lot of information and could be of use:

http://binational.ch/en/?Residency__..._reunification
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  #22  
Old 21.12.2019, 09:40
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Re: Trying again - can I get family reunification as the father of a swiss child

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Germany can’t change an EU directives unilaterally and they are not, all they are doing is changing over to the Eurostat method which will bring them into line with most of the other states plus Switzerland. In the end it will make very little difference on the round for third country citizens.
They do not have to change the directive, a directive aims for a goal, but does not tell the member states how to achieve this, if it would do so it would be a regulation. And there is no doubt that the EU fails to provide enough people in a whole bunch of professions. Germany needs over a million of professionals, since there is no doubt that the EU cannot provide them it is just plain stupid that companies must first take the time and expenses to look within the EU only resulting in cannibalising on other countries. (Like Switzerland for example does with Dutch Health-Care workers, to name a simple example)

https://www.deutschland.de/de/topic/...in-deutschland

Also the EU itself has lists of how many EU members report shortage in specific fields, so if wanted they can just use those lists to decide for which professions it becomes easier.
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Old 22.12.2019, 00:40
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Pretty much the same as why does it makes sense for the government to give a person who has not bothered to learn the language, doe not seem to have any highly marketable skills otherwise they'd already have obtained a permit, and who's dependants are already on state aid... basically you are more likely to be a burden on the state.....



You've had at least three years to learn the language... being able to speak the language would dramatically improve your chances of obtaining a job and would aid your case for a permit with the authorities, so why not start on that????

I would gladly clean toilets to stay here if I was legally allowed to do so. And I do have marketable skills, I just can't claim to be better than ANYONE IN THE EU, and force a place looking for an employee like me to delay fulfilling the position for 6 months while they do the mandatory search. which is what I would have to do to get a work visa here.

I already speak German. There are no courses in Swiss German. maybe intentionally so.

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They do not have to change the directive, a directive aims for a goal, but does not tell the member states how to achieve this, if it would do so it would be a regulation. And there is no doubt that the EU fails to provide enough people in a whole bunch of professions. Germany needs over a million of professionals, since there is no doubt that the EU cannot provide them it is just plain stupid that companies must first take the time and expenses to look within the EU only resulting in cannibalising on other countries. (Like Switzerland for example does with Dutch Health-Care workers, to name a simple example)

https://www.deutschland.de/de/topic/...in-deutschland

Also the EU itself has lists of how many EU members report shortage in specific fields, so if wanted they can just use those lists to decide for which professions it becomes easier.
This is incredibly helpful, thank you

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a) because she is Swiss and you're not.


Why was your EU visa revoked in the first place? That may also have a bearing on any job/study possibilities here.
I was previously married to another woman, and my visa was revoked when we seperated.

That link says the following:

Derogations from the admission requirements
(Art. 30 FNIA)

In certain cases, certain legally regulated exceptions from the admission requirements are possible. The following overview is not exhaustive, but represents the most frequent cases:
Family members
"Family members of Swiss nationals and those holding residence permits do not need to go through an additional permit process to become self-employed or take up employment."

Since I am the family member of my 4 year old swiss son, does this not apply?

Last edited by 3Wishes; 05.01.2020 at 21:21. Reason: merging consecutive replies
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  #24  
Old 22.12.2019, 09:02
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Re: Trying again - can I get family reunification as the father of a swiss child

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That link says the following:

Derogations from the admission requirements
(Art. 30 FNIA)

In certain cases, certain legally regulated exceptions from the admission requirements are possible. The following overview is not exhaustive, but represents the most frequent cases:
Family members
"Family members of Swiss nationals and those holding residence permits do not need to go through an additional permit process to become self-employed or take up employment."

Since I am the family member of my 4 year old swiss son, does this not apply?
That is referring to people who already have permits under family reunification. All it means is that they don't have to ask permission to take up employment. They can simply take their employment contract to their commune/gemeinde and tell them they'll now be working instead of having to go through the non-EU hiring rules to be employed. It has it's downside in that should a marriage break down, the employer would have to go through the non-EU hiring process to get said family member a new independent permit instead of the family reunification one.
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Old 22.12.2019, 14:18
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Re: Trying again - can I get family reunification as the father of a swiss child

Yes, exactly as Medea said. "Already have permits under family reunification" means that their Swiss national family member (in your case your 4-year-old Swiss son) is already supporting them. See post 2 above. https://www.englishforum.ch/3131662-post2.html

So no, it does not apply to you, sadly.
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  #26  
Old 22.12.2019, 14:47
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Re: Trying again - can I get family reunification as the father of a swiss child

If I were in your position, I think I would try to take one of the following three paths.

