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Old 24.10.2020, 09:28
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Moving as expat - can keep residency and permit?

Dear all,
I read that if you move away from CH you can ask the permit C to be frozen for a few years. What if you don’t want that?
Can one move for work as an expat to a EU country but keep the Swiss permit and fiscal residency?
Pay taxes in the country of work, but as “main interests” and family stay in Switzerland, keep a base here, the permit on, and still do tax declaration in CH as well.
Thanks for your perspective
Eli
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Old 24.10.2020, 09:54
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Re: Moving as expat - can keep residency and permit?

It depends.

OH did that for a couple of years. His work took him first to the UK and then later to the US, but I stayed in Switzerland.

The catch: He was on assignment for his company. He continued to be paid out of the Swiss office.

It's do-able, but he ended up paying more tax. It wasn't so bad while he was working in the UK because he came home every F-M, so the total number of days fell under some threshold or other. There was something to pay, but it wasn't too painful.

The US assignment, on the other hand, was expensive. As Americans we already pay US federal tax so that was expected, but he also paid state tax, which in NYC is high.

He still came back to Switzerland twice a month, and I, the house, and the dogs and all the assorted bills were here, and of course we still paid Swiss taxes - so there was never a question of 'center of life'.

So in this case it was indeed do-able... it was just expensive.

Caveat: This was many years ago, I have no idea how or if rules have changed since then.
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Old 24.10.2020, 10:05
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Re: Moving as expat - can keep residency and permit?

Yes this is possible assuming you are EU/EFTA and the other country is EU/EFTA but you are expected to come back to CH at least every week and keep your centre of vital interests as you say (family, dog, cat, bird, plant) in CH.

Assuming you would work 100% of the time in the other country, you would pay income tax in the country of work (deducted by employer) and depending which country it is, pay for whatever the equivalent of health insurance is there and become exempt from KVG/LAMal here as you would be covered by your European health insurance card (issued by your work country) in CH. In order to get exemption and cancel your KVG/LAMal contract you need to contact your canton’s health insurance administration office and prove to them you will be working in a country signatory to freedom of movement (if the country in question is the UK, this is only valid until 31.12.2020) for them to issue an exemption document which you would show your health insurance company to cancel the contract.

In case working time is split between CH and the other country (for example some remote working in CH and some in the work country with a contract from a non-CH legal entity), then you would be taxable in CH and the work country as well. You would be deducted full tax in the work country and would need to show your work country’s tax authorities a certificate of residence from CH (your CH residence permit and a document from your canton’s tax office stating you are subject to tax there) to start the process of claiming part of the withheld tax back and subsequently pay it to your canton. In this scenario (part work performed in CH), no exemption of KVG/LAMal is allowed.

This situation is allowed for EU/EFTA citizens only regardless whether they have a C or B permit or no Swiss permit at all (i.e. an EU/EFTA citizen newly arriving in Switzerland may be issued a “working for a foreign company” B permit, assuming the salary is high enough to live in Switzerland and sufficient proof of centre of vital interests in CH is provided).
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Old 05.12.2020, 19:54
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Re: Moving as expat - can keep residency and permit?

Thank you both.
Everyone seem to have different perspective:
- my Health Insurance is not cancelling the contract so I will pay here and in the other country (which is EU)
- my office thinks that we need to freeze the permit even if I keep my fiscal residence and center of interest here
Do you know who could issue an "official" guidance, should i write to the Office of the Population of my canton?
Thanks
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Old 05.12.2020, 20:18
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Re: Moving as expat - can keep residency and permit?

Last time I checked your employer isn't the migration authority and cannot tell you what you can and cannot do re residency and should not be involved nor asked about this process. As a C permit holder you don't need to freeze anything. You just start working in the EU country, return to Switzerland on a weekly basis (this is the sine qua non condition for this set up to work) and declare income earned abroad in your tax declaration. Your canton will not tax it as you will be taxed in place of work.

As said in my previous post to cancel your health insurance: show the health insurance administration of your canton your contract from an EU legal entity and they will issue you a document allowing you to be exempt from Swiss health insurance. They may also ask you to provide a so called "S1 form" issued from the EU country (which you would obtain from the respective EU country). You would then show this exempt document to your health insurance company and they will cancel your policy no questions asked.
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Old 07.12.2020, 09:55
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Re: Moving as expat - can keep residency and permit?

