Dual citizenship / two passports

SwissPete · #1 07.11.2010, 02:16

Coming into Switzerland recently (from the US), I used my Swiss passport at the border (Cointrin).

When leaving to return to the US, I used my US passport (again, Cointrin).

The gendarme was obviously looking for something in my US passport, so I asked him. Yes, he was looking for an entry stamp (which of course was not there since I came in on my Swiss passport).

I have always been leery about letting authorities know that I am a dual citizen, believing that some countries frown upon their citizens also being citizens of another country.

Are my fears unfounded?

nomad66 · #2 07.11.2010, 02:43

If it is to be done by the book, I am not sure this is really permitted. One is not allowed to switch passports in the middle of their travels; one is supposed to use the same passport during the length of the travel.

Does the US now allow dual citizenship?

On the assumption that the US does not, I don't think the Swiss border police may care much, but the US customs and border probably will. They may want to know where you have been, and look for stamps on your passport. Airlines now report passenger and travel information to the US authorities. It is also fairly easy for CBP to look up passenger airline travel history. You may get flagged at US border and have to do additional "interview" with CBP, before they let you back in the country.

SwissPete · #3 07.11.2010, 02:49

Thanks for the quick reply and the interesting comments.

	Quote:	nomad66
	[...] Does the US now allow dual citizenship? [...]

Interesting question... I hope somebody has an answer!

Wollishofener · #4 07.11.2010, 02:58

	Quote:	SwissPete
	Coming into Switzerland recently (from the US), I used my Swiss passport at the border (Cointrin). When leaving to return to the US, I used my US passport (again, Cointrin). The gendarme was obviously looking for something in my US passport, so I asked him. Yes, he was looking for an entry stamp (which of course was not there since I came in on my Swiss passport). I have always been leery about letting authorities know that I am a dual citizen, believing that some countries frown upon their citizens also being citizens of another country. Are my fears unfounded?

In Switzerland, you can be citizen of several countries, and this is absolutely legal HERE. You only have to use your identity cards and passports in a logical way. On departure from Switzerland you anyway should not use a passport but the CH identity card, which saves the controller half a minute up to two minutes which may look a minimal thing but if you look at the effect on the line behind you it matters ! If you enter a particular country with the CH identification, you should use the same doc. on departure. If you use your USA passport on arrival you should use the same doc. on departure !

Wollishofener · #5 07.11.2010, 03:02

	Quote:	nomad66
	If it is to be done by the book, I am not sure this is really permitted. One is not allowed to switch passports in the middle of their travels; one is supposed to use the same passport during the length of the travel. Does the US now allow dual citizenship? On the assumption that the US does not, I don't think the Swiss border police may care much, but the US customs and border probably will. They may want to know where you have been, and look for stamps on your passport. Airlines now report passenger and travel information to the US authorities. It is also fairly easy for CBP to look up passenger airline travel history. You may get flagged at US border and have to do additional "interview" with CBP, before they let you back in the country.

The USA did allow dual citizenship as early as about 1880 and does do so up to now. One of my grand-grand-fathers became a US citizen in about 1880 but retained the CH citizenship. He returned to CH in about 1882 (my grandfather was born in 1884, but NOT a US citizen). An uncle of me, at the age of 5 in 1905 became US citizen shortly after but retained his CH citizenship until his end in 1989 .

HollidayG · #6 07.11.2010, 05:01

The US allows dual citizenship with Switzerland, Ireland, England, Mexico,
and Canada for sure.

I don't know about other countries.

Germany does not allow dual citizenship with countries outside of EU although there are a few exceptions.

Karl · #7 07.11.2010, 05:37

	Quote:	SwissPete
	Thanks for the quick reply and the interesting comments.Interesting question... I hope somebody has an answer!