OPTION 1
  1. Focus all my energy on what is likely to improve my chances of getting to Switzerland, and try to expend as little energy as possible railing against the Swiss system (as understandably annoying as you find it).
  2. Keep up your German, and work diligently to improve it.
  3. Find out what it will take to ensure that your permit to stay in Turkey is renewed for the max time possible, and fulfil those requirements (so you don't have to worry about having to leave Turkey. And also so that you don't ever risk being anywhere illegally, because having been illegal will pretty much preclude you from ever getting a permit to stay in Switzerland or an EU country).
  4. Find out what it would take to get permanent residence in Turkey (so you can breathe more freely, having a secure base).
  5. If you haven't already done so (but I presume you have) reduce your living costs in Turkey to the minumum.
  6. Research each and every EU country thoroughly to find out about the requirements to enter the country, to work there, to get permanent residence and to naturalise, in some years from now.
  7. Choose the most advantageous four or five and research which kinds of skills they need.
  8. While you are in Turkey (or back in the US, if you have had to leave Turkey to avoid being illegal) train/study/learn/practice to become one of those needed people.
  9. Apply to zillions of jobs.
  10. Build up a network by becoming known on local fora, per country, specifically dealing with those "needed" professions and skills. Become the interested, interesting, helpful contributor that anyone would like to have as their working colleague. Through that, try to build up personal connections, in addition to the annonymity of fora.
  11. Join couchsurfing (it's free) and put thought into your profile, and host people where you stay now (no matter how humble, as long as you are allowed to do so) or at least meet travellers for coffee. Collect good references. Go couchsurfing locally to where you live now in Turkey. Collect more good references. Be shown to be the kind, helpful person that any other host would like to have come and stay with them for a few days. Practice cooking a few good meals so you can contribute whenever you are hosted.
  12. Work through your budget, and see whether you can make it to visit your son in Switzerland (perhaps more do-able if you can couchsurf for at least some days or weeks at various people's homes, or in exchange for helping them with something) AND ALSO to visit some of your fora contacts in EU countries, especially any who think their employers might be hiring, and there, too, keep your costs down by couchsurfing.
  13. Tell everyone you know, including your couchsurfing hosts, that you are looking for work, and of all the skills you have.
  14. Keep good documentation of everything.
I think that going that route would probably take you several years to get into the EU, and then you can clock up the 5 or so years it takes to become a cititzen. During that time, you can visit your son and, when he is older, perhaps his mother will let him visit you.


OPTION 2
The alternative is to go back to the USA, to become super high-qualified in a niche Switzerland needs, and apply for a job. After all, many non-EU people do, in fact, get permits to work here.


OPTION 3
The other route I see is for you to go back to the USA and build a full life there, and when you can be shown to be a solid, reliable, established kind of person, appeal to the Swiss authorities (if you have not already done so) to grant you specified, longer access to your child during school holidays, given that you will not be able to visit every second weekend.


Whichever of those routes (or others of which I may not have thought), maintain contact with your son, write him letters, send him photos, tell him you are working on ways to see him, but DO NOT tell him negative things about the Swiss permit system nor about his mother, nor how very hard it is for you to get to see him, nor how much you are sacrificing, etc. I think working 70 hours a week is no joke, so I acknowledge that. I just think your boy does not need to know that, because it won't contribute anything to his well-being. His well-being is served by staying with his mother and knowing that you are present in his heart, and love him, and that you live far away and are working, and that you save money so you can visit him. It may be hard for you to limit it to that (I don't know, though, maybe you already do) but I believe that's probably enough information for him.

Whichever way you go, it's going to be a long journey, and I wish you well!
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  #27  
Old 22.12.2019, 14:53
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Re: Trying again - can I get family reunification as the father of a swiss child

Just shows. If you're living abroad, don't stray, and do get married locally as soon as possible. Especially while you're on a B permit. Marriage brings rights. Dissolution of marriage removes those rights. It ain't just a piece of paper.

But it is a crappy situation and I hope you find a decent resolution.
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Old 22.12.2019, 21:08
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Re: Trying again - can I get family reunification as the father of a swiss child

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If I were in your position, I think I would try to take one of the following three paths.

OPTION 1
[*]Research each and every EU country thoroughly to find out about the requirements to enter the country, to work there, to get permanent residence and to naturalise, in some years from now.
I'd like to add something to Point 6 from my list above.
Also research each and every EU [personally relevant] country's rules about ancestral visas/permits, just in case you can document a close enough European ancestor and might be able to get in that way.

