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Old 22.01.2009, 12:24
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Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

As you know, CH joined the Schengen Area on 12th December 2008.

Great news for those non-EU Passport holders with Swiss Resident permits who can now travel without Visa to Courtepaille Restaurants in the Mulhouse area and all over mainland Western Europe.

BEWARE THIS IS A PROBLEM WE FOUND:

If you have non-EU VFR (visiting Friends and Relatives) from USA or Canada who came to CH pre-Schengen without Visa, the rules have changed!!

Pre-Schengen, my Colombian Mother-in-law could come to CH without Visa - because she has US Green Card.

Post-Schengen SHE NEEDS A SCHENGEN VISA.
Switzerland has to comply with Schengen rules - no exceptions.

Other nationals e.g. Indian will be affected by this.

It's already causing related issues at Zurich Airport, because Swiss Immigration can no longer grant a "Landside Stopover" to allow passengers to connect onto a next-day flight after arriving late in the evening, ie. the passengers sleeps in the Airport Hotel and departs next day.

Now the passenger has to sleep in the Departure Lounge! No joke.

Be careful!!

Swiss have some info on their UK webpage:

http://www.swiss.com/countries/GB/lo...ngen_visa.aspx

------------------------------------------------------------------------

Not related, but for file, this is the Current List of Schengen Countries:

AUSTRIA
BELGIUM
CZECH REPUBLIC
DENMARK
ESTONIA
FINLAND
FRANCE
GERMANY
GREECE
HUNGARY
ICELAND
ITALY
LATVIA
LITHUANIA
LUXEMBOURG
MALTA
NETHERLANDS
NORWAY
POLAND
PORTUGAL
SLOVAK REPUBLIC
SLOVENIA
SPAIN
SWEDEN
SWITZERLAND

PS. See you in Courtepaille Mulhouse on Saturday hey Krishnan?
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Last edited by oldmanc; 22.01.2009 at 12:32. Reason: spelin
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  #2  
Old 22.01.2009, 12:45
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

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Other nationals e.g. Indian will be affected by this.
Only if the visitors are on Pre-Schengen visa, i.e. Visa issued by CH embassy during their Pre-Schangen days. All new visas to CH (from India) are valid Schangen visa.
There is no problem if folks are here with valid permits (e.g. L).
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Old 22.01.2009, 12:47
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

Hi Saul,

Thnks for the message...This will be a problem for Indian (third country nationals) who transit thru ZRH...They may have to take schengen visa from their country of origin..
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Old 22.01.2009, 13:20
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

We have an adopted daughter, from Rwanda, who is still on her Rwandan passport. We have a UK visa so no problems. Will her B permit now get her into France without a hitch? I had heard about this, but have not tried it yet, for obvious reasons...
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Old 22.01.2009, 16:41
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

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We have an adopted daughter, from Rwanda, who is still on her Rwandan passport. We have a UK visa so no problems. Will her B permit now get her into France without a hitch? I had heard about this, but have not tried it yet, for obvious reasons...
Yes! No problem.
That's the benefit I referred to me in above post.
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Old 22.01.2009, 16:46
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

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Only if the visitors are on Pre-Schengen visa, i.e. Visa issued by CH embassy during their Pre-Schangen days. All new visas to CH (from India) are valid Schangen visa.
There is no problem if folks are here with valid permits (e.g. L).
Correct - I agree.

The issue is that if you have Indian nationals living in USA with Green Card, they NOW need a Visa to come to Switzerland.

Pre-Schengen they were allowed into Switzerland without Visa.

You see what I mean?

Basically, our mother-in-law has to apply for a Visa to enter Switzerland.
I can't wait for that
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Old 22.01.2009, 18:42
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

Thanks for the info oldmanc!
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Basically, our mother-in-law has to apply for a Visa to enter Switzerland.
I can't wait for that
Wicked

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Hi Saul,

Thnks for the message...This will be a problem for Indian (third country nationals) who transit thru ZRH...They may have to take schengen visa from their country of origin..
Before 12th Dec 08, Indian (as in with Indian passport) with valid B Permit (perhaps also may be L, can someone confirm?) did not need Schengen VISA when transiting through Amsterdam or Frankfurt on the way to Zurich or other places. It was only transit through Heathrow that one needed a UK transit VISA as far as I am aware. I think the OP has cleared it out in later post, how people with US Green card cannot travel any longer to Switzerland without a Schengen VISA.

