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Old 06.08.2020, 09:40
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Re: Frontalier moving to B permit to avoid the 24.9% working from home

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If an employee would be mainly and structurally be working from home now, in a country with a lower cost of living, then why not offer them a French contract? Could be an easy way for an employer to save cost and legal hassle.
It's not that straightforward. It would need the employer to have a physical and legal presence in France, dealing with payroll and all aspects of insurance, pensions, tax etc. etc.

I have a friend who was caught in a difficult situation a while ago, when her employer closed their Basel office and moved to Bern - she wasn't prepared to commute every day but she and they were happy for her to continue, working from her home in France. Sadly, after months of trying, they were unable to find and legal way of doing so, and in the end she had to leave the job entirely.
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  #22  
Old 06.08.2020, 16:28
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Re: Frontalier moving to B permit to avoid the 24.9% working from home

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If an employee would be mainly and structurally be working from home now, in a country with a lower cost of living, then why not offer them a French contract? Could be an easy way for an employer to save cost and legal hassle.
Isn't it also much harder to fire an employee under a French contract as opposed to a Swiss one?
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  #23  
Old 06.08.2020, 16:50
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Re: Frontalier moving to B permit to avoid the 24.9% working from home

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It's not that straightforward. It would need the employer to have a physical and legal presence in France, dealing with payroll and all aspects of insurance, pensions, tax etc. etc.

I have a friend who was caught in a difficult situation a while ago, when her employer closed their Basel office and moved to Bern - she wasn't prepared to commute every day but she and they were happy for her to continue, working from her home in France. Sadly, after months of trying, they were unable to find and legal way of doing so, and in the end she had to leave the job entirely.
what about work remotely from a starbucks in basel....
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Old 06.08.2020, 16:54
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Re: Frontalier moving to B permit to avoid the 24.9% working from home

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Isn't it also much harder to fire an employee under a French contract as opposed to a Swiss one?
Yes, it's a whole different ballgame, and unsurprisingly most smaller Swiss companies wouldn't even think about setting up a French entity just for that purpose. The overheads would be enormous.
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Old 06.08.2020, 16:55
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Re: Frontalier moving to B permit to avoid the 24.9% working from home

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what about work remotely from a starbucks in basel....
What, and popping home every couple of hours for a decent cup of coffee?
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Old 06.08.2020, 21:33
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Re: Frontalier moving to B permit to avoid the 24.9% working from home

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If an employee would be mainly and structurally be working from home now, in a country with a lower cost of living, then why not offer them a French contract? Could be an easy way for an employer to save cost and legal hassle.
This is completely wrong - The Swiss residing areas in France or Germany do not vary too much from the Swiss cost of leaving.
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Old 07.08.2020, 11:19
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Re: Frontalier moving to B permit to avoid the 24.9% working from home

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This is completely wrong - The Swiss residing areas in France or Germany do not vary too much from the Swiss cost of leaving.
No, it's not completely wrong. Cost of living is very much lower in France and Germany than in Switzerland. Sure, the areas immediately next to the border have inflated housing prices, but if you go about ten km west into France they drop sharply, and I assume going NE into Germany would not be too dissimilar.

Now taxation is another matter, and may indeed be higher, depending on your family circumstances, but I always understood that with children it can actually be lower overall in France than CH, with significant tax breaks available, Not sure about Germany though.
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Old 07.08.2020, 11:35
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Re: Frontalier moving to B permit to avoid the 24.9% working from home

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Frontaliers aren't allowed to work from home, i.e. not in Switzerland, more than 25% (I know of the rule in theory, but I'm assuming the actual number from the OP), but it's been relaxed during the Covid period.
Just to be clear, I understand its not a prohibition per se but acts as one due to financial/social charges. It is apparently an EU régulation whereby if you remain 25% or more in home country then you would be subject to, in this case, French social system and charges, not Swiss ones, as you wouldn't be cross border worker. This is financially prohibitive for the employer and the employee. During Covid, EU apparently suspended this regulation, and it hasn't been put back yet, but hence the anxiety when it does. It wasn't meant to regulate work at home, but de facto does for EU cross border workers.
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Old 20.08.2020, 11:53
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Re: Frontalier moving to B permit to avoid the 24.9% working from home

Fyi, I was just reading that France extended the measures to allow unlimited tele working until end of December 2020. That should give our frontaliers some more breathing space.

https://lequotidien.lu/slider-une/te...quen-decembre/
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Old 20.08.2020, 13:23
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Re: Frontalier moving to B permit to avoid the 24.9% working from home

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Thanks HickvonFrick, I understand it is not so Legal but I am not so sure that the French will be able to trace?
You work under the assumptions that the Swiss commune won't care and would be ever so happy to take your taxes regardless if you actually live there. You are wrong.


PS: There is a difference between to leave/leaving and to live/living.
to leave means to go away from a place or location.
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Old 20.08.2020, 13:52
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Re: Frontalier moving to B permit to avoid the 24.9% working from home

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Fyi, I was just reading that France extended the measures to allow unlimited tele working until end of December 2020. That should give our frontaliers some more breathing space.

https://lequotidien.lu/slider-une/te...quen-decembre/
Yes, Basel employers announced that internally some time ago, so I assumed they were working within agreed protocols.
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  #32  
Old 20.08.2020, 14:13
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Re: Frontalier moving to B permit to avoid the 24.9% working from home

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Isn't it also much harder to fire an employee under a French contract as opposed to a Swiss one?
In addition French social costs to the employer are huge, unless the salary cut is close to 40% the company will end up paying more for his services.
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