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  #261  
Old 02.02.2011, 16:46
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Re: Swiss Euroskepticism

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Not necessarily.
Thanks for your in depth reasoning to the possibility of my statement not being correct.
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  #262  
Old 02.02.2011, 16:50
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Re: Swiss Euroskepticism

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To me, it's a God thing.

And I know I don't like keeping my head down, but I do like to look at mountains.
Can I suggest the Rockies? Seriously - I would urge any American of a libertarian slant not to up sticks for Europe, of all places. Move to a less-settled part of the US instead. In practical terms you'll have less government on your back there, as a native, than you will as a foreigner just about anywhere else in the world. Even the Greek scofflawism DB describes is practiced and tolerated by Greeks... not by foreigners in Greece.


Anyway... if you feel God has called you to Switzerland, what are you wasting your time discussing it with us for, eh? Go for it and I'm sure you'll figure out everything you need to know - one way or another.
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Old 02.02.2011, 16:50
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Re: Swiss Euroskepticism

thank you mods for the awesomest reterdedest, trolledest thread ever!!!


EPIC WIN To all of you.

I retract any previous comments toward any faggy attitude I thought u might have had at any point in this forum.
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  #264  
Old 02.02.2011, 16:55
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Re: Swiss Euroskepticism

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Thanks for your in depth reasoning to the possibility of my statement not being correct.
Greece could have (with it's own currency ) could have done something similiar to what Iceland did, Devalue it's own currency,which would force wages and prices down, increase exports and decrease imports, let the banks default, and force its bank's foreigner creditors to take a loss, which removed a ton of foreign debt off the books. Maybe not the best solution in Greece's case but they won't know because they lack the flexibilty without having their own currency. The EU is in a scramble now and needs to make some major decisions as to its own viability.
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  #265  
Old 02.02.2011, 16:59
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Re: Swiss Euroskepticism

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Thanks for your in depth reasoning to the possibility of my statement not being correct.
Initially about as much reasoning as you gave.
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  #266  
Old 02.02.2011, 17:00
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Re: Swiss Euroskepticism

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Can I suggest the Rockies? Seriously - I would urge any American of a libertarian slant not to up sticks for Europe, of all places. Move to a less-settled part of the US instead. In practical terms you'll have less government on your back there, as a native, than you will as a foreigner just about anywhere else in the world. Even the Greek scofflawism DB describes is practiced and tolerated by Greeks... not by foreigners in Greece.


Anyway... if you feel God has called you to Switzerland, what are you wasting your time discussing it with us for, eh? Go for it and I'm sure you'll figure out everything you need to know - one way or another.
I truly appreciate your sentiment. This comment has made all the strife in the forum worth it for me. I know European politics aren't up my alley, but currently I believe that God wants me to hit it with full force. I hope to be on the forum another time, but it is time for me to get some sleep.

Danke schone for the encouragement. Hope ya'll have a good day/night (depending on where you are).

Gute Nacht/Guten Tag von Texas.
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  #267  
Old 02.02.2011, 17:01
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Re: Swiss Euroskepticism

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Gute Nacht/Guten Tag von Texas.
Not Oklahoma?
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Old 02.02.2011, 17:05
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Re: Swiss Euroskepticism

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Gute Nacht/Guten Tag von Texas.
Posted at 5pm CET, that'll be 10am in Texas - or Oklahoma. Gueta Morga...
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  #269  
Old 02.02.2011, 17:10
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Re: Swiss Euroskepticism

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You've not been here yet, have you?

Just wait till some Swiss skinhead overhears you talking loudly in a Texan accent on the train, and tell me you'll be ok...
But his name sounds like the mag title of some swiss neonazi party.
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  #270  
Old 02.02.2011, 17:14
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Re: Swiss Euroskepticism

aw.. we was having funz...
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  #271  
Old 02.02.2011, 17:33
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Re: Swiss Euroskepticism

Schweizerblut, as a fellow American who flirted with Libertarianism during my undergrad years (before growing up and entering the real world ) I think I understand where you are coming from... so let me put this in simple terms:

I lived in China in the early 90s. I now live in Switzerland. Guess where I enjoyed more real personal freedom, where 'big brother' social controls intruded less on my daily life?

Hint: Not the land of cheese and chocolate.

Seriously - listen to what the other posters are saying. For some reason the conservative American press seems to have created this fantasy about Switzerland as a libertarian utopia. This could not be farther from the truth. My day-to-day life in Switzerland is subject to social controls that would make a dyed-in-the-wool Pointy Headed Libberull blanch, let alone someone of your political persuasion.

If your primary motivation to move here is political philosophy, you are in for a rather uncomfortable surprise.


Oh, and by the way: as a libertarian who values his religion - did you know that you will pay a Church Tax in Switzerland?




