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Old 24.02.2011, 21:46
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Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

Gee... Didn`t see This one coming... Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets

According to the Swiss National Bank "only" SFr 630 Million is left out of SFr5.7 Billion...

So much for the Holy War he promised...
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Old 24.02.2011, 22:30
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Re: Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

I think Alan Sugar's tweet on this is apt:

"Swiss freeze all gaddafi accounts why now ? If they think he's a crook why act now he must have been one before the up rising ?"
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Old 24.02.2011, 22:33
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Re: Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

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I think Alan Sugar's tweet on this is apt:

"Swiss freeze all gaddafi accounts why now ? If they think he's a crook why act now he must have been one before the up rising ?"
Umm, I assume that was a rhetorical question
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Old 24.02.2011, 23:57
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Re: Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

I don't quite think that's a rhetorical question...

Qaddafi has been ruling for 40 years and during all this time, most of the west has had no problem dealing with him, buying his oil, selling him technology... Berlusconi was brown-nosing him a few months ago. His son Hannibal was partying in Geneva until recently.

So now some of his people are demonstrating against him. Nothing has changed 'on paper'. He is still, technically, the President or Chief Camel or whatever he was last month. He has not been charged with any crimes, he is not under arrest, he has not been found guilty by any court. But someone in Switzerland watches the CNN headline news, decides he is going to be gone soon and decides to freeze his assets? What gives??

Don't get me wrong - I'm not defending him or Ben Ali or Mubarak. They are all slime in my books and had it coming to them. I would personally do a lot worse than just freeze their ass(ets). But it bothers me that the west cannot resist playing to the gallery....

The US, the EU, Switzerland - everyone knew where the petro$$ were going and how these regimes repressed their people for decades. Now that the ship is going down, they look just like the proverbial rats...
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Old 25.02.2011, 00:57
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Re: Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

Hmmm, my reply is "what do you expect the West to do? Defend him?" I am sure that the CIA, MI6 and whoever would have loved to take him out years ago. Finally, the people are doing it.

fduvall

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I don't quite think that's a rhetorical question...

Qaddafi has been ruling for 40 years and during all this time, most of the west has had no problem dealing with him, buying his oil, selling him technology... Berlusconi was brown-nosing him a few months ago. His son Hannibal was partying in Geneva until recently.

So now some of his people are demonstrating against him. Nothing has changed 'on paper'. He is still, technically, the President or Chief Camel or whatever he was last month. He has not been charged with any crimes, he is not under arrest, he has not been found guilty by any court. But someone in Switzerland watches the CNN headline news, decides he is going to be gone soon and decides to freeze his assets? What gives??

Don't get me wrong - I'm not defending him or Ben Ali or Mubarak. They are all slime in my books and had it coming to them. I would personally do a lot worse than just freeze their ass(ets). But it bothers me that the west cannot resist playing to the gallery....

The US, the EU, Switzerland - everyone knew where the petro$$ were going and how these regimes repressed their people for decades. Now that the ship is going down, they look just like the proverbial rats...
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Old 25.02.2011, 02:07
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Re: Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

My question is ... why did Switzerland take his money to begin with?

The color of his money should depend on whether the funds are legally and legitimately his - not on the outcome of a confrontation with the mobs in Tripoli.
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Old 25.02.2011, 02:52
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Re: Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

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My question is ... why did Switzerland take his money to begin with?

The color of his money should depend on whether the funds are legally and legitimately his - not on the outcome of a confrontation with the mobs in Tripoli.
Isn't that the problem with a dictator? You do not know where the country ends and the dictator starts. The money belongs to Libya. When the dictator is ousted from office the money are not his salary for a job well done. They are the money belonging to the country and its people.
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Old 25.02.2011, 17:24
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Re: Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

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I don't quite think that's a rhetorical question...

Qaddafi has been ruling for 40 years and during all this time, most of the west has had no problem dealing with him, buying his oil, selling him technology... Berlusconi was brown-nosing him a few months ago. His son Hannibal was partying in Geneva until recently.

So now some of his people are demonstrating against him. Nothing has changed 'on paper'. He is still, technically, the President or Chief Camel or whatever he was last month. He has not been charged with any crimes, he is not under arrest, he has not been found guilty by any court. But someone in Switzerland watches the CNN headline news, decides he is going to be gone soon and decides to freeze his assets? What gives??

Don't get me wrong - I'm not defending him or Ben Ali or Mubarak. They are all slime in my books and had it coming to them. I would personally do a lot worse than just freeze their ass(ets). But it bothers me that the west cannot resist playing to the gallery....

The US, the EU, Switzerland - everyone knew where the petro$$ were going and how these regimes repressed their people for decades. Now that the ship is going down, they look just like the proverbial rats...
I couldn't have agreed more. Governments (US, EMEA) has been turning blind eyes to the repressive acts of "leaders" for years in exchange for profitable business deals.

I find it laughable that "a bunch of crooks can pass judgement on another crook" by proxy mob mentality. If it wasn't for the recent turn of events in Libya, nothing would have change. It would be fun and games, business as usual.
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Old 25.02.2011, 22:59
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Re: Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

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My question is ... why did Switzerland take his money to begin with?