Your sentences might create confusion. Please make it a question if you are not sure of the information.
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Old 22.01.2009, 19:30
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

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Before 12th Dec 08, Indian (as in with Indian passport) with valid B Permit (perhaps also may be L, can someone confirm?) did not need Schengen VISA when transiting through Amsterdam or Frankfurt on the way to Zurich or other places. It was only transit through Heathrow that one needed a UK transit VISA as far as I am aware. I think the OP has cleared it out in later post, how people with US Green card cannot travel any longer to Switzerland without a Schengen VISA.

Your sentences might create confusion. Please make it a question if you are not sure of the information.
No The sentence is correct. If you are an indian citizen who does not have a permit to live and work in Schengen countries or a green card from US or a work permit in EU countries you need a visa even if you need to transit through the schengen countries even if it only an airport transit. You could still do it through zurich Airport because switzerland did not need airport transit visa for indian passport holders. That has changed now since Switzerland has to follow schengen rules
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Old 22.01.2009, 19:50
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

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Basically, our mother-in-law has to apply for a Visa to enter Switzerland.
I can't wait for that
Every cloud has a silver lining
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Old 22.01.2009, 20:55
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

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No The sentence is correct. If you are an Indian citizen who does not have a permit to live and work in Schengen countries or a green card from US or a work permit in EU countries you need a visa even if you need to transit through the schengen countries even if it only an airport transit. You could still do it through zurich Airport because switzerland did not need airport transit visa for Indian passport holders. That has changed now since Switzerland has to follow schengen rules
Sorry, I would differ on that.
I have an Indian passport.
Throughout I had a valid B Permit for Switzerland, so I had no work permit for Schengen Countries/EU Countries also no US Green card.

I made the following travels:
2003 Delhi-Amsterdam-Zürich and back (No Transit VISA for Netherlands required)
2005 Zürich-Frankfurt-Beijing and back (No Transit VISA for Germany required)
2007 Delhi-Frankfurt-Zürich and back (No Transit VISA for Germany required)

Never asked by anyone at airport nor suggested by German Embassy in Delhi/Zürich, when being inquired about transit through Frankfurt.

In any case, about Indian nationals the German embassy website says you are excluded from Transit visa if you have "a residence permit of Andorra, San Marino, Switzerland or USA, Japan, Monaco and Canada". I don't know for sure, but Green card mean you do have a resident permit for US?

Sorry to divert from topic of Switzerland. But Indian Nationals with Green Card NEED a visa to ENTER Switzerland as is said here. But I must still see the rule which says thats required for transit too, since another Schengen country (Germany as link shows above) still makes it clear you do NOT require Airport Transit VISA if you are in possession of US Green Card.
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Old 22.01.2009, 20:56
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

Just reading over some of the suff and I see that it is also important to note that Ireland & UK are not full members of Schengen and as a result additional requirement may apply, it says the details will be stated on the visa, so read it carefully......

Jim
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Old 22.01.2009, 21:35
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

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Sorry, I would differ on that.
I have an Indian passport.
Throughout I had a valid B Permit for Switzerland, so I had no work permit for Schengen Countries/EU Countries also no US Green card.

I made the following travels:
2003 Delhi-Amsterdam-Zürich and back (No Transit VISA for Netherlands required)
2005 Zürich-Frankfurt-Beijing and back (No Transit VISA for Germany required)
2007 Delhi-Frankfurt-Zürich and back (No Transit VISA for Germany required)

Never asked by anyone at airport nor suggested by German Embassy in Delhi/Zürich, when being inquired about transit through Frankfurt.

In any case, about Indian nationals the German embassy website says you are excluded from Transit visa if you have "a residence permit of Andorra, San Marino, Switzerland or USA, Japan, Monaco and Canada". I don't know for sure, but Green card mean you do have a resident permit for US?

Sorry to divert from topic of Switzerland. But Indian Nationals with Green Card NEED a visa to ENTER Switzerland as is said here. But I must still see the rule which says thats required for transit too, since another Schengen country (Germany as link shows above) still makes it clear you do NOT require Airport Transit VISA if you are in possession of US Green Card.
Sorry you misunderstood again, you had a B permit, so that is different. I am only talking about indians who are for example travelling through schenged countries to USA for example. Try to understand what is being said before negating the statement.

