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  #121  
Old 08.08.2011, 19:31
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

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Well they're MORE fed up now...LOL
Daily Mail rattles stick across bars of cage of monkeys.

Monkeys leap about and scream.

Daily Mail reports that monkeys are leaping about and screaming.

Anyway, I still don't get what any of this has to do with cantonal voting rights in Switzerland?
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  #122  
Old 08.08.2011, 19:32
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

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Regarding the opinions that you should get the Swiss pass if you wanna vote. I would argue this degrades the pass.
How so?

That was one of the main reasons I got mine!

(In particular, so I could do my part to keep Switzerland out of the EU!)

Tom
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  #123  
Old 08.08.2011, 19:34
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

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Well they're MORE fed up now...LOL
No that's not true. They were better fed when they got free milk in school
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  #124  
Old 08.08.2011, 19:34
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

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Sounds fishy to me...
Why's that?

EU-Bürgerinnen und Bürger erwerben – gemessen an ihrer Bevölkerungszahl im Kanton Zürich – eher selten den Schweizer Pass. Für sie ist der Nutzen einer Einbürgerung weniger gross als für andere. Ein weiterer Grund ist, dass einige EU-Länder kein Doppelbürgerrecht zulassen. Häufig lassen sich hingegen etwa Personen aus Sri Lanka oder aus dem Balkan einbürgern, «da sie mit dem Erwerb des Schweizer Passes gesellschaftlich und rechtlich besser gestellt sind und sie meist keine Rückkehr ins Heimatland planen», wie es in der Mitteilung weiter heisst.

http://www.tagesanzeiger.ch/zuerich/...story/30370814

EU citizens get the Swiss pass more scarcely. The use of citizenship is for them less than for others. Another reason is that many EU countries don't allow dual citizenships. On the other hand people from Sri Lanka and the Balkans often gain citizenship, <<as they are socially and legally better off with a Swiss pass and often don't plan to return to their land of origin>>

As I said many, if not most get it cause it benefits them rather than out of national pride. I'll follow the trend should I need its benefits. Nothing fishy about that at all, rather it's normal.

And speaking of the Daily Mail. I found this just now: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-14442203

In its coverage, the Daily Mail quoted one tweeter, AshleysAR as follows: "Ashley AR' tweeted: 'I hear Tottenham's going coco-bananas right now. Watch me roll."

However, AshleysAR's full, unedited quote on Twitter reads: "I hear Tottenham's going coco-bananas right now. Watch me roll up with a spud gun :|".

Suddenly the tone of the message becomes markedly less sinister. Ashley later threatens to join in with a water pistol.
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  #125  
Old 08.08.2011, 19:35
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

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One of them looks like a drag-queen...
Agreed.

Tom
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  #126  
Old 08.08.2011, 19:37
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

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How so?

That was one of the main reasons I got mine!

(In particular, so I could do my part to keep Switzerland out of the EU!)

Tom
What are you going to do? try and join it to the US? ( really should not have suggested that. US in shit CH doing fine .. Error)
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  #127  
Old 08.08.2011, 19:38
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

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Another reason is that many EU countries don't allow dual citizenships.
So, who needs dual citizenship anyway?

Tom
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  #128  
Old 08.08.2011, 19:46
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

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Why's that?

EU-Bürgerinnen und Bürger erwerben – gemessen an ihrer Bevölkerungszahl im Kanton Zürich – eher selten den Schweizer Pass. Für sie ist der Nutzen einer Einbürgerung weniger gross als für andere. Ein weiterer Grund ist, dass einige EU-Länder kein Doppelbürgerrecht zulassen. Häufig lassen sich hingegen etwa Personen aus Sri Lanka oder aus dem Balkan einbürgern, «da sie mit dem Erwerb des Schweizer Passes gesellschaftlich und rechtlich besser gestellt sind und sie meist keine Rückkehr ins Heimatland planen», wie es in der Mitteilung weiter heisst.

http://www.tagesanzeiger.ch/zuerich/...story/30370814

EU citizens get the Swiss pass more scarcely. The use of citizenship is for them less than for others. Another reason is that many EU countries don't allow dual citizenships. On the other hand people from Sri Lanka and the Balkans often gain citizenship, <<as they are socially and legally better off with a Swiss pass and often don't plan to return to their land of origin>>

As I said many, if not most get it cause it benefits them rather than out of national pride. I'll follow the trend should I need its benefits. Nothing fishy about that at all, rather it's normal.

