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-   -   Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon (https://www.englishforum.ch/permits-visas-government/300330-non-eu-b-permit-contract-ending-soon.html)

fronian 24.09.2020 23:17

Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
Hi there,

What happens to third-country nationals when their job contract ends along with their b-permit? There will be a small gap of 1 month between the current 80% and the next 20% teaching post (the intention is to find a fuller-time role). The b-permit will have to be renewed on the next position as it is attached to the job. I have a few questions.

- As a third-country national, can the chomage be applied for for that one month?

- There is a 3 day gap between the end of the current b-permit expiring and the next job, will this be an issue?

- I have heard that partial chomage can cover loss of salary when suffering from a decreased number of working hours. Can this still be applied for when taking on a new contract and new b-permit?

The intention, here, is to find a permanent well paid job but there will be a need for chomage for that one month and then partial chomage thereafter and I am confused about third-country national status and the b-permit's dates being attached to the employment.

AndersonMD 25.09.2020 13:05

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
You can get chomage if you are granted a permit to work, but you are not entitled to a permit to work without a job (or even with a job).

You will probably be denied a work permit for a 20% job, this is not seen as enough to survive on.

If you recently graduated from a Swiss university, you can get a 6 month job seekers permit, otherwise I think you just have to leave the country.

Your B permit is tied to your job as a non-EU, when your job is finished you are typically expected to leave the country and have no right to stay and look for new jobs.

Medea Fleecestealer 25.09.2020 13:58

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
What AndersonMD said. Your permit is likely tied to your employer/job and as such when it ends so does your permit and the right to live/work here. There is no right to stay and look for another job. Forget the supposed new job: a) they would need to apply for a new permit for you and prove why they can't find a Swiss/EU national instead and b) at 20% only there's no way a permit would be granted. You can't just change jobs here as a non-EU national unless you hold an open B permit or have a C permit.

SandyDown 25.09.2020 14:23

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
I find this is strange, am from the UK, and we soon will be non-EU Lol

So, if one as non EU have to leave soon after finishing a job, have no right to stay to look for another role, in this case, are they also obliged to pay the non-employment insurance? If so, how would they get their RAV payments they contributed to when they have no right to stay after their work is finished? would their payout be transferred to their own country?

AndersonMD 25.09.2020 14:32

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
No, just like medical insurance, you don't get it back just because you don't use it. RAV is an mandatory insurance you pay into, like health insurance, and is independent from you ability to live or work in Switzerland.

SandyDown 25.09.2020 15:11

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AndersonMD (Post 3220626)
No, just like medical insurance, you don't get it back just because you don't use it. RAV is an mandatory insurance you pay into, like health insurance, and is independent from you ability to live or work in Switzerland.

Not quite, I get medical insurance in case I get sick, If I do not get sick, I do not use it, if I am ill, the medical insurance pays out... Similarly, I get unemployment insurance in case I am unemployed, as long as I am employed I do not use it or need it, if I get unemployed, then the insurance should pay out...
But for the non EU it seems they pay for the insurance, but never ever get a chance to use it :eek::confused:

Medea Fleecestealer 25.09.2020 15:14

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SandyDown (Post 3220644)
Not quite, I get medical insurance in case I get sick, If I do not get sick, I do not use it, if I am ill, the medical insurance pays out... Similarly, I get unemployment insurance in case I am unemployed, as long as I am employed I do not use it or need it, if I get unemployed, then the insurance should pay out...
But for the non EU it seems they pay for the insurance, but never ever get a chance to use it :eek::confused:

Downside of being a non-EU without an open B or C permit.

SandyDown 25.09.2020 15:20

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Medea Fleecestealer (Post 3220651)
Downside of being a non-EU without an open B or C permit.

To be honest after 1.5 years in Switzerland, I am really really trying to be calm about ridiculous rules... but sorry how is that fair?? and and and why whenever someone (usually me) points out holes in rules, or unfairness in the rule all I get back from people is a shrug and : well this is the way it is here... why is no one outraged or feels this is sick :msnsick: and just bends over?

Moreover why can't I change and be like everyone else as its easier on the mental status !!

AndersonMD 25.09.2020 15:31

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SandyDown (Post 3220644)
Not quite, I get medical insurance in case I get sick, If I do not get sick, I do not use it, if I am ill, the medical insurance pays out... Similarly, I get unemployment insurance in case I am unemployed, as long as I am employed I do not use it or need it, if I get unemployed, then the insurance should pay out...
But for the non EU it seems they pay for the insurance, but never ever get a chance to use it :eek::confused:

If you get an open B or a C you get a chance to use it. It's not impossible. It's just not the case for a closed B.

qwertz 25.09.2020 15:43

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SandyDown (Post 3220656)
To be honest after 1.5 years in Switzerland, I am really really trying to be calm about ridiculous rules... but sorry how is that fair?? and and and why whenever someone (usually me) points out holes in rules, or unfairness in the rule all I get back from people is a shrug and : well this is the way it is here... why is no one outraged or feels this is sick :msnsick: and just bends over?

