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Old 31.12.2020, 05:34
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Resigning from L or B permit to start a PhD (non-EU)

I completed my bachelors and masters studies in basel and then the university of geneva. I also took the federal diploma exam so I'm a licensed federal pharmacist in Switzerland since September 2020. I plan at some point to work in a pharmacy long term, but for now I want to explore other options.

My student permit expires in 2 months and I received an offer to work for a pharmacy in Vaud in February, where I need to sign the contract ASAP. I also however have some meetings with professors in 2 weeks or so to potentially start a PhD as i told them I was looking for one and they had requested to discuss this possibility. I am not sure when I would start if they give me an offer, but probably in 6 months to over a year. My pharmacy contract is an undetermined duration contract (CDI), so basically I have 3 questions:

- What permit would I more likely get? B restricted or L permit?

- Depending on what permit I get, if I get a PhD offer and the professor signs the contract and begins the procedure, can I resign and complete the notice period and wait until my new permit is processed, or do I have to leave Switzerland until the new permit is ready?

- Should I sign the pharmacy contract knowing the risk of getting an L permit, or should I extend your student permit for another 6 months until I find something better? (Personally PhDs from what i've seen don't really have permit issues as the professor can request certain CVs over others without an exhaustive process that jobs have to do).

Thanks so much, i'm really scared about the leaving Switzerland part because i don't have family in my home country and my parents live in a country where I also need to apply for a visa and can only stay for 1 month... and with coronavirus I don't know how easily i'd be let back in.
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Old 31.12.2020, 12:21
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Re: Resigning from L or B permit to start a PhD (non-EU)

If staying in Switzerland is your top priority, it is pretty obvious to secure what you have at hand. The PhD will only be materialized in half a year to a year, if it indeed does eventually go as you have planned. You could always quit the job and give the praxis the required notice period.

Since you are already in Switzerland, you will not be forced to leave Switzerland while your PhD permit is being processed. As you have said yourself, PhD permit is not like a real work permit, hence the chance of being declined is negligible.

Being a non-EU most likely you will be granted an L Permit despite having unlimited work contract. This is the case in the few German-speaking cantons. Why does it really matter if it's an L or a B if it is out of your control?

Of course you could always extend the 6 months job searching to try secure something better. That's on your own calculated risk.
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Old 31.12.2020, 16:35
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Re: Resigning from L or B permit to start a PhD (non-EU)

Take the job offer, keep your options open by further discussing with the profs.

It is just a job anyway, you can always resign saying that it was not what you expected, bla-bla... Or maybe you realize it is much better than the perspective of being underpaid and abused by Profs for 3-5 years.

Regarding the permit, in the first half of the year you might get a B, but most likely it will be an L, which will be converted to B in 2 years, after which you could immediately apply for C in most cantons through VIntA, if you have at least B1 german and contract is unlimited.

With PhD you will get a student B, which is, tbh, not much better than L. Then, you will end up in the same situation after PhD as you have now, you will have a 6-month L permit for job search and a lovely kick-ass afterwards.
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Old 31.12.2020, 16:57
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Re: Resigning from L or B permit to start a PhD (non-EU)

A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. Take the job and see where it gets you. Changing job is easy and simpler than finding one. But first you will have to pass the probation period of your new job anyway. This job is also a good opportunity to save some money. As you might know PhD student get paid. However most likely not as much as a licensed pharmacist.

If you have an open ended contract you should get B. Specially as it is the beginning of the year. However you might still get an L. Based on the latest SEM guidelines such an L should be treated like a B for C permit purposes.

The type of permit you get should not affect your possible PhD as you will get a new student permit. There should be no need to leave the country for that.
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Old 31.12.2020, 17:02
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Re: Resigning from L or B permit to start a PhD (non-EU)

Congrats on the job! Certainly difficult for a non-EU! It is actually difficult for EU these days. If you PhD program works out, try to see if you can do both, part times, if both places agree. That way you will have your edu and work experiences, in some instances it is possible. It is hard but has its benefits.
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Old 31.12.2020, 18:15
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Re: Resigning from L or B permit to start a PhD (non-EU)

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Congrats on the job! Certainly difficult for a non-EU! It is actually difficult for EU these days. If you PhD program works out, try to see if you can do both, part times, if both places agree. That way you will have your edu and work experiences, in some instances it is possible. It is hard but has its benefits.
Part-time PhD? The profs want 150% of your time for 60% salary (sometimes 80). Unless if your job is directly linked to the subject of PhD I find this close to impossible.
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Old 31.12.2020, 18:18
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Re: Resigning from L or B permit to start a PhD (non-EU)

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Part-time PhD? The profs want 150% of your time for 60% salary (sometimes 80). Unless if your job is directly linked to the subject of PhD I find this close to impossible.
I think that depends on how special OP is. I would still go for the pharmacy and then try to negotiate for the PhD.
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Old 31.12.2020, 19:38
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Re: Resigning from L or B permit to start a PhD (non-EU)

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Take the job offer, keep your options open by further discussing with the profs.

It is just a job anyway, you can always resign saying that it was not what you expected, bla-bla... Or maybe you realize it is much better than the perspective of being underpaid and abused by Profs for 3-5 years.
And if they do they probably won't qualify for the job seeker L permit which is only for the first 6 months after graduation. So if they resign after that period they'd come under the non-EU hiring rules as far as getting another job is concerned.
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Old 31.12.2020, 20:31
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Re: Resigning from L or B permit to start a PhD (non-EU)

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And if they do they probably won't qualify for the job seeker L permit which is only for the first 6 months after graduation. So if they resign after that period they'd come under the non-EU hiring rules as far as getting another job is concerned.
Depends on the permit. L - yes. B can be taken over by another employer. And of course I believe that the OP is smart enough to first find a new job, sign the contract and then resign from the current.
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Old 31.12.2020, 20:48
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Re: Resigning from L or B permit to start a PhD (non-EU)

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Depends on the permit. L - yes. B can be taken over by another employer. And of course I believe that the OP is smart enough to first find a new job, sign the contract and then resign from the current.
It can, but not guaranteed that it will be. Would depend on the skills/experience and needs of the new employer; not sure a new graduate would be able to do it.
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Old 03.01.2021, 19:25
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Re: Resigning from L or B permit to start a PhD (non-EU)

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Based on the latest SEM guidelines such an L should be treated like a B for C permit purposes.
Do you have the source of it? In the Canton Bern at least it was/is not being counted
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Old 03.01.2021, 23:33
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Re: Resigning from L or B permit to start a PhD (non-EU)

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If staying in Switzerland is your top priority, it is pretty obvious to secure what you have at hand. The PhD will only be materialized in half a year to a year, if it indeed does eventually go as you have planned. You could always quit the job and give the praxis the required notice period.

Since you are already in Switzerland, you will not be forced to leave Switzerland while your PhD permit is being processed. As you have said yourself, PhD permit is not like a real work permit, hence the chance of being declined is negligible.

Being a non-EU most likely you will be granted an L Permit despite having unlimited work contract. This is the case in the few German-speaking cantons. Why does it really matter if it's an L or a B if it is out of your control?

Of course you could always extend the 6 months job searching to try secure something better. That's on your own calculated risk.
This.
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