And speaking of the Daily Mail. I found this just now: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-14442203

In its coverage, the Daily Mail quoted one tweeter, AshleysAR as follows: "Ashley AR' tweeted: 'I hear Tottenham's going coco-bananas right now. Watch me roll."

However, AshleysAR's full, unedited quote on Twitter reads: "I hear Tottenham's going coco-bananas right now. Watch me roll up with a spud gun :|".

Suddenly the tone of the message becomes markedly less sinister. Ashley later threatens to join in with a water pistol.
yes, but it will surly benefit you having it, yes? Or your country of origin doesn't allow two passports? I mean, whats "really" stopping you? And all your other gibberish is just that...what's up?
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  #129  
Old 08.08.2011, 19:46
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

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How so?

That was one of the main reasons I got mine!

(In particular, so I could do my part to keep Switzerland out of the EU!)

Tom
I was mostly being argumentative with that point but still, in my opinion, in a perfect world one gains citizenship due to them identifying with the country and its people. As I wrote above many, probably most acquire the pass due to certain benefits it gives rather than this sense of National identity. I feel this degrades the pass. Rather than being a nation of proud citizens, there are many that couldn't give a damn about the country but are happy it's easier travel for them.

So in turn if a guy just gets the pass so that he's able to try and prevent a motorway getting built by his house, I feel this degrades it because he doesn't get it out of national pride rather out of personal motivations.
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  #130  
Old 08.08.2011, 19:49
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

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yes, but it will surly benefit you having it, yes? Or your country of origin doesn't allow two passports? I mean, whats "really" stopping you? And all your other gibberish is just that...what's up?
Already have 2 passports, could add a third in a few years.

Paying around 2500 fr. plus military tax for the right to vote? Don't really see the benefit there
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  #131  
Old 08.08.2011, 19:51
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

Ah, but to me, this is home!

(it really is)

However, I live in Ticino, so YMMV.

Tom

P.S. Also, I felt it important for all family members to have at least one nationality in common.

(wife and stepsons Swiss/Canadian, me US, daughters all three)
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  #132  
Old 08.08.2011, 19:54
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

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yes, but it will surly benefit you having it, yes? Or your country of origin doesn't allow two passports? I mean, whats "really" stopping you? And all your other gibberish is just that...what's up?
Not everyone wants to become a citizen of the nation in which he resides.

I had no interest in acquiring Swiss nationality before I married and the possibility of having not-really-English-not-really-American-born-in-Switzerland-don't-know-where-they-belong children became a reality.

I certainly don't need it for myself, but I'd do it for them.
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  #133  
Old 08.08.2011, 19:55
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

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Ah, but to me, this is home!

(it really is)

However, I live in Ticino, so YMMV.

Tom

P.S. Also, I felt it important for all family members to have at least one nationality in common.
fair enough then. I wasn't talking about you
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  #134  
Old 08.08.2011, 19:55
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

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Already have 2 passports, could add a third in a few years.

Paying around 2500 fr. plus military tax for the right to vote? Don't really see the benefit there
It was 300, not 2500.

Tom
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  #135  
Old 08.08.2011, 19:58
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

That's cause you married a Swiss woman and get the simplified option. I need to do the complicated one which costs around that

Edit: I had a quick look at my village. It would cost Fr 1800 still cheaper but still too much for basically no real benefit
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  #136  
Old 08.08.2011, 19:59
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

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Not everyone wants to become a citizen of the nation in which he resides.

I had no interest in acquiring Swiss nationality before I married and the possibility of having not-really-English-not-really-American-born-in-Switzerland-don't-know-where-they-belong children became a reality.

