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Old 27.10.2011, 10:55
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looking for a dog,

Hi,

does anyone know where can I buy a dog in Switzerland? I live in the Basel area, and have not seen any pet shops offering dogs (puppies, old ones...etc). Also, is it difficult to register a dog? What about the paperwork that follows once you have it --- proofs of vaccination and so on?
I hope someone (with dogs) can give me an advice,

M,
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Old 27.10.2011, 11:01
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Re: looking for a dog,

OK,

So let's try and limit the amount of 'pain' you have just exposed yourself too.


Give us an idea of what sort of dog you are looking for?

Althernatively (if you don't know), tell us a bit more about yourself so that others maybe able to suggest a breed.

eg. How old are you (roughly)?
How active are you?
What sort of place do you live in (open backyard, small one bedroom apartment)?
How much time can you spend with your hound?


I say this, because a dog should suit the owners lifestyle...... not chosen simply on it's apearence.


Personally I'd suggest one of two options.

1) Contact a breeder directly and get your dog properly...... STAY AWAY from pet shops.

or

2) Go to an animal shelter, and see what you fall in love with there.
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Old 27.10.2011, 11:02
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Re: looking for a dog,

Basel shelter website is here:

http://www.tbb.ch/index.php?id=103&no_cache=1

this is across the border in Weil am Rhein:

http://www.tierschutzverein-weil.de/
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Old 27.10.2011, 11:06
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Re: looking for a dog,

(Trying to keep off the soap box... )

Never, ever buy a dog from a pet shop.

Never.

You won't find pets sold this way in Switzerland because the practice is abusive. No-one who loves dogs and cares about animal welfare would consider acquiring a pup this way.

Dogs sold in pet shops tend to come from battery farming, where the poor animals are kept in tiny crates, often left lying in their own feces, given no socialization and little exercise, mated every season until they are broken and then thrown away or killed. And not humanely.

The pups are often the product of ill-matched matings, no thought given to genetic health, no health screening done of the parents, no temperament testing to determine if the parents are fit to breed, or not. Pups often inherit the parent's deficiencies.

The animals are often kept in unsanitary conditions, the pups are often sold sick or undernourised.

They are then sold to pet shops where the cycle of mistreatment often continues. A pup in this critical developmental phase needs socialization to his own kind and to people, needs exposure to the human environment (sounds, sights), needs his mother's care to learn the basic canine ABCs. Without that, the pup has a poor start in life. Certainly stuck in a shop on display is not good for the pup's development. A very very bad practice. Go to any SKG breeder's website, most have pictures of the 'Welpenzimmer' and exercise areas - you will see quite a contrast to the cramped conditions in a pet shop.

I'll say it again: No decent breeder would allow his pups to be sold in a pet shop. Only battery farmers and unethical BYBs would do such a thing.

---

There are strict animal welfare laws on the books in Switzerland.

If you want a puppy, go to the official breed club of the SKG, speak with experienced breeders, learn about the process.

Expect to pay upwards of CHF 1500 for a pedigreed dog. Sometimes much more than that. Expect to be grilled within an inch of your life to determine if you will be a good dog owner, and expect to wait.


Or, consider adopting a rescue dog from a shelter. You will still be grilled within an inch of your life to determine if you will be a good owner, expect to pay ca 300-600 as an adoption fee. Please consider this option; there are so many dogs waiting for their forever homes.

If you are a first time dog owner in Switzerland (that is, have not had a dog registered in Switzerland) you must take the SKN theory course BEFORE you acquire a dog. If you have owned a dog previously but not in Switzerland you will have to contact the cantonal Veterinary Office to present your proof of ownership to determine if that is acceptable to be considered an experienced owner in light of the SKN requirement. All dog owners are required to take the SKN practical course within 12 months of acquiring their dog.


The process of buying or adopting a dog has been discussed many times here . A couple of threads of interest:

How to spot a reputable breeder

Adopting a pet from a Rescue Centre


ETA:

One of the reasons the theory course is required is to address welfare issues with respect to purchasing animals. The course discusses how/where to find your future canine friend - and will likely cover why one should avoid battery farms and pet shops.