Yes, they do. This topic has already been addressed in another thread.

jrspet · #8 07.11.2010, 05:44

I found this at the State Dept. website:

	Quote:
	The concept of dual nationality means that a person is a citizen of two countries at the same time. Each country has its own citizenship laws based on its own policy.Persons may have dual nationality by automatic operation of different laws rather than by choice. For example, a child born in a foreign country to U.S. citizen parents may be both a U.S. citizen and a citizen of the country of birth. A U.S. citizen may acquire foreign citizenship by marriage, or a person naturalized as a U.S. citizen may not lose the citizenship of the country of birth.U.S. law does not mention dual nationality or require a person to choose one citizenship or another. Also, a person who is automatically granted another citizenship does not risk losing U.S. citizenship. However, a person who acquires a foreign citizenship by applying for it may lose U.S. citizenship. In order to lose U.S. citizenship, the law requires that the person must apply for the foreign citizenship voluntarily, by free choice, and with the intention to give up U.S. citizenship. Intent can be shown by the person's statements or conduct.The U.S. Government recognizes that dual nationality exists but does not encourage it as a matter of policy because of the problems it may cause. Claims of other countries on dual national U.S. citizens may conflict with U.S. law, and dual nationality may limit U.S. Government efforts to assist citizens abroad. The country where a dual national is located generally has a stronger claim to that person's allegiance. However, dual nationals owe allegiance to both the United States and the foreign country. They are required to obey the laws of both countries. Either country has the right to enforce its laws, particularly if the person later travels there.Most U.S. citizens, including dual nationals, must use a U.S. passport to enter and leave the United States. Dual nationals may also be required by the foreign country to use its passport to enter and leave that country. Use of the foreign passport does not endanger U.S. citizenship.Most countries permit a person to renounce or otherwise lose citizenship.

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_p.../cis_1753.html

#9 07.11.2010, 06:23

I'm a US citizen. In the 4 years that I've been travelling to Switzerland, I've received one entry stamp in my passport - when I came in on my single entry visa to move here. Every other trip in and out, I have never received a stamp in my passport. I'm trying to understand why the policeman was looking for a stamp. Is it different in GVA?

Of course, I've not flown out of GVA to the US, only to London. My flights to the US have all been via ZRH.

miniMia · #10 07.11.2010, 07:08

	Quote:	SwissPete
	Thanks for the quick reply and the interesting comments.Interesting question... I hope somebody has an answer!

Don't you think it's a bit late to be asking this question.

They do by the way. And as was said above, you should always enter and exit a country on the same passport. If you are a citizen of that country than you should always us that passport to enter and exit.

In the case of the US you MUST enter and exit on your US passport ONLY.

ALSO, the US should eventually know that you are a dual citizen as when you get a new passport they ask you to sign an oath. This oath states that you have no allegiance to any other country. If you sign this oath without telling them of your allegiance to Switzerland (or whatever other country) than you will be lying under oath. They will make a note on that part of the oath to make it so that you are not lying.

Chemmie · #11 07.11.2010, 08:55

	Quote:	nomad66
	If it is to be done by the book, I am not sure this is really permitted. One is not allowed to switch passports in the middle of their travels; one is supposed to use the same passport during the length of the travel. Does the US now allow dual citizenship? On the assumption that the US does not, I don't think the Swiss border police may care much, but the US customs and border probably will. They may want to know where you have been, and look for stamps on your passport. Airlines now report passenger and travel information to the US authorities. It is also fairly easy for CBP to look up passenger airline travel history. You may get flagged at US border and have to do additional "interview" with CBP, before they let you back in the country.

As a Canadian dual-citizen, I never bothers getting the SchweizerPass or ID, and just travelled with my CDN Passport--also under the assumption that it was illegal to travel with mulitple passports. This was not apparently true.

Leaving Switzerland last time, I had some major issues at Customs as my Canadian Passport was stamped, and I been in CH longer than 3 months. Took quite the little drama to convince them I was Swiss. (the last name, and ability to speak the language fairly fluently usually works, but I guess the visible minority aspect trumped this time). Either way, they let me go and strongly suggested to get my CHPass and travel in/out of CH with that and in/out of canada with my CDN.

We'll see how that actually goes in 3 weeks

#12 07.11.2010, 09:02

	Quote:	SwissPete
	Coming into Switzerland recently (from the US), I used my Swiss passport at the border (Cointrin). When leaving to return to the US, I used my US passport (again, Cointrin). The gendarme was obviously looking for something in my US passport, so I asked him. Yes, he was looking for an entry stamp (which of course was not there since I came in on my Swiss passport). I have always been leery about letting authorities know that I am a dual citizen, believing that some countries frown upon their citizens also being citizens of another country. Are my fears unfounded?