Seriously - stop listening to Fox News. Learn to read the NZZ and the Tagi, and open your mind.
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  #272  
Old 02.02.2011, 18:06
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Re: Swiss Euroskepticism

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As a Swiss native, I totally agree. I do not know every single economical detail about entering the EU, however, like you say about the currency, our currency is one of our roots. It's part of history.

When you see everything that's going on with the UE, it does not seem very friendly.

I think Swiss people like to be discrete but also like when the rest of the world talks about us
I am basically in favour of Switzerland entering the EU, but not now and not when it would mean unacceptable conditions. Conditions for any entry :
- The Bilaterals (the extended ones I mean) really working !
- The tax-authority to stay with the Cantons as now
- The federal structure to survive
- People's right to remain untouched

If this is too much for the EU-gnomes then it is too much. The Bilateral path to further integration however is to be continued in whatever way possible

The Swiss Franc, which has been dancing around and as having become a play-thing of the speculators by its rise has become a threat to the economy. So that this expensive luxury in a few years will be discarded, but again NOT NOW !
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  #273  
Old 02.02.2011, 18:40
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Re: Swiss Euroskepticism

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Greece could have (with it's own currency ) could have done something similiar to what Iceland did, Devalue it's own currency,which would force wages and prices down, increase exports and decrease imports, let the banks default, and force its bank's foreigner creditors to take a loss, which removed a ton of foreign debt off the books. Maybe not the best solution in Greece's case but they won't know because they lack the flexibilty without having their own currency. The EU is in a scramble now and needs to make some major decisions as to its own viability.
The devaluation of a currency inevitably led to inflation. The Turkish Pound for instance in about 1968 was 3 CHF but in the 80ies, 1 CHF equalled more than 30'000 Lira. The Italian Lira which originally was equal to the CHF over the decades tumbled down and in the late 60ies was 100 Lire equalling CHF 0.70 (1 CHF = 140 Lire), but the running inflation in Italy destroyed all advantages the devaluation could have had.

Add to this that the problems of Greece are not currency-related but are a problem of the severe economic mess, which cannot be cured by some monetary cosmetical tricks, but needs to be tackled seriously.

The E.U. now had to make the experience that more means have to be ready for emergency actions. There is not a "EU in a scramble" and not so much a question about "viability" than a question about the community being prepared for a sudden crisis erupting in one of the member states.
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  #274  
Old 02.02.2011, 20:36
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Re: Swiss Euroskepticism

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I truly appreciate your sentiment. This comment has made all the strife in the forum worth it for me. I know European politics aren't up my alley, but currently I believe that God wants me to hit it with full force.
Switzerland really is heaven on earth for base jumpers, especially the Lauterbrunnen valley.
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  #275  
Old 02.02.2011, 21:56
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Re: Swiss Euroskepticism

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Please do not lump us (Ticino) in with the Romands!
Tom
Hey don't knock it.. y'all ticinese over there need the romands to be even heard !!
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  #276  
Old 02.02.2011, 23:05
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Re: Swiss Euroskepticism

And you were with us at the Sonderbund!
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Old 03.02.2011, 01:50
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Re: Swiss Euroskepticism

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Schweizerblut, as a fellow American who flirted with Libertarianism during my undergrad years (before growing up and entering the real world ) I think I understand where you are coming from... so let me put this in simple terms:

I lived in China in the early 90s. I now live in Switzerland. Guess where I enjoyed more real personal freedom, where 'big brother' social controls intruded less on my daily life?

Hint: Not the land of cheese and chocolate.

Seriously - listen to what the other posters are saying. For some reason the conservative American press seems to have created this fantasy about Switzerland as a libertarian utopia. This could not be farther from the truth. My day-to-day life in Switzerland is subject to social controls that would make a dyed-in-the-wool Pointy Headed Libberull blanch, let alone someone of your political persuasion.

If your primary motivation to move here is political philosophy, you are in for a rather uncomfortable surprise.


Oh, and by the way: as a libertarian who values his religion - did you know that you will pay a Church Tax in Switzerland?




Seriously - stop listening to Fox News. Learn to read the NZZ and the Tagi, and open your mind.
I have yet to say that politics was my primary motive for my Swiss aspirations. Nor has Fox News or any other news for that matter played any significant role in my thoughts on Switzerland. Along with having no cable, I get all my information from the internet. This is why I have entered a forum such as this.

Why don't you think that I have been listening? As I have said earlier in this thread, I do not find Switzerland to be some "libertarian paradise". I'm glad China is favorable to you, I'm sure all the Chinese people agree with you .

Also, I'm not sure "flirting" with libertarianism is sufficient to make such outstanding accusations. The word libertarian is very vague, to be honest, and can represent a number of diverse political views.
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  #278  
Old 03.02.2011, 10:10
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I get all my information from the internet.
In that case all of us who live here shall bow to your superior knowledge.

So, tell us what the internets have taught you about Switzerland.
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  #279  
Old 03.02.2011, 18:21
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Re: Swiss Euroskepticism

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I get all my information from the internet.
That's the scariest thing I've ever seen written on the internet.
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