Thanks, clear!
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Old 07.12.2020, 10:32
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Re: Moving as expat - can keep residency and permit?

Keep proof that you are returning every week to Switzerland as when renewing your C permit, migration authorities will notice you are working abroad and may ask for proof that you are spending the sufficient amount of time in Switzerland to not have the C permit revoked.

Even if de facto you will be spending more than 6 months in your country of work (5 days a week), SEM migration guidance suggests that if this absence from Switzerland is due to professional reasons during the week and returning to the center of your vital interests every weekend is guaranteed, then the 6 month outside of Switzerland rule for the revocation of your permit is not justified.
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Old 07.12.2020, 10:53
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Re: Moving as expat - can keep residency and permit?

IMHO it would be very risky to base your decision on info you get from anonymous sources such as EF.

The only info it's recommendable to rely on should come from Vevey's Office de Population, and based on their assessment from Vevey's tax office.



(it's six weeks now since the thread started, easily long enough for OP to have things clarified by the authorities. That doesn't seem to have happened at all, he doesn't seem to use the replies here as a starting point only.)
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Old 07.12.2020, 11:01
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Re: Moving as expat - can keep residency and permit?

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IMHO it would be very risky to base your decision on info you get from anonymous sources such as EF.

The only info it's recommendable to rely on should come from Vevey's Office de Population, and based on their assessment from Vevey's tax office.
The cantonal migration authority responsible for canton Vaud is in Lausanne and is called the Service de la Population (SPOP). They deal with migration issues and certainly do not approve/renew/deny permits based on any 'assessment' the tax authorities may provide (bar tax package B permits).
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Old 07.12.2020, 11:04
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Re: Moving as expat - can keep residency and permit?

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The cantonal migration authority responsible for canton Vaud is in Lausanne and is called the Service de la Population (SPOP). They deal with migration issues and certainly do not approve/renew/deny permits based on any 'assessment' the tax authorities may provide (bar tax package B permits).
Thanks for making my point.

As for the taxation thing, you got that the wrong way round.
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Old 07.12.2020, 11:21
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Re: Moving as expat - can keep residency and permit?

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Thanks for making my point.
You are confusing Vevey's office de la population (aka communal contrôle des habitants elsewhere i.e. not the decision maker) and the cantonal SPOP as mentioned above.

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As for the taxation thing, you got that the wrong way round.
If you read the SEM guidance in full and are aware of cantonal practices, things like job creation and fiscal considerations do not influence decisions to approve or renew foreigner permits. The conditions to obtain and renew a permit are clearly laid out by the foreigners law and are independent of the potential tax revenue the foreigner would generate.
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Old 07.12.2020, 14:38
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Re: Moving as expat - can keep residency and permit?

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You are confusing Vevey's office de la population (aka communal contrôle des habitants elsewhere i.e. not the decision maker) and the cantonal SPOP as mentioned above.
You confirm that at least one factual claim in this thread is false. Which confirms my advice that OP shouldn't put his C permit on anything someone writes on here, or on the 'net for that matter. Instead, use that as a starting point and enquire with the responsible authorities, only their info should be relied upon.

As for the taxation thing, re-read what I wrote. What I wrote is not what you understand.

Overall you seem to vehemently agree.
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Old 21.12.2020, 17:48
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Re: Moving as expat - can keep residency and permit?

Dear all, to complete the information i got.
Interestingly enough, none is very clear upfront, neither my company nor the canton. However, after investigating I have come to this conclusion:
- if you reside in Switzerland more than 3 months
- and your center of interest, family, house is here and you can prove the routine (eg being back weekends, holidays etc)
Then your permit stays on there is not even need to freeze it.
For sake of transparency i shared all the details and my contract with the bureau of the population who confirmed, so is not just an interpretation.
Taxes are paid in the country where you work and as fiscal residence is kept here, tax declaration in ch will also apply, then compensated with what already paid elsewhere.
This is valid for Canton Vaud, on an expat assignment to a EU country.
Hope the thread is helpful to others, not in the sense that people male decisions based on what they read only, more in the sense that asking the right questions might lead to very different answers... so better know various scenarios.
Thanks to all who helped
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