Last edited by meloncollie; 27.10.2011 at 11:30.
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Old 27.10.2011, 11:19
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Re: looking for a dog,


Switzerland newcomers' introduction to dog ownership regulations:
http://www.veterinaireonline.com/expat/dogs.html

If I'm not mistaken, you are now also supposed to undergo a training course and pass a theoretical and practical exam prior to owning a dog.
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Old 27.10.2011, 11:25
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Re: looking for a dog,

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Switzerland newcomers' introduction to dog ownership regulations:
http://www.veterinaireonline.com/expat/dogs.html

If I'm not mistaken, you are now also supposed to undergo a training course and pass a theoretical and practical exam prior to owning a dog.
MMI, the theory course is requried of first time dog owners and must indeed be taken before acquiring the dog. The practical course must be taken by all dog owners - for each and every dog added to the family - within 12 months of the dog joining the family, not before.

The requirement for both is course attendence, there is no exam. Your Gemeinde may require you to present your course certificate when you register your dog.
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Old 27.10.2011, 11:28
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Re: looking for a dog,

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MMI, the theory course is requried of first time dog owners and must indeed be taken before acquiring the dog. The practical course must be taken by all dog owners - for each and every dog added to the family - within 12 months of the dog joining the family, not before.

The requirement for both is course attendence, there is no exam. Your Gemeinde may require you to present your course certificate when you register your dog.
Thanks for the clarification!
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Old 27.10.2011, 11:38
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Re: looking for a dog,

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Hi,

does anyone know where can I buy a dog in Switzerland? I live in the Basel area, and have not seen any pet shops offering dogs (puppies, old ones...etc). Also, is it difficult to register a dog? What about the paperwork that follows once you have it --- proofs of vaccination and so on?
I hope someone (with dogs) can give me an advice,

M,
Sorry but there are NO pet shops offering dogs for sale in Switzerland. None. They sell rabbits but no dogs. This is because dog breeding is highly regulated here in Switzerland. Breeders are required to register with the SKN and undergo stringent procedures before they are allowed to register.

First steps:

- Seek written permission from your landlord. Some landlords draw up specific contracts for animals. No use going further if pets arent allowed in your apartment.

- Tidak Apa is right. Determine the right kind of breed for your lifestyle. Dont just buy a dog just because its cute.

- Determine if you want a rescue or a pure breed puppy. Will you have time for a puppy? Different routes to take and of course, the price varies. Approx 400 CHF for a rescue dog and a pure breed puppy can range from 800CHF and up, depending on size and how rare the breed is.

- Take the theory course - I am assuming that you are a first time owner here in Switzerland. You will learn the implications of having a dog, the time needed etc. Shelters/most breeders will not entertain you now if you havent taken the course.

If you think a dog is still for you after the course, contact shelters or breeders depending on the breed you want.

Main database for adoption here in Switzerland website is available on this forum. Do a quick search. The link eludes me at the moment. Sorry!

Next steps:
- Go through intensive interviews with either the shelter/breeder. Be prepared to answer questions about your lifestyle and how you plan to care for the dog and cater to its needs.

- Find a certified trainer near you for the practical part of the mandatory dog course.

- Find a recommended vet near you.

- Get the dog. Register it. The shelter/breeder will give you instructions on how to.

I think I've covered all the steps to take for the next 6 months at least. Let us know how you get on!
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Old 27.10.2011, 15:05
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Re: looking for a dog,

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Main database for adoption here in Switzerland website is available on this forum. Do a quick search. The link eludes me at the moment. Sorry!
http://www.tierdatenbank.ch/cms/tier...unschtier.html



Searchable by type of animal, gender, age, canton and various other characteristics.

J.Manuel, do take a look through the database. Right after you complete the SKN theory course.
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Old 29.10.2011, 10:36
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Re: looking for a dog,

As others have already suggested, I strongly suggest an animal shelter. I've previously had two dogs and both were bought from a breeder.

Never again. Not because the breeders weren't reputable and not because they weren't amazing dogs. But because there are so many homeless dogs in need. For each new dog, we leave behind an old.

I went to a shelter for the first time recently because my husband and I want to adopt a dog. It broke my heart. I felt like a bad person just to have to walk through the kennels and past each dog, without being able to stop to meet each one. Of course, not all will be suited to me and vice versa so I understand how it works and place faith also in the people at the shelter to suggest suitable dogs.

It was just hard and not what I expected. As it is, I did meet a dog that I would love to adopt so I'm starting the process now and educating myself about the breed as much as possible.

A wee tip though - shelters often require that you have taken the theoretical training prior to being allowed to adopt the dog.

Good luck! I hope you find a special new family member and friend.
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Old 29.10.2011, 11:05
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Re: looking for a dog,

For interested parties in / around Basel, the TBB has SKN course scheduled for Dec 3rd.

