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  #21  
Old 01.10.2011, 13:33
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Re: Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?

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You are much closer to the truth for Switzerland than you'd ever know! We lost all our ground attack experts when the Hunter was retired at the end of 1994 and then our reconnaisance squadron flying the Mirage IIIRS was disbanded after 2003. The UAVs and Super Puma/Cougar helicopters will never be able to match the insight we had with the recon Mirages with their sensors and infra-red radars (FLIR).

These days our Hornets have no specific air to ground weapons except for the on board cannon. Bombs and rockets disappeared in the mid 1990s when the Hunter was retired. Of course, the wiring and pylons are all available, but the doctrine is air-to-air these days.
True indeed. The plane for the Swiss airforce of course would be
THIS
An A-10 Thunderbolt II firing an AGM-65

or THIS :

Dassault Rafale B Paris Air Show 2007
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  #22  
Old 01.10.2011, 13:45
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Re: Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?

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The question is "Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?"

Any skilled air force would destroy our glorious self defence air force within 4 hours. So why buy new toys? The US tactics have been to wipe out the fighter planes' airfields with cruise missiles. This worked very well in Iraq and Libya, and no reason why it shouldn't work in the cantons of Bern, Wallis & Aargau.

The answer is a definite, resounding, unequivocal, NO!
Payerne is in Canton Vaud.
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  #23  
Old 01.10.2011, 13:47
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Re: Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?

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This to me sounds naive. We are surrounded by friends? Projecting distructive military power over long distances has been possible for a long time thus could also hit Switzerland. Besides, being friends also means being there for one another if/when the shit hits the fan. If there's no reciprocity, then isn't Switzerland a parasite?
You mean like the Irish republic?
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  #24  
Old 01.10.2011, 13:50
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Re: Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?

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I just recall the old statement, "An ounce of prevention saves a pound of cure..." Its best to have a strong, modern, and professional force in place as a deterrent to anything happening, better to have any force in place than nothing, and really bad to be totally, sitting-on-your-hands-unprepared when some crackpot idiot of a dictator or terror-monger throws the poop at the fan...
Do you advocate retaining the right to keep guns at home?
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Old 01.10.2011, 13:51
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Re: Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?

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Plus, drop these capabilities now... and it will be very difficult to build up again in the future.
Aah but are the capabilities what is required in a modern defense scenario?

Maybe we need to invest the 5 billion or so in what we really need.....can't we have that debate?
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  #26  
Old 01.10.2011, 14:08
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Re: Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?

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Any skilled air force would destroy our glorious self defence air force within 4 minutes.
Fixed that for you
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  #27  
Old 01.10.2011, 14:13
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Re: Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?

Q. does switzerland need new fighter jets?
A. no they don't. they should just make do and mend.
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  #28  
Old 01.10.2011, 15:09
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Q. does switzerland need new fighter jets?
A. no they don't. they should just make do and mend.
Mend what?

Some of the hornets have over 1,000,000 hours the last time I heard. There's no "mending" that, it's actually cheap to buy a new one; if of course you expect them to stay in the air while they pull their pretty circles over the international summits.

It's either buy new, or abandon the air force as a whole.
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  #29  
Old 01.10.2011, 15:16
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Re: Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?

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Aah but are the capabilities what is required in a modern defense scenario?

Maybe we need to invest the 5 billion or so in what we really need.....can't we have that debate?
Isn't that what this is?
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  #30  
Old 01.10.2011, 15:18
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Re: Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?

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I believe Switzerland could join NATO, then all these countries below would be our friends. We could send some infantry to help them out with spring cleaning their barracks,

OMG, Austria is not a member! Better keep the air force, don't trust those dodgy ex-imperialists!
Fact is Switzerland is not a member of NATO and I will gladly bet a months salary that Switzerland will not be a member of NATO within the next 10 years.
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  #31  
Old 01.10.2011, 15:20
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Re: Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?

[QUOTE=Wollishofener;1359710]The replacement IS needed indeed. Whether really now or later is something I leave to REAL experts. It would be good if it went through without a public vote. IF a vote comes about and people say NO against the new fighters, I later on will vote consequently for an abolishment of the armed forces, as I do not believe that this country needs an oversized CH variant of the carabinieri

************************************************

I like that bit about REAL EXPERTS, we now know just what for a gang Maurer had as advisors. Please,please, let there be a referendum. And one more thing - the SVP won't be getting my vote in the upcoming elections. Bloody philistines.
-
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  #32  
Old 01.10.2011, 15:35
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Re: Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?

Any former military guys/gals here?

I could imagine that strictly militarily it is absolutely necessary for Switzerland to have an air force. Switzerland (being the small country it is) has no strategic depth to absorb an attack, therefore must have capability to strike first and project power beyond its borders.

Of course, this is not necessary if:
a) the swiss don't mind being attacked
b) the swiss believe that the world is full of friendly people who will never disagree with and do harm to others

Aside from this, what if Swiss interests are at stake far beyond its borders? Will you call the Germans and ask them to please lend you some aircraft?
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  #33  
Old 01.10.2011, 15:42
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Re: Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?

can someone enlighten me as to some of the scenarios that the swiss air force are supposed to get involved in?
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  #34  
Old 01.10.2011, 15:45
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Re: Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?

South Africa bought 26 SAAB Gripen.Could be a good
option?
You have to have something to defend all the Swiss money.

http://www.saairforce.co.za/the-airf...ft/20/gripen-c
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  #35  
Old 01.10.2011, 15:54
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Re: Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?

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Some of the hornets have over 1,000,000 hours the last time I heard.

Have they, indeed?


Personally, I find it ever-so-slightly improbable that even the Swiss air force could manage to keep an F18 in the air non-stop since before the Wright Brothers made their famous flight...

Just sayin...
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  #36  
Old 01.10.2011, 16:50
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Re: Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?

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Right you are. In the last vote about abolishing the armed forces, all people born after 1952 voted in favour of dropping the stuff totally.
I certainly did not and I was born long after 1952...

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And the YES votes were around 48%
They were actually 35.6%

Wishful thinking?
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  #37  
Old 01.10.2011, 17:12
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Re: Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?

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can someone enlighten me as to some of the scenarios that the swiss air force are supposed to get involved in?
nobody can think of a single use for these things? guess they probably don't need new ones after all then
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  #38  
Old 01.10.2011, 17:15
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Have they, indeed?


Personally, I find it ever-so-slightly improbable that even the Swiss air force could manage to keep an F18 in the air non-stop since before the Wright Brothers made their famous flight...

Just sayin...
Well that just looks ridiculous... I meant 10,000, but that's actually low - it's apparently 50,000 as of 2008.
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  #39  
Old 01.10.2011, 17:19
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Re: Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?

I'm new to this site, and I can't figure out how to start a new thread. A little help here? Seems like this should be rather obvious, but alas, I'm missing it. Thanks, and sorry for the non sequitur here.
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  #40  
Old 01.10.2011, 17:24
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Re: Does Switzerland need new fighter jets?

Does Switzerland need new fighter jets ?

Unfortunately my crystal ball is not working at the moment, so I don't know.
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