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  #841  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:03
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Re: Masseneinwanderung Stoppen [initiative to limit immigration]

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1980: 6.31 millions
1990: 6.71 millions
2000: 7.18 millions
2010: 7.82 millions
2013: 8 millions
Well, he is born yesterday
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  #842  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:03
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Re: results on 9 Feb 14

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No, visas wont be needed for tourist or business travel since Schengen very much remains in place for now.

I guess for a lot of people who voted yes to this initiative, it meant "taking back control of the Swiss borders".
I think this will put Switzerland's place in Schengen at risk as part of this treaty is the free movement of labour.
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  #843  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:03
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Re: Masseneinwanderung Stoppen [initiative to limit immigration]

But YOU ARE AN IMMIGRANT OLIVER, are you not? Now, of course although one side of my family were Huguenots from France- that was a long time ago. And the other side of my family is as pure Swiss as can be ... why should that prevent me from feeling empathy? In the 20s and 30s, 1000000s of Swiss emigrated for economic reasons, many relatives of mine, uncles and aunts, now 5th generation all over the US, Canada and Australia. I'd expect you to think about the consequences of such a vote on many of the Swiss industries relying heavily on exports to Europe, actually.

Why can't I feel and think at the same time??? My region depends heavily on exports to Europe- and it is hard enough with the high CHF!!! How can angering Europe, and ligning up with Marine Lepen, help combat frontalier salary dumping (which IS a reality)?

I am Swiss, born an bred, and I can vote. OH is British and naturalised Swiss- he voted too. Two big fat NOs- with the heart- but also with our heads firmly screwed on, thanks. (makes no difference to us as such, we are both retired).

Last edited by Odile; 09.02.2014 at 21:37.
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  #844  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:06
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Re: results on 9 Feb 14

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I think this will put Switzerland's place in Schengen at risk as part of this treaty is the free movement of labour.
No, Schengen has nothing to do with free movement and the bilaterals.
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  #845  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:06
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Re: Masseneinwanderung Stoppen [initiative to limit immigration]

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I remember the pre bilateral days- when to go and work in UK I had to have a work permit, proving that I was 'essential' for the UK business that could not get a Brit to do the job (translating/PA)- without the right contacts, NOT A CHANCE. Is that what the Swiss want to go back to- being shut out of Europe? And exports, already limited due to high CHF- further limited due to full or partial boycott, official or otherwise???
Well I got a B permit in CH in 1994, i did not even have a degree however no Swiss person either could do or want my Job for 6,500 x 13 months salary. Seemed like a no brainier to me at there was a big recession in the Uk & I was self employed.

It was never that difficult.......on paper yes but not not in reality.
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  #846  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:07
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Re: Masseneinwanderung Stoppen [initiative to limit immigration]

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Perhaps we are more in touch with our friends, co-workers, and neighbors (i.e., more integrated)?

Clearly, we voted with the vast majority of such, 68+%.

Of course, my wife isn't a real Ticinese, her father was Swiss German and was born and spent the first eight years of his life in Zug (long before the expat explosion).

And, while she personally knew Nano Bignasca, and despised him on a personal level, she agrees that he had a point.

Lastly, I know relatives of my wife who for 40 years have been frontaliers, and complain about the same issues as I do (i.e. the absurd increase in traffic in the past 10 years or so).

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  #847  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:07
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Re: Masseneinwanderung Stoppen [initiative to limit immigration]

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And what happens if Germany or France starts putting quotas on the number of Swiss living there?
http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/politics...l?cid=35214184

"More than 700,000 Swiss citizens live outside the country's borders, making up about ten per cent of the total population. Most expats reside in neighbouring European countries."

http://www.eda.admin.ch/etc/medialib...and%202001.pdf

http://www.eda.admin.ch/etc/medialib...rstatistik.pdf

According to the statitics of swiss citizens abroad in the links provided above, in 2001 before the free movement of people was introduced there were already 352739 swiss citizens living in the EU of which 253936 held dual nationality. And the figure of swiss abroad in the EU in 2013, stands at 438074. Doesn't seem like too many swiss have moved abroad since the free movement of people as oppose to the influx of EU citizens.
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  #848  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:11
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Re: results on 9 Feb 14

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No, Schengen has nothing to do with free movement and the bilaterals.
As I understand it the Amsterdam Treaty integrated Schengen with European Law on freedom of movement and Switzerland is signed up to the same rules on freedom of movement of labour.
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  #849  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:12
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Re: Masseneinwanderung Stoppen [initiative to limit immigration]

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the best Solution for everyone here is to buy your partner some exclusive jewellery
I'm assisting my wife in buying a new car (that she'll pay for), does that count?