They have a Facebook page if you are interested, it has information and access to signups for things like the upcoming SKN course. https://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=129467270490316
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Old 29.10.2011, 11:23
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Re: looking for a dog,

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OK,

So let's try and limit the amount of 'pain' you have just exposed yourself too.


Give us an idea of what sort of dog you are looking for?

Althernatively (if you don't know), tell us a bit more about yourself so that others maybe able to suggest a breed.

eg. How old are you (roughly)?
How active are you?
What sort of place do you live in (open backyard, small one bedroom apartment)?
How much time can you spend with your hound?


I say this, because a dog should suit the owners lifestyle...... not chosen simply on it's apearence.


Personally I'd suggest one of two options.

1) Contact a breeder directly and get your dog properly...... STAY AWAY from pet shops.

or

2) Go to an animal shelter, and see what you fall in love with there.

This comment is so relevant I feel - some dogs are totally unsuited to living in an apartment, and very few dogs can cope with their owner being at work most day. Etc.

One other question you need to seriously ask yourself is how permanent your job and stay here in CH are- and if you could cope and keep the dog if you had to move on, for your job or otherwise - for the next 15-20 years. A dog should really be considered a companion for its full life-time. Sadly shelters in Switzerland are full to the brim (many dogs having to be euthanazed regularly) with dogs and other pets taken on by owners who bought them on a whim, and then are 'now surplus to requirement' (as recently on a French Forum), because of a baby, a move to another flat, or job move to other country, etc.

Please think very seriously about the full-time, long-term committment you'd be taking on. A dog really is for life. You will in fact find that many shelters will not release dogs November-December as they do not wish dogs to be taken on as Christmas presents.
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Old 30.10.2011, 22:54
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Re: looking for a dog,

Get yoursef a dog ! not from pet shop, not from rescue, but from breeder . Do not look only in CH look all around the world and find it !!! I have been looking for 2 years ...and he save life of my kid...dog will be the part of your life ...remember!..once and for life!!!no mistakes !!!
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Old 31.10.2011, 11:30
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Re: looking for a dog,

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Get yoursef a dog ! not from pet shop, not from rescue, but from breeder .
Why shouldn't he get a dog from a rescue?
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Old 31.10.2011, 11:32
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Re: looking for a dog,

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Trying to keep off the soap box...

Thanks for getting on yours, so I wouldn't have to.
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Old 31.10.2011, 14:22
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Re: looking for a dog,

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Why shouldn't he get a dog from a rescue ?
This seems like a great opportunity to destroy a misconception


Thoughts on Shelter dogs Vs Breeder pups?

Pro's and cons people....... let's hear it !!!
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Old 31.10.2011, 14:30
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Re: looking for a dog,

PLEASE correct me where you can - I actually have no experience with Shelter hounds of my own, but I know the garbage I hear from other people is just plain wrong.

Personally, I was lucky to have the chance to spend time with my pups last time, but next time I want to start with something a little older, and perferably something with a bit of "Hybrid vigour" (a mix breed).


OK,

SHELTER DOGS
So for me, the impression I get from other people is that all shelter dogs are a "Mixed bag" of emotions from their previous experiences.

My experience with 'hard-done-by' dogs, is that they LOVE you twice as much as other dogs.
....... I have also seen a couple of mental dogs as well though.

I remember reading a post from Melloncollie somewhere where they assess dogs in shelters for their suitability for re-homing.
If this is the case, then there is flatly no excuse for not getting a rescue dog.


PUPPIES
a) most of the reason WANKERS get a dog in the first place and why they end up in a shelter.
- People, for the love of all things wholy, GET A DOG, not a puppy.
(It's OK to get a puppy, but buy it because you want the DOG it will be).

b) If you LOVE sleepless nights, endless yapping, and cleaning up piss and shit every 20mins, then a puppy is for you.
...... oh, and those shoes and expensive furniture - time to forget about that.

c) they are cute

d) they are not cute for long

e) Everything a puppy does wrong IS YOUR FAULT.
(remember - you are supposed to be smarter than the dog. So if you "didn't think about it", remember it for next time).
It is YOUR responsibility to guide them and teach them, and this takes patience and time.

f) Having a dog from a pup is a special bond. You will always remember taking them home, and the HELL they put you through while raising them.
Although I still think this is the only advantage. It's cute and that's it.
Pups are useless until they are about 6months old
(but then again, I had my dogs as 'work dogs' on a farm)

g) I seriously underestimated just how much hard work a pup is.
I lost about $5,000 in clothes (mostly the GF's clothes) in the first two years, remodelled the back yard (they could seriously escape from ALCATRAZ), and in the first 4 months, the constant feeding and teaching them what they CAN'T chew and where they COULD shit was just a nightmare.
I was also fortunate that I could take my pups with me to work where I could manage the split in their feeding times, keep them cosy while they slept, and generally attend to their needs.
I have no idea how anyone else would do it without some outside help.