Green card holders from US did not need a visa to enter Switzerland, but now that it is part of Schengen there is a need
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Old 22.01.2009, 22:41
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

Visa now required for Russians too. I work occasionally with one who lives in the UK. Last time he got in on his passport. This time I had to fax a request for a visit, with dates, to get a visa.
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Old 23.01.2009, 02:10
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

The kids have woken up and I can't sleep, so I'm trying to understand my own thread

The issues that arise these days for screwing up a Visa requirement are severe:

1. Fact: Airlines are strapped for cash.
2. Fact: Airlines get fined 000s of dollars by Immigration if they transport someone without all necessary documents.
3. The days of slipping a 10 USD bill into your passport to bribe your way past Immigration are long gone. Forget I wrote this, but if see me in the Nelson Zürich, I'll tell you some stories from the airline world
4. Airlines will not change restricted tickets without you paying loads of money. They used to be flexible and book you FOC ("Free of Charge") e.g. if you left your passport at home, but again, those days have gone.
5. In many cases, you can't just "nip down the Embassy" to get a Visa and return next day to catch the next flight. You may need to give fingerprints, have a personal interview and book an appointment.

To sum up, BE CAREFUL out there if you have a non-EU friend or relative visiting Switzerland.

If you live close to an airport, I recommend going along in in Person.

Ask the Agent for a "Printout from TIMATIC".
TIMATIC http://www.timaticweb.com/ is the IATA standard for Passport and Visa queries.

Don't let bureaucracy ruin your time with friends and family!

Now, back to bed...

Edited:
Me again - some airlines give you Free access to Timatic info, click SOLUTIONS on the above link to see the list, the Emirates site we found quite useful.
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Last edited by oldmanc; 23.01.2009 at 02:13. Reason: tiredness...
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Old 23.01.2009, 09:20
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

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I am only talking about indians who are for example travelling through schenged countries to USA for example.
Okay, in fact now I understand why I misunderstood! In your previous post you did not mention that while you are flying from outside Europe to or from US explicitly. Which you now clarified. Thanks.

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Green card holders from US did not need a visa to enter Switzerland, but now that it is part of Schengen there is a need
Are you absolutely sure of this fact?
The German Embassy website in India shows you would NOT need a airport transit visa if you have residence in US and few other countries. Though I linked it in my last post, I link it again here. Please go through the pdf saying Airport Transit Visa (A-Transit). And Swiss embassy website yet does not say anything about Transit explicitly. If you can show me the documentation that it is indeed the case, I would be happy to agree with you.
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Old 23.01.2009, 09:26
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

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Are you absolutely sure of this fact?
The German Embassy website in India shows you would NOT need a airport transit visa if you have residence in US and few other countries. Though I linked it in my last post, I link it again here. Please go through the pdf saying Airport Transit Visa (A-Transit). And Swiss embassy website yet does not say anything about Transit explicitly. If you can show me the documentation that it is indeed the case, I would be happy to agree with you.
I am talking about entering switzerland not transit through swityserland. For transit you would need no visa. I think the previous post was talking about the poster's MIL entering switzerland. Was posting while pretending to be working , so sometimes the posts are short.
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Old 23.01.2009, 09:37
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

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I am talking about entering switzerland not transit through swityserland. For transit you would need no visa. I think the previous post was talking about the poster's MIL entering switzerland. Was posting while pretending to be working , so sometimes the posts are short.
Ahaa ... then its clear .. I am still waiting for clarification that a transit visa is not needed. Who knows, some dumba$$ actually makes this rule for transit visa too for flying through Switzerland. Faith in bureaucracy is sometimes difficult.

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swityserland
Is it the qwertz keyboard at work eh? well, expertise in pretension is always something one can be proud of while surfin EF at work.

Good to find another fellow Indian also living in Adliswil. Cheers.
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Old 23.01.2009, 09:43
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

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Me again - some airlines give you Free access to Timatic info, click SOLUTIONS on the above link to see the list, the Emirates site we found quite useful.
Here's the direct link:

http://www.emirates.com/ch/english/p...uirements.aspx

Fill in nationality, residency, the destination, and transit countries, and you get a popup with a detailed description of the requirements.
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Old 23.01.2009, 11:10
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

When we went for the weekend to the UK, the airline staff checked our passports and made sure we had our residency permits...

As mentioned above, the airlines are fined heavily for bringing in people who don't have the right documents.

With the change of regulations, just don't forget your permit and your passport

(says the person who went to Konstanz with her family at Christmas to go to the aquarium with the kids, and half the group didn't have their permits/passports - oops - no border check, phew!)...
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Old 23.01.2009, 18:47
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Re: Schengen Rules- A VISA WARNING!

Forgive me if this is a stupid question. I am a little confused... sorry!

My mother is visiting from the US in February when I have my baby. She has a passport, but no VISA. Do these new regs. mean she can't come for a 2 week visit without a visa? Uh oh.
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