I certainly don't need it for myself, but I'd do it for them.
And that is also the only reason I would do it.
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  #137  
Old 08.08.2011, 20:09
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

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It "used" to be that way with immigrants...but now host countries are feeling the crunch. It seems they're coming more to take than to give. There was a time when immigrants came to a country and wanted to really integrate and think of themselves as part of that country. Now it's all about handouts in many situations...it's not working anylonger and unfortunately or fortunately countries are starting to clamp down. They just can't take the load anymore. Especially with so many living off of the system..
-
Foreigners take care of you when you are in hospital. It otherwise would be "self-service" . Foreigners collect the waste. As otherwise it only would be done once per year. Foreigners sit at the cashiers desks in the shops. "Clamp down" sounds dramatic. What about simply saying that "North-of-the-Alps European countries" are placing limitations, are restricting immigration, NOT because the immigrants want to "take" something but because infrastructural problems.

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Regardless, people of host countries are getting fed up with immigrants and footing the bill for them. Who cares about eating out at the restaurants? Where does that come in. Many of you forget that what worked before, doesn't necessarily work now. People have to start developing their own countries. Then those from the developed countries can start going over there...LOL. Actually many of the countries that the immigrants come from are not that easy to immigrate to. They allow few foreigners for immigration. I think Japan has it about right..
-
WHAT bills have the "host countries" to foot for them ?

No, people do NOT have to start developing their own countries, as they long ago have started to do so. The major problem of most of the "sending" countries is a too high population growth. So that this in many places has eaten up the relatively high development rates. Just to take the example of Egypt which in 1965 was at 17 mio people and now is at around 75, plus more than 10 mio. Egyptians in Europe.

You may however give a look to places in Switzerland, where not immigrants from "developing countries" or South European countries are the problem but "upper-class immigrants" whose immigrations has lead to an explosion of real-estate prices and to things like in Zug, where locals have to leave their town as everything is full of rich expats
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  #138  
Old 08.08.2011, 20:14
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

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You may however give a look to places in Switzerland, where not immigrants from "developing countries" or South European countries are the problem but "upper-class immigrants" whose immigrations has lead to an explosion of real-estate prices and to things like in Zug, where locals have to leave their town as everything is full of rich expats
Fortunately, not many of them around here (so far), unless you count Russians.

Tom
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  #139  
Old 08.08.2011, 20:28
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

Hi,

Doing a Google for the story about the girl being threatened in the retail store brings up an entry in the Daily Mail and this post. Where do you get your information from? Note that murder remains an extremely serious matter in the UK - honour killing or not.

The bit about Sharia Law taking over is a bit far fetched too. There are some "sharia courts" which operate under 100 year old arbitration legislation in much the same way as the Jewish Beth Din courts - which have been around for a long time. These are used to arbitrate in civil disputes plus cases like divorce. Reading around the subject, English or Scots law can still override the decisions of such courts. There are still issues regarding Sharia courts being biased against women for example - which will have to be ironed out over time I guess. They certainly aren't allowed to sentence people to being stoned to death or having their hands chopped off!

As an Englishman I am rather proud of the fact that my native country embraces such a mix of races, cultures and beliefs and that discrimination is considered to be unacceptable. The place might be going down the toilet but that has little to do with immigration in my opinion.

Cheers,
Nick

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They're enforcing their "own laws" within their communities and there are many cases of "honor killings" by some. And the British authorities are doing nothing about it. They're killing women for being too westernized. There's also a section enforcing Sharai law and one girl was threatened working in a retail store, a British store, if she didn't cover her face. She was very afraid and the authorities did nothing.
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  #140  
Old 08.08.2011, 20:55
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Re: Foreigner voting rights proposed in Zurich

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One of them looks like a drag-queen..but anyways. It doesn't matter where they come from whether Arab etc..IMHO, the British people are getting fed-up. And it's not just the Daily-Mail stating this. It's nothing wrong with acknowledging that and accepting that times change, countries are going broke and they can't take the load any longer.
as an old warmongering colonial power (as e.g. UK), you can not just run around the world doing your war-mongering and expect no impact / re-action...

Same in the modern world...everything is a balance (e.g. Switzerland has no issues hosting billions of dollars from African and Middle east dictators, but don't want the people escaping the dictators...mmm...yes)

if there are rich countries there must be poor countries...i.e. the first world is rich of the cost of the 3rd world countries being poor, this means that people from the poorer countries are seeking a better situation, so we have to accept this, like it or not, very simple...even for you to understand...welcome to capitalism and SUCK IT UP!!!
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