In conclusion, I still think that the Shelter dog is the way forward. But this is my personal opinion because that would suit my lifestyle better.
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Old 31.10.2011, 14:46
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Re: looking for a dog,

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Why shouldn't he get a dog from a rescue?
I am one of those who got my dog from a breeder. This is actually my first time - all the dogs I had since I was 7, before this one were rescues/cast offs.

I lost my Australian terrier before I came to Switzerland and I've had various breeds of terriers all my life. I absolutely love their feisty, independent and hardy nature but my favourite has got to be the working group: the aussie terrier, the JRs, the Cains etc.

I initally wanted to get a Westie but after a bit more research and perhaps I was pining for my old dog, the Norwich was my choice - as its pretty similar in looks to the Australian terrier, albeit I was careful not to have the dog exactly the same.

I also researched that swiss breeders bred the Norwich much bigger than their American and British counterparts - the Americans and British breeders breed the Norwich more compact and stout but the Swiss breeders (only 4 of them in the entire Switzerland) who are working towards kinking out the genetic problems that is common in Norwich terriers, try to do so with a longer and larger body amongst other things that I wont go into so as not to bore everyone But it was very interesting and my respect for the Swiss breeders of the Norwich grew as I did more research.

I initially did look on the adoption database but due to the breed being rather rare (not just in Switzerland), I resorted to a breeder. I dont regret it - Best money I've ever spent as she is responsible and passionate about the breed - ensuring that they flourish properly.

Its a choice at the end of the day. I find that listing the pros/cons of visiting a shelter versus breeder really is like comparing apples to oranges. I generally will encourage everyone to first try the shelters. That being said, adopting a dog from a shelter isnt for everyone - especially the inexperienced owners. They do come with behavioural problems - which is why they were given up in the first place - that will require much more patience than puppies.

Also if you have a specific breed in mind, they might not be available and sometimes, the breeder is the only option.

My experience raising this dog of mine since he was 11 weeks old (and he will be turning 3 in 18 days! time flies!!!) has had its up and downs. Very different from bringing home a dog from a shelter. I wont deny that both are just as hard work. I look back at waking up every 3 hours bringing him out in the snow during the house training phase and shiver. The time invested in ensuring that he was properly trained ON TOP of the SKN mandatory course was also very time consuming. He fortunately responded marvelously to crate training and I am proud to say that I have not lost a single shoe or piece of furniture to him (with the exception of a few socks that he used to steal when he was younger and hide them in his crate).

That being said, the sacrifices and time juggling we did to ensure that he wasnt left alone for too long was also inconvenient on many occasions but well worth it because I totally trust him to be alone at home without the crate even before his first birthday.

He's turned to be a cheeky little chap - the typical terrier: terribly independent, but wonderfully affectionate (just with me), opinionated, hardy and self assured. My only regret is that he isnt fond of the water like the labs and retrievers - and children. He leaves them alone usually - but like his mummy, noisy and boisterous children wind him up and triggers his prey instinct.

My 2 rappens
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Last edited by summerrain; 31.10.2011 at 15:09.
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Old 31.10.2011, 15:05
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Re: looking for a dog,

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This seems like a great opportunity to destroy a misconception


Thoughts on Shelter dogs Vs Breeder pups?

Pro's and cons people....... let's hear it !!!
Shelter dogs are not my preference. I prefer a dog from a breeder. It's what I grew up with -- breeding and showing dogs.

Even though I do not show or breed anymore, I prefer getting a dog with a known genetic history, and also with a known psychological history, primarily because the dog will have grown up with me from 8 weeks of age. This way I know exactly what I am getting is a healthy dog that I will be able and willing to commit to for its entire life. With a shelter dog there are too many unknowns. I know I'm being a bit of a snob here, but it is my preference.
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Old 31.10.2011, 15:17
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Re: looking for a dog,

If you want to be sure what your dog's personality is like when he is an adult, you have to get an adult dog. There are no guarantees with puppies, even if you try your best.
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