Last edited by doropfiz; 23.12.2019 at 05:49.
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Old 23.12.2019, 13:55
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Re: Trying again - can I get family reunification as the father of a swiss child

To the OP: have you looked into what some cantons offer as the concubine permit (this is assuming that you and the mother of your child are still a couple)? Also, have you thought about consulting a Swiss lawyer about your situation?
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  #30  
Old 23.12.2019, 14:54
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Re: Trying again - can I get family reunification as the father of a swiss child

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To the OP: have you looked into what some cantons offer as the concubine permit (this is assuming that you and the mother of your child are still a couple)? Also, have you thought about consulting a Swiss lawyer about your situation?
Not an option since the mother is on social aid - one of the conditions is that she would have to financially support him for 5 years. Plus the relationship has soured so she's unlikely to agree to that, even if she could afford it.

A lawyer would be a waste of money because there's nothing to be done apart from him finding a job or being able to study here. Being the father of a Swiss national grants no particular rights/privileges until the child is old enough to financially support him which is years away.
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Old 23.12.2019, 15:57
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Re: Trying again - can I get family reunification as the father of a swiss child

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Not an option since the mother is on social aid - one of the conditions is that she would have to financially support him for 5 years. Plus the relationship has soured so she's unlikely to agree to that, even if she could afford it. .
I donít think he said that this relationship has soured, just that marriage is not an option at the moment.
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Old 23.12.2019, 17:13
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Re: Trying again - can I get family reunification as the father of a swiss child

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I donít think he said that this relationship has soured, just that marriage is not an option at the moment.
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Thanks for that. The damage is done. 2 months alone with a toddler was all she needed to feel she could not rely on me at all. We broke up 2 months after my return, and I needed to leave a month after that.. And my child support payments are bare minimum due to this situation. If I manage to be able to stay at all, there wont be wedding bells in the future.
Doubt a concubine permit would be possible even if she was financially stable.
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  #33  
Old 24.12.2019, 02:36
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Re: Trying again - can I get family reunification as the father of a swiss child

Uhm maybe I missed it, but why exactly do you assume you cannot work in - as you claim - ANY EU country? Have you even tried? Unless you've literally been banned from Schengen for 5 years as a result of some massive misstep on your end, I can't see why you couldn't at least try, especially if you have marketable skills, as, again, you say. Plenty of non-EU/EFTAs working in the EU, and in Switzerland.

I also don't quite understand the "not getting married" option when that is of course the most obvious solution. Not meaning to make matters worse, but her argument against marriage seems a little thin. I would think if I genuinely wanted to be with the father of my child, I certainly would do everything to make that happen, including marriage (and I'm one of those who doesn't even want to get married - but even I would in this case).
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  #34  
Old 05.01.2020, 11:23
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Re: Trying again - can I get family reunification as the father of a swiss child

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Hi,

US citizen here in a tough spot. My 4 year old son is Swiss, his mother is Swiss, and I am not married to her. I had an EU visa which was revoked when he was just 7 months old and have been only able to be in Switzerland to be with him a total of 6 months a year. Luckily, his mother has periodically brought him to visit me in Turkey, where I have been parked while waiting to be able to re enter. I have gotten quite good at counting Shengen days.

Anyway, I am of course quite tired of the situation (imagine saving money in Istanbul to spend in Bern!) and despondent that there seemed to be no alternative since 1. there is no employment visa available unless a potential employer proves they spent 3 months advertising the position in Switzerland and found no suitable applicants, and another 3 months advertising the position in the entire EU, before they can even be allowed to hire me . . . 2. I my German isn't good enough to study at ANY school 3. marrying his mother is not an option (she seems to think my inability to be there consistently is both my problem alone and somehow my fault)

AND THEN, I noticed a thing available to Swiss permit holders called Family Reunification . . . in which a person who currently has a residence permit is able to bring their foreign children OR PARENTS to Switzerland and those people would get visas.

So, basically, my 4 year old, a Swiss citizen, cannot have his father here for longer than 6 months a year, but anyone from ANYWHERE outside Switzerland who has been approved for a residence permit can have theirs here all year long? Please someone explain to me how this makes ANY sense.

Sincerely,

Imaginary Lines kept me from seeing my baby's first steps

Why don't you enroll at university in an English speaking MA or BA program? It does not need to be in any of the 3 national languages.

As long as citizenship is concerned, you can search for European ancestors in your family, and apply for citizenship in that country.
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  #35  
Old 05.01.2020, 13:11
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Re: Trying again - can I get family reunification as the father of a swiss child

To avoid misconception in the future: student visas/permits for non-EUs are not granted with any less scrutiny than all the other permits.

Standard requirements include being under 30 years old, agreeing in writing to leave Switzerland upon completion of studies, not having previous degrees allowing entry into the professional world in oneís home country etc etc

Also there are no bachelor programs entirely taught in English (putting aside the fact that the 1st year is ruthlessly selective)
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