I went thru that situation once also. Just use your Swiss passport when entering or leaving Switzerland. USA passport when entering or leaving USA. No problem... Actually when traveling to other countries besides USA I only use my Swiss passport.

#13 07.11.2010, 09:52

The passport is suppose to track your entry and exit from a country. If you switch in the middle of a travel, you'll raise suspicion of how you got into a country, and how long you were in a country.

#14 07.11.2010, 12:52

This is one thing I really love doing,with my UK and Swiss passports, it kind of gives me a level of in your face with the Immigration control here every time I arrive or go out, I chuck both my two Passports at the person in there little control box and I say "take your pick" I always get look of

er

and

and then a question which "one you like to use sir?" and my answer is "its your job to control so take your pick"

and every time the person gives me a smiles and hands back my passports

marton · #15 07.11.2010, 13:01

This does rather beg the question of people who have dual citizenship but choose to only have one passport.

I suppose in the case of Swiss/other country you could always use your Swiss id card in lieu of passport & your "other" passport for other countries.
I believe a Swiss must have a Swiss id card? Although oddly when I got Swiss citizenship my Gemeinde insited on taking my C permit away but said it was up to me when & if I ordered an ID card. Does not mean my gemeinde was correct of course; could just be a case of different officials giving different views.

biff · #16 07.11.2010, 13:05

I choose which passport to use, depending on the visa requirements of where I am going. I go for the cheapest, easiest option. Remembering to exit on the same one you go in on, is essential though. In the case of air travel, trying to swap at airline inspection points in transit may not be a good idea - if the staff ever actually bother to check your offered ID in relation to what they have on the computer.

I have walked across a border from SLovakia to HUngary, bought an icecream, then gone back on the other passport. The border guards I chatted with both ways were very understanding about my desire to swap passports to avoid visa payments that would be needed if I travelled further east on the first passport.

PLus, I like to collect border stamps as a souviner. ;-P

#17 07.11.2010, 13:10

	Quote:	marton
	This does rather beg the question of people who have dual citizenship but choose to only have one passport. I suppose in the case of Swiss/other country you could always use your Swiss id card in lieu of passport & your "other" passport for other countries. I believe a Swiss must have a Swiss id card? Although oddly when I got Swiss citizenship my Gemeinde insited on taking my C permit away but said it was up to me when & if I ordered an ID card. Does not mean my gemeinde was correct of course; could just be a case of different officials giving different views.

I only tend to use my Swiss ID card when I am driving through local country borders, saves all that mucking about holding the steering wheel of my card and opening a passport

MathNut · #18 07.11.2010, 13:51

	Quote:	miniMia
	And as was said above, you should always enter and exit a country on the same passport. If you are a citizen of that country than you should always us that passport to enter and exit. In the case of the US you MUST enter and exit on your US passport ONLY.

So when you are traveling between Switzerland and the USA, you are supposed to carry both passports - the Swiss one to show in Zurich airport (coming and going) and the US one to show in New York (coming and going)?

Bit inconvenient... although I suppose less inconvenient than being held up in Passport Control for an extra ten minutes...

(Lucky me, my life is simple at this point - but I'll have to poll some colleagues tomorrow and find out what they do.)

starDeMer · #19 07.11.2010, 14:07

	Quote:
	I went thru that situation once also. Just use your Swiss passport when entering or leaving Switzerland. USA passport when entering or leaving USA. No problem... Actually when traveling to other countries besides USA I only use my Swiss passport.

I do the same (French/Australian), I can't leave Ch with my AU passport because the can't find a visa or stamp.

#20 07.11.2010, 15:30

	Quote:	miniMia
	They do by the way. And as was said above, you should always enter and exit a country on the same passport. If you are a citizen of that country than you should always us that passport to enter and exit. In the case of the US you MUST enter and exit on your US passport ONLY.

I think it's only the US that is fussy about that. I use UK and Swiss passports for UK entry/exit pretty much at random and no-one has got excited about it so far.