Tom
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  #850  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:16
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Re: Masseneinwanderung Stoppen [initiative to limit immigration]

Yea the SVP did go into overpopulation in enough detail for the Bundesamt for Statistics to almost accuse them of lying - whatever - the barbarians are at the gate. Hopefully the cool heads can recover the status quo before unilateral steps are taken by either side.
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  #851  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:16
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Re: results on 9 Feb 14

This is a victory for the far right in Switzerland and it will mark the start of a campaign with increasing restrictive policies on all non-Swiss.

I quote "According to Christoph Blocher, the chief ideologist and vice chair of the SVP, Switzerland would be better off without the large foreign population of 23 percent."

This is a small step forward for a far more extreme agenda....lets not forget where parties like these left Europe 70 years ago. They hide under "popular" policies but their real agenda is far more extreme.

The EU needs to get very tough now...we cannot allow the far-right to rise again and implement their sick "pure" view of the world.

I personally love living in Switzerland, the people are nice but we cannot forget that a proportion are deeply nationalist and racist and their agenda needs to be stopped.
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  #852  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:23
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Re: results on 9 Feb 14

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This is a victory for the far right in Switzerland and it will mark the start of a campaign with increasing restrictive policies on all non-Swiss.

I quote "According to Christoph Blocher, the chief ideologist and vice chair of the SVP, Switzerland would be better off without the large foreign population of 23 percent."

This is a small step forward for a far more extreme agenda....lets not forget where parties like these left Europe 70 years ago. They hide under "popular" policies but their real agenda is far more extreme.

The EU needs to get very tough now...we cannot allow the far-right to rise again and implement their sick "pure" view of the world.

I personally love living in Switzerland, the people are nice but we cannot forget that a proportion are deeply nationalist and racist and their agenda needs to be stopped.
You'll get drowned in groans, but i see your point and agree with you.
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  #853  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:24
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Re: Masseneinwanderung Stoppen [initiative to limit immigration]

And the global population growth is relevant to the size of a single country because....?
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  #854  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:24
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Re: results on 9 Feb 14

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maybe a stupid observation, but the initiative just calls for quotas...couldnt the government just place extremely high quotas that have no chance of being filled?
Yes, that's what I was thinking too kiwiguy08. Just set the limits as the numbers are now and they've satisfied the requirements of the initiative.
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  #855  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:27
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Re: results on 9 Feb 14

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Yes, that's what I was thinking too kiwiguy08. Just set the limits as the numbers are now and they've satisfied the requirements of the initiative.
Do the government have the courage to do that though?
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  #856  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:35
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Re: results on 9 Feb 14

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Do the government have the courage to do that though?
You mean act as though the people that voted in favour were idiots and should be ignored?

That's hardly likely. If they were to do that their chances of being re-elected would be fairly small wouldn't you say? The whole thing about direct democracy is that the voters have various tools at their disposal with which to rein back in a government that is not doing what the voters want it to do.

And that is pretty much what happened here and why this vote actually took place. Had the government had the courage to handle the concerns that were being voiced some time ago already we probably wouldn't have come to this. But they didn't. They lacked direction and appeared unable to take any measures to alleviate the concerns of a large part of the population. Today they have been advised that this wasn't good enough.

I, personally, think that this was not a good day for Switzerland and the government are chumps for having let this happen. But I respect the fact that many think differently and together we are going to have to make the best of the situation.
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  #857  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:36
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Re: Masseneinwanderung Stoppen [initiative to limit immigration]

A Swiss-French Facebook friend has said February 9th should become the national day of inbreeding I never realized Swiss people had a sense of humor

Original text '.Le 9 février devrait devenir le jour national de la CONSANGUINITÉ...'
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  #858  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:36
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Re: results on 9 Feb 14

And btw that would still violate the bilateral and lead to renegotiation
And as we all know EU has no other things our politicians and technocrats should be busying themselves with at the moment. D-oh
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  #859  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:37
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Re: Masseneinwanderung Stoppen [initiative to limit immigration]

I believe the opposite, the YES voters voted with emotions, but it doesn't makes it wrong…it is usually the case when it comes to voting…we are all humans after all…but as an objective foreigner I'm rather in to facts, credible solutions etc...
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  #860  
Old 09.02.2014, 21:37
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Re: results on 9 Feb 14

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That's correct. And you'll have to strip naked with "I'm a Swiss sinner" tattooed across your butt in order to comply.
What the hell you are talking ? Who ever told you i am Swiss !!!

I am really against this law but i think it is nice if they apply it only for special people such as the Assassin once, i think then we will live more in peace
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