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Old 10.08.2020, 20:53
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RAV and 2nd pillar link?

Dear EF’ers, have a great evening.

It may sound obvious, but I wanted to double check with you if there is a ling between unemployment payment and 2nd pillar ?

I mean, if we register to RAV and start getting unemployment payment, will this have an impact on my 2nd pillar, which I may get when in the future I deregister from CH and move back to my home country? I am non EF and non EFTA, and I am eligible to move the 2nd pillar savings when I leave CH eventually.

Thanks for your input.
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Old 10.08.2020, 21:15
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Re: RAV and 2nd pillar link?

Once exited the previous employment and registered on RAV, your 2nd Pillar will be parked in the vested benefits foundation or account in chosen location. If you plan to leave Switzerland, you can move your pension abroad subject to taxation in Switzerland.
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Old 10.08.2020, 21:31
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Re: RAV and 2nd pillar link?

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Once exited the previous employment and registered on RAV, your 2nd Pillar will be parked in the vested benefits foundation or account in chosen location. If you plan to leave Switzerland, you can move your pension abroad subject to taxation in Switzerland.
Thanks a lot for your comment. So this means that I will not lose my rights on this saving once I get RAV funds, and still move it back fully ( minus the withholding tax )?
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Old 10.08.2020, 21:47
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Re: RAV and 2nd pillar link?

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Thanks a lot for your comment. So this means that I will not lose my rights on this saving once I get RAV funds, and still move it back fully ( minus the withholding tax )?
You can access your pension at minimum age of 55 y/o therefore either leave it in CH and get it in due retirement age, otherwise it can be also moved to your country.

You will never lose the accumulated pension. Here is a short description of the 2nd pillar:

https://thepoorswiss.com/second-pill...t-switzerland/
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Old 10.08.2020, 21:51
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Re: RAV and 2nd pillar link?

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You can access your pension at minimum age of 55 y/o therefore either leave it in CH and get it in due retirement age, otherwise it can be also moved to your country.

You will never lose the accumulated pension.
thanks a lot, if I leave CH permanently, I don't need to wait till 55 years of age to move the funds back to my home country, which is non EU/EFTA, correct?

Again, thanks a lot for your help...
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Old 10.08.2020, 21:53
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Re: RAV and 2nd pillar link?

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thanks a lot, if I leave CH permanently, I don't need to wait till 55 years of age to move the funds back to my home country, which is non EU/EFTA, correct?

Again, thanks a lot for your help...
Yes. Be careful though cashing your 2nd pillar and taxes. You would want to do it in the canton with minimum tax.
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Old 11.08.2020, 08:03
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Re: RAV and 2nd pillar link?

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Yes. Be careful though cashing your 2nd pillar and taxes. You would want to do it in the canton with minimum tax.
That very much depends of the tax treatment in the new country of residence as the Swiss tax is withholding tax which can be reclaimed if the pension becomes taxable somewhere else.
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Old 11.08.2020, 08:23
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Re: RAV and 2nd pillar link?

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Yes. Be careful though cashing your 2nd pillar and taxes. You would want to do it in the canton with minimum tax.
Yes this and if you cash in after you left, the determining canton of taxation is where the institution that holds your funds has its registration. Choose Schwyz for the lower possible taxation of the second pillar.
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Old 11.08.2020, 08:35
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Re: RAV and 2nd pillar link?

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Yes this and if you cash in after you left, the determining canton of taxation is where the institution that holds your funds has its registration. Choose Schwyz for the lower possible taxation of the second pillar.
The cheapest canton is not always Schwyz as it depends on the fund size, the cost of moving is also important along with time delay.

As I mentioned in my previous post, the taxation position in your new country of residence is key as the level of Swiss taxation may be irrelevant & fully refundable so transferring to a lower tax canton is just wasting money.
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Old 11.08.2020, 21:32
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Re: RAV and 2nd pillar link?

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The cheapest canton is not always Schwyz as it depends on the fund size, the cost of moving is also important along with time delay.

As I mentioned in my previous post, the taxation position in your new country of residence is key as the level of Swiss taxation may be irrelevant & fully refundable so transferring to a lower tax canton is just wasting money.
"Maybe" is key here - I still think it's important to know that you are taxed not based on your last kanton of residence, or the branche where you open your account, but where the institution legally sits.

Which are the countries that would tax your second pillar and hence make the taxation in Switzerland "irrelevant"?
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Old 11.08.2020, 22:01
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Re: RAV and 2nd pillar link?

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"Maybe" is key here - I still think it's important to know that you are taxed not based on your last kanton of residence, or the branche where you open your account, but where the institution legally sits.

Which are the countries that would tax your second pillar and hence make the taxation in Switzerland "irrelevant"?
You will likely be taxed in the Jurisdiction where you live when you cash in the pension after leaving Switzerland, most jurisdictions tax you on worldwide income. The Swiss withholding tax is possibly irrelevant as it can be recovered 100% if taxable in your new place of residence after filling in a DTA form.

You are totally missing the taxation issue as you NO LONGER are tax resident in Switzerland, so Swiss rules are very likely irrelevant. Germany will, UK may, Malta would if remitted or if you pay normal taxation. Who won't is the more pertinent point.
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Old 11.08.2020, 22:01
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Re: RAV and 2nd pillar link?

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Which are the countries that would tax your second pillar and hence make the taxation in Switzerland "irrelevant"?
Amongst others it might be: Australia, China, Bulgaria, France, Israel, Peru, Cyprus, UK, Ireland, Japan, and South Korea.

Those are just the countries listed on Form Q-IS as they need special procedures. https://www.estv.admin.ch/dam/estv/d...IS_en_2017.pdf

In general it is any country with a double taxation treaty. For actual details see Rundschreiben 2-166 (also contains Form Q-IS in DE/FR/IT/EN).
https://www.estv.admin.ch/dam/estv/d...6-D-2019-d.pdf

See table on page 9. You can recover the Swiss tax on pillar 2 lumpsum payments if there is a "JA" in "Privatrechtliche Vorsorgeleistungen(Säule 2) - Kapitalleistung" column. (Interestingly, UK has a Nein. This either means a lump sum payment is not taxed in the UK, or it is also taxed and you can not recover the Swiss tax.)

Note: Taxable does not have to mean that you have to pay tax. The foreign applicable tax rate can be 0% and you could still recover the tax paid in Switzerland.
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