Moreover why can't I change and be like everyone else as its easier on the mental status !!

It’s the same in your country so I don’t understand the drama. Non-EUs (and probably non UK and Irish in the future) get a NO RECOURSE TO PUBLIC FUNDS stamp on their UK visas and they all pay into National Insurance and pay taxes.

fronian 26.09.2020 14:19

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
This seems strange since they university have given a job offer already...

Weird...

3Wishes 26.09.2020 14:29

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by fronian (Post 3220928)
This seems strange since they university have given a job offer already...

Weird...

The offer is contingent upon you receiving a permit. ;) As others have said, a 20% position isn't going to cut it long term. Have you been working in Switzerland/EU long enough to claim RAV benefits? Have you registered with RAV yet?

It's possible you're going to land in the chicken vs egg situation, which I've seen more than once here on EF. It goes a little like this - RAV says they'll only pay you if you have a valid permit. The authorities say they'll only give you a permit if RAV pays you.

fronian 26.09.2020 15:14

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
This sounds like it will be fun! And, yes, 3 years of continuous employment here while paying into unemployment insurance. The 20% is all they can offer... also, there is a joint income into the household.

The real question, here, is that if partial chomage will be an option since it's a change in contract (same employer, even same department) with a new b-permit attached to that contract. This is not a reduction in hours, this is a new job.

The intention, here, is to obviously find a supplementary job but this might not be instant. I guess we will see.

roegner 26.09.2020 15:16

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by fronian (Post 3220940)
This sounds like it will be fun! And, yes, 3 years of continuous employment here while paying into unemployment insurance. The 20% is all they can offer... also, there is a joint income into the household.

The real question, here, is that if partial chomage will be an option since it's a change in contract (same employer, even same department) with a new b-permit attached to that contract. This is not a reduction in hours, this is a new job.

The intention, here, is to obviously find a supplementary job but this might not be instant. I guess we will see.

As mentioned before, the question is whether you will get a new B permit with only 20% job.

Medea Fleecestealer 26.09.2020 17:20

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by fronian (Post 3220940)
This sounds like it will be fun! And, yes, 3 years of continuous employment here while paying into unemployment insurance. The 20% is all they can offer... also, there is a joint income into the household.

The real question, here, is that if partial chomage will be an option since it's a change in contract (same employer, even same department) with a new b-permit attached to that contract. This is not a reduction in hours, this is a new job.

The intention, here, is to obviously find a supplementary job but this might not be instant. I guess we will see.

Also, if the permit is still tied to the job, you may not be able to take a second post to make up the difference.

Landers 26.09.2020 19:06

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
Did you get notice for the end of your current contract? Usually a fixed-term contract becomes an implied unlimited contract after a certain time but it might be different in the case of tied permit holders.
If that is the case then it could be considered a change to the contract rather than a new one.

AndersonMD 28.09.2020 09:19

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by fronian (Post 3220940)
This sounds like it will be fun! And, yes, 3 years of continuous employment here while paying into unemployment insurance. The 20% is all they can offer... also, there is a joint income into the household.

The real question, here, is that if partial chomage will be an option since it's a change in contract (same employer, even same department) with a new b-permit attached to that contract. This is not a reduction in hours, this is a new job.

The intention, here, is to obviously find a supplementary job but this might not be instant. I guess we will see.

From this message it seems like you live with a partner? If so, you could probably get a family regroupement permit with the right to work. In this case, chomage would pay out for both the month you aren't working and 70% of the difference in your income between your 80% and 20% contracts.

I don't think you will be offered your own B permit to continue at a 20% job.

AndersonMD 28.09.2020 11:09

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
Also note, the RAV won't deal with you until you have a valid permit. So if you apply for a new permit but it takes several weeks or months to arrive you will not receive RAV until after your permit arrives, and are eligible to the backdated date of validity of the permit.

fronian 04.10.2020 15:43

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AndersonMD (Post 3221363)
From this message it seems like you live with a partner? If so, you could probably get a family regroupement permit with the right to work. In this case, chomage would pay out for both the month you aren't working and 70% of the difference in your income between your 80% and 20% contracts.

I don't think you will be offered your own B permit to continue at a 20% job.

Yes, recently moved in together but we are not married and it seems you can only get this if you are married, no?

3Wishes 04.10.2020 15:50

Re: Non-EU B permit - contract ending soon
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by fronian (Post 3223249)
Yes, recently moved in together but we are not married and it seems you can only get this if you are married, no?

Canton Vaud is one of the cantons that offers a concubine permit. This means you become your partner's dependent. I believe the requirements include proof of a long-term relationship and your partner proving sufficient financial means to support you so that you don't go on social help. Supposedly the partner signs to be financially responsible for you for 5 years, even if the relationship breaks down.

More info here:
https://www.vd.ch/themes/population/...s-du-concubin/


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