The color of his money should depend on whether the funds are legally and legitimately his - not on the outcome of a confrontation with the mobs in Tripoli.
Two things are to be noted :

* the money was blocked as the Swiss Federal Government feared the Khaddafis would take it and use in their chosen place of asylum

* the money is NOT "taken" but blocked. The money is NOT in the ownership of the Swiss Confederation but just blocked, in order to be demanded back by a Libyan government of the future
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Old 26.02.2011, 21:06
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Re: Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

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...The color of his money should depend on whether the funds are legally and legitimately his...
That is not always easy to determine and often depends upon one's standpoint. The courts are chock-full of such debates that are patently obvious to both sides but totally opposite.
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Old 27.02.2011, 02:32
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Re: Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

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That is not always easy to determine and often depends upon one's standpoint. The courts are chock-full of such debates that are patently obvious to both sides but totally opposite.
If you consider him having been "Revolutionary Leader" for 4 decades, with a wage of (CEO-wise) 1 million US$ and had no private expenses, it means a total of 40 mio. $, and if you imagine that he had a good money manager in charge, this may have risen to some 400 mio $, than THIS amount can be quite legal.
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Old 27.02.2011, 02:56
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Re: Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

it means a total of 40 mio. $, and if you imagine that he had a good money manager in charge, this may have risen to some 400 mio $, than THIS amount can be quite legal.[/QUOTE]

Dear Wolishofer

Please interduce me to such a money manager !!! 40 million into 400 ???
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Old 27.02.2011, 05:17
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Re: Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

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it means a total of 40 mio. $, and if you imagine that he had a good money manager in charge, this may have risen to some 400 mio $, than THIS amount can be quite legal.
Dear Wolishofer

Please interduce me to such a money manager !!! 40 million into 400 ???[/QUOTE]

we speak about FORTY years ! And as soon as you have your first million you cqn contact me and I will find you a good investment manager who will put up your fortune 10times, and I will only charge a modest 3% per year on the gains ! And of course establish a foundation
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Old 27.02.2011, 08:45
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Re: Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

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* the money is NOT "taken" but blocked. The money is NOT in the ownership of the Swiss Confederation but just blocked, in order to be demanded back by a Libyan government of the future
I've actually been wondering what happens with money that is "blocked". Someone will have to legally prove they're entitled to it, right? Or will they eventually just pay out these funds to the respective new governments of the countries in question?
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Old 27.02.2011, 19:50
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Re: Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

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I've actually been wondering what happens with money that is "blocked". Someone will have to legally prove they're entitled to it, right? Or will they eventually just pay out these funds to the respective new governments of the countries in question?
Yes of course, the government of the country where the money came from have to prove their position legally. To give you an example. Years ago, the Marcos clan of the Philippines had lots of money in Switzerland which got frozen on the order of the CH Federal Government. A lawyer in Zurich, Dr. jur. Moritz Leuenberger, got the contract from the new government of the Philippines, and in a complicated legal procedure succeeded to get most of the fortune to be transferred back to the Philippine Republic. The man thereafter first became member of the government of the Canton of Zurich, and after that member of the Federal Government.
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Old 28.02.2011, 10:28
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Re: Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

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I think Alan Sugar's tweet on this is apt:

"Swiss freeze all gaddafi accounts why now ? If they think he's a crook why act now he must have been one before the up rising ?"
I don't know. I guess you have a kind of scale in evilness from amateur dictator up to pure evil, and only in the later case Switzerland would be ready to freeze assets while the dictator is in place.

I know it's kind of cool to bash Switzerland about money practices, but in this case one has to recognize how fast they have reacted (half an hour after Mubarak's fall, I have read somewhere). Switzerland is the obvious country to look for dirty money, sure, but I would be curious to hear if Jersey, Caiman, and other countries have reacted. Even England. Surely some of Gaddhafi's companies have some kind of link with the City in London?

Not to say that I condone the practice of keeping safe crook's money.
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Old 28.02.2011, 13:19
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Re: Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

QUOTE: Hmmm, my reply is "what do you expect the West to do? Defend him?" I am sure that the CIA, MI6 and whoever would have loved to take him out years ago. Finally, the people are doing it.

fduvall


Well said, couldn't have put it better. Pity politicians and world leaders are generally very bad at doing what they are employed to do... represent THE PEOPLE.

The blocking of asset is something CH could do independently of the EU and UN sanctions, but it didn't --> why? because it hadn't yet considered (ie the banks holding these assets) didn't yet consider the source to be illegal.

Last edited by ikeaG; 28.02.2011 at 13:27. Reason: hit save too quickly!!
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Old 28.02.2011, 23:17
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Re: Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

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I've actually been wondering what happens with money that is "blocked". Someone will have to legally prove they're entitled to it, right? Or will they eventually just pay out these funds to the respective new governments of the countries in question?
The irony now is that according to some news I read Mr. Gadaffi has no money in Switzerland.
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Old 28.02.2011, 23:25
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Re: Switzerland Freezes Gaddafi Assets....

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The irony now is that according to some news I read Mr. Gadaffi has no money in Switzerland.
part of it is probably in the u.s jurisdication.
http://blogs.wsj.com/corruption-curr...ogle_news_blog
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